Got "told off"- annual leave for teachers strike

[Skyblue81]

Feeling confused. AIBU??

Got 3 kids. Teachers were on strike last Weds & Thurs. School said it would remain open, but changed their minds Weds morning.

I worked from home on Weds with all 3 kids at home. It was exhausting, so I then put in for 2 days annual leave for Thursday (teachers strike) and Friday (to recover from my exhaustion).

Got back to work today to an HR call where I basically got told off for submitting and then taking leave!!!!! Yes OK I didn't give loads of notice, but then neither did my school.

Feeling really beaten-down by my workplace. I work hard, and have earned that annual leave. I took it to take care of my children, then have a recovery day. FFS it's not like I went on a bender to Ibiza!

AIBU???

Jesus, some posters must be hired this morning to get starting little squabbles with others over someone else’s annual leave. Christ. 🐔

Yep indeed.

OP: "I need emergency leave for tomorrow and Friday because of the strike"
Line Manager: "Ok that's reasonable. I approve it"
OP: "Cheers thanks"

HR: "Oh on what grounds did you give leave? We need a week to ensure cover / that payroll don't muck it up. This was only given with a day's notice"
Line Manager: "Oh it was for a legitimate reason. There's a teacher strike"
HR: "No this isn't legitimate. It's piss taking. The strike is Wednesday/ Thursday but she's taking Friday. She going on a jolly and trying to use this as an excuse to fool us into thinking it's a legitimate reason for emergency leave. Now we will have to review procedure over granting emergency leave cos someone is trying to pull a fast one"

OP: "It's so UNFAIR that HR spoke to me over taking emergency leave for a day I didn't need emergency leave for. Wah wah wah".

I really wouldn’t care. People do it everyday. Illegal is a strong word. No one’s prosecuted. If one were a repeat offender, they’d be out of a job presumably. Remind me why it is you’re not working currently? And why is it you’ve taken such a strong dislike to a complete stranger on the interwebs? Could the two be linked?

Well no, not really. It wasn’t the OP being less than a ‘good employee’. What else was she supposed to do ? In the event they had refused annual leave, she would have been entitled to dependants’ leave to deal with the issue created by the decision to close.

Uanbu.

You could have taken it without pay using flexible working arrangements under carers responsibilities, obvs they could have said NO but presume meetings etc were covered, so what harm has been done?

I see what you're saying, but OPs boss approved the leave, seemingly without any argument. Her boss, on the face of things, looks like the kind of boss that we all deserve that looks at things holistically rather than stick rigidly to a policy dreamt up by some HR consultancy who's cookie cutter templated document was adopted by OP's firm. The manager made a call that on this occasion the OP's circumstances and well being outweighed some jobsworths' clipboard.

You’re not an employer. Of course you wouldn’t care. You’re not the one it’s being done to. Things aren’t allowed in law because @PsychoCandy23 doesn’t mind people doing them.

You can’t be prosecuted for violating contract law. That’s not possible in our legal system. That kind of comment is why your input is so infuriating to read. Jesus Christ.

I am working, thanks. Why aren’t you looking after your relative? I don’t dislike you. You started this, did you forget that? You responded to me rudely and you kicked off.

Absolutely. And it’s HR’s job to be the bad guy and point out the rules so that, next strike day, every parent in the team isn’t asking to take a full week off at the last minute just because OP took an extra day this time and got away with it.

To be fair if OP called in sick on the Friday because she wasn't feeling well enough to work if would've been a perfectly valid sick day.

She could’ve worked on Friday. She could’ve looked into childcare options when the strikes were announced and she could’ve let her employer know weeks ago that she might be requesting annual leave at the last minute if the schools close. There were better ways she could have behaved - but who among us is perfect all the time? I’m not criticising, I’m just acknowledging she could have done better in the circumstances.

It’s not a big issue. She hasn’t been told off or sacked. They just don’t want it to become a habit (for OP or anyone else) so they’ve mentioned it. Unless OP is intending to do it repeatedly, there’s not a problem here.

Oh stuff it! People are allowed to take annual leave for any reason.

To the manager, not to the OP

They should be pointing out to line managers then, rather than employees who have had line manager approval for leave. If I had approved leave for one of my team under exceptional circumstances and subsequently HR did not agree with my decision their problem would be with me, not with my team member.

If the line manager makes a decision HR think they shouldn't have taken, then surely HR should be telling off the line manager, not the person they manage.

It's the manager's job to ensure leave requests are reasonable, not the person requesting them.

Seriously, have you got me confused with someone else? I haven’t been at all abusive or ‘kicked off’? I didn’t report the post you made which was removed, by the way. That was a personal attack. Presumably, that’s why it was deleted. In accordance with the rules. My relative is with a physio currently. Thanks for asking. I’m on unpaid sabbatical. They will have me back when I am able/ready to return. They’re actually just really supportive. Which is tremendous. I have been a hiring manager for a long time. And I don’t give two hoots if a valued employee needs time off for any reason. I grant leave as and when. And I have/sort of have a team with a very low absence rate. I would never allow a member of my staff to be admonished for taking approved leave. I would be very cross if an employee was spending my time spouting vitriolic bile on Mumsnet though. Or is unlimited personal internet use part of your contract?

@Eleganz @ChocSaltyBalls I disagree. From HR’s perspective, they don’t want the managers to turn down last minute annual leave requests - they want employees to only make those requests when absolutely necessary. So, they don’t achieve that through telling managers, they do that through telling employees not to make the unnecessary requests. If they ask managers to only approve the reasonable requests then it’s too late - employees are already in a sticky situation and there’s unnecessary stress and hostility. The aim of HR here is to be the big bad wolf so that relationships don’t sour between the OP and their manager.

I didn’t see anything that was removed. I haven’t confused you with anyone else at all. Nothing I’ve said broke any rules so I have no idea why any of it would be removed. I’d be very concerned if a hiring manager I worked with had no understand at all of contract law and kept making wildly ignorant statements when giving advice.

The post removed said that using the phrase “me thinks” sounds like the Head Girl from Wild Child and isn’t an indication that you understand employment law. How on earth is that breaking talk guidelines? 😂

Awful isn't it OP

You're dammed if you and you're damned if you don't on here!

Cuntbadgers everywhere. The scary thing is - theyre allowed to vote 😂 x

I'd guess it's seen as a personal attack. There are some strange decisions made over what goes and what stays

Aye the only person who looks like the idiot here, is you! What a ridiculous comment.

As a line manager I completely disagree. This is HR overstepping and interfering on how I manage my team. I am the manager, not them.

If they need to remind managers about policy that is fine, if they need to change policy that this also fine, but telling staff that they should not submit last minute leave requests because it puts line managers in difficult situations is both a) an unrealistic situation, b) directly undermines their managers by implying that they are not able to manage effectively.

Behaving in the way you suggest is a good way for HR to alienate itself from line managers.

I don’t know. I didn’t report it. My hide is several metres thick. And even I was astonished by the vitriol. Didn’t get the reference either. So a double fail. Chalk it up to experience and move on. Hope this helps!

I’ve approved annual leave and then spoken to people about the way they have planned and requested it. It is not telling them off but explaining that it was exceptional and future requests need to follow protocol. However, this is when individuals have really messed up their leave and are causing problems with cover. I wouldn’t involve HR and I would just speak to the person directly as adult to adult in the first instance.

IMO Taking leave with little or no notice requires a conversation with a manager not an online request. That could have resulted in the manager explaining entitlement to time off during the strike but that the late booked AL was inconvenient.