To ask what is so great about the uni experience

[MarquessofPembroke]

That I keep hearing mention of on MN.

I'm not talking about the skills gained from studying for a degree but the "uni experience."

And what happens to the 50% of school leavers who don't experience uni.

Meh. I graduated in 2017. I have £65k of debt to it (BA and MA). I just see it as a tax. Doesn't really affect me. Interest means my debt has gone up rather than down while I've been paying it. I doubt I'll pay it back.

It's a tax not a loan now

Agree that it really expanded my horizons and gave me the chance to meet people all over the place. I'd had a difficult time at secondary school and found life after university back at home very isolating so I'm grateful for it. For someone like me who doesn't have great social skills this made a huge difference.

I don't know how I feel about people going to university for "the experience" in general to be honest. There seem to be lots of good alternatives education wise but not so many social wise.

I’m sure many do very well without university.

I went to a red brick very good uni 25 years ago to do a degree that led to a good job. It was in a major city. It was worth it for the qualification but I hated the ‘uni experience.’ I didn’t meet anyone really like me, lived in horrendously expensive cockroach infected inner city accommodation, the next year moved in with a group of girls who had all previously got on but then proceeded to cat fight for the whole year (after trying to mediate for a bit I gave up). I’m not in touch with any now. It was ‘fun’ to drink crap drinks out of plastic cups all night then vomit in the bins in the halls of residence and leave them out for the cleaner to sort the next morning. Even then, at 18 it wasn’t my idea of a good time.

the ‘time of my life’ came after when I got a good job post graduation that I enjoyed in another city, got paid a good salary and could afford a nice life (house, holidays, social life, etc.) For that, uni was worth it and of course the experience part of life’s rich tapestry, but no other highlight!

The uni experience was one of the most important things in my life.

I moved away to a new city. Had to live in halls with lots of people from a wide range of backgrounds. Lots of social opportunities and life skills learned. It was a good started in budgeting/paying bills but in a protected environment.

I had lots of free time so time to spend with friends, boyfriends, holidays.

I had to learn some responsibilities but had a good safety net.

It was the best route from a horrid childhood to functioning adulthood.

Its extremely important to me that my DCs get to do the living away at uni thing.

Mixed bag for me. Met a few people I got on with, enjoyed the rave scene at the time (early 90s) in a uni city famous for its rave culture. Absolutely hated living in shitty accommodation with other people though... Beyond hated it. I lived with 6 other girls in second year, all awful people who I didn't fit in with (since find out I have ADHD and they were horrible to me ). No longer have contact with any of them.

My favourite times were 6th form college as hated school and after uni, getting a job, buying my own flat, freedom, independence. And now actually, late 40s know who I am and am no longer scared of not having friends and being disliked due to being "weird" and have more friends now that I've ever had. All neurodivergent and lovely. Kids are teenagers so getting a bit of freedom back again. I think the uni "experience" is hugely overrated and a lot of young people are lonely and skint. I'd be happy for my 2 to stay at home and go to a local uni/commute (there are 4 in the city we live in and about 7 within an hour's commute) to get a degree. If that's what they want to do. DS in particular will struggle to house share.

For me university was an opportunity to escape my very traditional inward looking rural community and become 'normal' after being the weird swot at school. To mix with other young people with similar interests and aspirations and not have to hide how smart I am was transformative for me. I got the opportunity to do a year in industry which I loved and then did a PhD and postdoc before getting a permanent job so I lived in 4 different cities during my 20s attending various prestigious academic institutes. I loved my university years, in many ways they were the happiest years of my life. My grandfather had a different experience though when he went back in the 1920s and felt very guilty that he was up at the university at his parent's expense. So money worries clearly make a difference.

I do think living away from home is an important part of 'the university experience' wherever you grew up, during my PhD those who were living away from home for the first time had a kind of cluelessness that those of us who had left home as undergraduates didn't have any more.

@IDontWantToBeAPie but a lifetime tax almost. Why would you want to pay so much tax for something that doesn't really buy you back a lot of value anymore unless you're really in a specific job that needs it.

Nowhere near the value a degree held 20 years ago. It's such a shame what's happened to the job market. When I graduated there really was a choice of university or no university for many more job openings. Makes me sad when I see the junior roles in my company which once just needed half a brain now require a degree and pay even less than when I started!

I think university is only worthwhile if your doing a degree that is going to get you a relevant job at the end. The cost these days means it isn’t worth it just for the uni experience.

I think telling your dc at 18 that something 'isn't worth it' is defeatist.

I was wondering this this weekend.

I think it's just a really instant way to become independent in a slightly safer and more structured space than being completely alone.

It's a way of being in a community of like-minded, similarly-aged but also regionally and socially diverse people.

All of this takes place where there is for the first time a shift from learning by rote in a classroom to more self-directed learning.

It's not financially as rewarding as working, as you're essentially borrowing from your future salary to pay for your own learning. But it's an investment in your own future skills and earning capacity.

To me it's a no-brainer unless you aren't going to come out with the qualifications at the end.

It’s realistic. 70k of debt is only worth it if there are real career prospects at the end. Encouraging 18 year olds to carefully consider their options and career plans is just sensible in my opinion.

I do agree that just moving out forces you to do that bit of growing up but often with uni it is moving to a different city as well - often when you just move out you are more likely to stay in your home town or city.

So you get to move to a new town or city but are more likely to be doing so with a little more support of parents (obviously not the same for everyone just more likely)

If you are asking in general, yeah ask away, but if your asking because you're thinking about your own children going then it's probably better you ask younger people.
Whilst uni life is pretty similar in terms of socialising etc I think student nowadays don't expect to be broke which is a bonding experience in itself. I find it surprising that students eg have 'food cards' paid for by their parents and they're spending £5 on a lunch and maybe another fiver on coffee/smoothy....everyday. Students used to put in far more hours and work too. I think I'd quite like to go off somewhere and have someone else pay for my accommodation. I would imagine if you were a self funding student on a budget life could be very different. Your peers might not want to go to Weds student night where beer is £2/pint

I feel so different to this. My school hadn't a clue when it came to uni applications and not one of my cohort got into any universities. And we weren't aiming high. I have done well in my career and had a really fun and varied life with it, including living and working abroad and lots of work related travel. I own a lovely home and will move to France in around 3 years time. Blah blah all so nice etc

BUT... I'm currently going round offer days with my daughter (and I have a son at Sheffield Uni on 1st year). We've been to Sheffield, UEA and Sussex and have Exeter and York to come. I'm loving it but I have such extreme pangs of jealousy. I was clever enough to have gone, I did 4 A'Levels and got good grades. We were at UEA last week and I was almost in tears thinking about what it would have been like to have gone there, lived there (my DD hated Norfolk/Suffolk terrace but I would have been in those brutalist beauties like a shot) and just had that experience of finding a tribe, living away from home with so many young people. Just having fun with few responsibilities and studying something I loved. I'll never have that and it makes me so sad. Instead I left home at 18 and lived with a boyfriend and never really, truly found who I was and what I really liked until my mid to late twenties.

Aside from my dad who went to art college, my kids will be the first to go to university as my neither my husband, mum, FIL and MIL went there either. It's a huge deal for me and I'm ridiculously proud of them. I hope they have the time of their lives.

It's a huge deal for me and I'm ridiculously proud of them. I hope they have the time of their lives

What a lovely thing to say. Good luck to them.

Y'know, I was the first to go to uni from any of my extended family (on both sides). My parents never quite 'got' why it was that I wanted to go, when they hadn't. So reading this lovely post made me tear up a little; good for you, @DailyMaui, and good for your DC who are fortunate to have you.

I see it in the younger people I work with - the ones who went to uni are generally more confident talking to clients and handling things themselves at 22 than the ones still living at home at 25. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it's very noticeable.

Obviously that's a tiny sample size and it depends on personality too, but I think it encourages self-sufficiency. Obviously just moving out at 18 would do much the same but I think that's a lot rarer if they're not going to uni.

The repayments are exactly the same regardless of the amount taken out in loans. It’s calculated in relation to earnings not the amount “borrowed”. The loans should never be the deciding factor in a kid’s decision making process - and as parents it’s our duty to explain exactly how the finance works to reassure them that it will not be done kind of burden hanging over them for life

We’ll have to agree to disagree on this. If ( for example ) my dc wanted to be an engineer and there was the option of the traditional university route - with say 60k of debt or a degree apprenticeship, with zero debt and also earning money along the way, the sensible option would of course be the apprenticeship. If my dcs intend to pursue a career that can only be achieved via the traditional uni route , then of course I wouldn’t deter them by speaking negatively of student loans . BUT I do think the system here in England - the course fees, parental contributions that are assumed etc is awful. Never mind the fact that after paying a student loan back for five years, people still owe more than they borrowed is just shocking.

We don’t disagree with our view on the system!

But it does annoy me to see reference to X “debt” of students when it really is not a debt in the normal definition of that word, and repayments are relatively small amounts deducted at source so never missed by the “debtor”. It really is a graduate tax and should be marketed as such

When I was paying mine back it absolutely felt like a debt 🤣 . I was lucky because I didn’t pay fees, so I had paid my student loan off in full by 2010. I was pretty happy when the repayments stopped. So I will definitely encourage dcs to explore all possible routes into their chosen career , if there are more than one.

@VanCleefArpels it's 9% of your income, how is that a relatively small amount?

9% over a threshold roughly double the tax threshold...

I don’t think dd would say it’s been a massively positive experience in her first year, we are hoping next year is better for her!
Dh and I have done okay for ourselves and neither of us went to uni. In fact I left college after 3 months, not sure about him but he did go back and get the qualifications he actually needed to pursue his chosen career.

@housemaus thats interesting about how you find the young people who have/ haven’t been to uni. We get young people in after A levels and it’s straight in at the deep end, dealing with an office environment, client meetings and so on. Yes they are often living at home (usually are) but by the time they are 21 and average uni leaver age they have had 3 years of exposure and are really confident. I think of myself post uni at 22 starting work and was as green as they come, very underconfident, terrified of getting a roasting from my boss and no client skills (despite a First from uni).

The young people who joined us younger are by far the better employees by early 20s. Where it’s hard for them is if they then do a PT degree and post qual it’s a long haul for them balancing lots of things to ultimately get to the same end point as if they had done the necessary 6 years (uni, post qualification and training) to qualify.

OP maybe that answers the ‘what happens to the other 50pc.’ In our industry they become from what I’ve seen very good at the job. But often don’t quite get there with full qualification because it’s such a long haul for them. For some firms/ clients in our job that does matter.

I think the people who really get the most out of university are people from relatively small towns where people don’t have much ambition and things are very conservative. For people like this it’s life changing.

I come from a middle class background in a leafy, liberal place and it was pretty much expected that I would go and I did go and I enjoyed it and am grateful for it etc but it didn’t have the massive horizon broadening factor for me than it would for some.

I imagine if you come from some depressing town and a small minded family where people are putting pressure on you to settle down and have kids in your 20s and generally shut your life off it would be massively life changing. Which is why it’s so important.