If you didn’t go to a private school, what do you think about those who did?

[hanginds]

Do you feel they had an unfair advantage? Do you care? Do you think they don’t know about the real world?

I really struggle to connect with colleagues who were privately educated as they seem almost entitled to the job. They seem fearless about finding alternative work if needs be, yet I just don’t have that confidence. I assume it’s their background as it’s the only difference between us in the academic/work context.

I have no hatred for people who went to private school. I know many and count them in my friends and family. However, I am philosophically and politically opposed to the private school system. I think it is divisive and damaging to society. So of course I would rather not have to deal with people who choose it for their children. Of course I have had to overlook it in some cases, in the same way I have to accept that some people I love believe in, for example, capital punishment and hunting with dogs.

Type of school is indeed very much part of monitoring social mobility with education being a primary driver life opportunities

I very much support initiatives that help increases the chances of those without privilege. I wish more employers would place a greater emphasis on this.

@CurlewKatei hope those cases that you overlook know how honoured they are. So you ask everyone you interact with whether they were privately educated just so you can judge whether they are worthy of your attention? You see the irony here.....if someone who was privately educated said this they would be rounded upon and told they are a snob/elitist/up their own arse etc etc

To be honest, I am hoping that we move more and more to parental income as an indicator for social mobility.

it should not make a difference for the children if parents saved and sacrificed to send them to private schools or if they decided to allocate their income to other things (bigger house, more holiday).

I think this will be the way forward.

After reading and contributing to this thread I am now even happier that DD goes to a private school. The school acknowledges the privilege and my DD is turning into a well rounded individual who has friends across the class and social divides, from the village + primary as well as at her school. The school places a high importence on kindness, compassion and social responsibility. She would never judge anyone based on their educational background because all that matters is whether they are a nice person. There would never be a question of not being friends with someone because of their background.
Inequality is quite fact of life, if we hadn't sent her private we would have a much larger house and land purely because of our income.

I agree, but I don't think it is as simple as state/private.

As I've already said, my dd is at a state comprehensive, but we could have sent her private if we had chosen to do so. We didn't, because we were confident that there would be no added value in doing so. As parents, we are perfectly able to compensate for any gaps in the education that she might receive at her state school, e.g. by facilitating access to extracurricular activities, professional networks etc. She isn't disadvantaged as a result of going to a state school, and frankly, it would be absurd to give her preferential treatment over a privately educated candidate in any kind of recruitment process.

It would also be absurd to neglect the huge chasm that exists between privileged kids like my dd and children from disadvantaged backgrounds who start school already way behind their peers at the age of just 4/5; who aren't necessarily supported at home because their parents may not have the ability, capacity and/or motivation to do so; who don't have access to extracurricular activities and broader educational opportunities apart from those provided by the school; who live in inadequate and/or overcrowded accommodation without any proper space to study; who don't have access to nourishing, well balanced meals; who may have seriously disrupted or chaotic family lives that make it hard for them to concentrate; who don't have access to all of the books, Internet, laptops, tutors and other resources that privileged kids have etc etc.

There is no comparison and it would be deeply unfair to treat a candidate from a vet disadvantaged background as having had the same kind of start in life as a comfortable, middle class kid like my dd.

‘Type of school is indeed very much part of monitoring social mobility with education being a primary driver life opportunities ‘

it really is.

So of course I would rather not have to deal with people who choose it for their children. Of course I have had to overlook it in some cases.

That’s decent of you. Why do you overlook it in some cases since you hold private school parents in such low regard?
Do you tell them how you feel about them?
And, as a pp said, how do you know where their children go to school? Is it the first question you ask when you meet someone?

I think being ideologically opposed to private school is fine and I understand it. What I don't like is the criticism and disparagement of the kids that went there.

Dont worry, they wouldn't - as I've I've said parental income and job status and free school meals are the markers used for improving social mobility. If your dds school doesn't qualify for contextual offers then your dd will be in the same position as any other bright teen, privately educated or not.

I said- there are people who do and believe things I profoundly disagree with but I have to overlook it for many reasons. This includes using private schools for their children. And of course I wouldn't know where most casual acquaintances send their children to school. I wouldn't know their views on capital punishment either!

No, I know - I'm well aware of that, having recently been through the university application process with dd. (Though there was one university which would have given dd a contextual offer if she had chosen to apply there, simply because her current school is on their list!)

And yes, my own organisation uses parental occupation and eligibility for free school meals to monitor equal opportunities, as I said above.

I was really just responding to those posters who were saying that private vs state should be a factor. If we are really serious about social mobility, it needs to be a lot more nuanced than this!

The sooner the charitable tax status is taken away from private schools the better. It’s ridiculous that these businesses have charity status.

I'm actually quite horrified people judge others just because they went to private school where their PARENTS sent them!

I'm state school educated with two working parents from working class backgrounds.

I worked hard, went to a "top" university, and quite frankly I couldn't care less how much money people have or where they come from. There are two types of people in this world - nice once and not so nice ones. That's all.

I have friends who were privately and state school educated, from various countries, and they all have one thing in common - they are nice people.

I may not have had every text book paid for at university, but I didn't sit there moaning it was unfair. I had access to a decent library where I could borrow the books for free.

Life is what you make of it.

@CurlewKate so if you don't know who does and dies not send their kids to private schools how do you decide whether to interact with them?
How about if you made a good friend and a few months down the line it cane out that she sent her kids to private school, would you then drop her or would you overlook your morals and principles? Your positioning is absurd to be honest and you come across as incredibly judgey.
I appreciate an ideological stance against private schools but surely you understand that the worst thing is to surround yourself with people who agree with you about everything? It is our differences of opinions which make us individuals and adds curiosity into our lives, to try to understand someone from a different viewpoint to yourself. Just surrounding yourself with people who you agree with you just reinforces your own conscious and unconscious bias and stops you from growing as a person.

But hey maybe that's just something I've learned from what has been taught at DD's private school 🤷‍♀️

The sooner the charitable tax status is taken away from private schools the better. It’s ridiculous that these businesses have charity status.

Agreed. But we all know why this won’t happen until this bunch of xxxxs in charge of the country are kicked out. And they have the gall to claim that they have a levelling up agenda.

@TheHoover it's top of labour's agenda, a popular policy & hopefully not too far off...

Then I hope Labour will find places for all the kids leaving private school in order to accommodate them into the state sector. Obviously in some areas that could mean building brand new schools as current state ones are over subscribed as it is. I can't see any plans to do so.

The result of course will be that independent schools become even more elitist, as only the children of the extremely wealthy will be able to afford to go. They’d need an income like @StarmanBobby !

Exactly, although of course under Labour she'll be taxed to high heaven.

The result of course will be that independent schools become even more elitist, as only the children of the extremely wealthy will be able to afford to go. They’d need an income like @@StarmanBobby!

but you are not considering yourselves in any way as part of the elite. Maybe a high-earning but non-elitist sub-class? It’s like the chappy on question time trying to argue that £80k is not a high salary.

its the right thing to do and if the aspiring elitists get bottom sliced out the pool then sobeit.

Dp and I both went to private school. We are both shy and unconfident...me especially. Most of my peers were super self confident though. Dd goes to state school and she is much more confident than I will ever be.

All that will happen is that parents who currently pay school fees will just buy up all the houses in catchment areas of best state schools, thereby pushing house prices up and excluding less affluent parents. You can't get rid of privilege, it exists and therefore the solution should be improving current state schools rather than penalising private ones as Labour's policy will only serve to put more pressure on the state system.
I'm not saying it is a good thing to have private schools but they definitely reduce the burden on state schools and actually help steady house prices in catchment areas. Ambitious parents will always be ambitious, no matter whether state or private and add money to that will actually reduce opportunity for more disadvantaged kids. Private schools take the kids of ambitious + relatively affluent parents out of the equation, thereby increasing access to good state schools for others eg parents who are ambitious but less affluent.

I’m not sure the argument that taking away charitable status will mean private schools will become more even more elitist will really matter to the 96% of people who don’t use them.

they aren’t charities, they’re businesses that cater ( mostly) to some of the most wealthy people in the U.K.

I know we are extremely privileged for all sorts of reasons, I said so upthread. We have a higher income than many families and that enables us to afford extras such as extra curricular activities, day trips and multiple other things that give my children an advantage over others. This will include independent schooling when the time comes (with or without charitable status).
I don’t actually disagree with charitable status being removed, although it’s more nuanced than many think. As independent schools currently have charitable status they are not allowed to claim VAT back on business purchases; once it’s removed they will be able to do so, and that will offset some of the extra that will have to be paid. Equally to keep their charitable status at the moment they have to provide a benefit to the community. At the moment this tends to involve them offering their facilities free to local state schools and community groups, which will stop (or they’ll start to charge) once charitable status is removed.
They will mitigate the impact on the parents as much as possible because most can’t afford a huge loss in numbers.
So despite the additional cost to me I actually welcome a measure that would provide funding to improve state education, as I’m not a cunt. I just don’t think the impact will be as large as people believe, and I also don’t trust that all the funding will be used for that purpose.
It’s funny, I’m defending you on one thread and you’re gunning for me on this one!