Ukraine refugee too reliant on me?

[Southerngirl99]

I’ve hosted a female in her 50’s from Ukraine for almost a year, she doesn’t speak English and hasn’t made much effort to learn, she relies on me to do everything for her, almost like a PA.

We’ve given her notice to leave soon and helped her onto local housing list etc etc.

the local council want her to attend a meeting and because they know I’m exhausted with it all after 10 months they’ve liaised directly with her for the first time to arrange meeting for tomorrow, they’ve told me not to attend and to get her to make her own way there, as when she lives independently from me she will have to do this anyway.

she’s very stressed about going to a new area of town on her own (she catches the bus everyday to work and back) and says she doesn’t know what to say and can I tell her what to say in the meeting.

so my dilemma

am I being unreasonable letting her manage for herself? Or should I be giving her a lift and waiting outside the venue so she feels less stressed?

It's hard, I feel for you both. It's partly cultural and partly down to her upbringing. Ukraine would have been part of the USSR for all her formative years up to 1991. Then it takes time to adjust which some people find easier than others.

I would go through the route with her a few times and give her written instructions (I used to have to do this for my dad when he was in his late 80's and driving somewhere different) we'd go through it on Google maps and street view.

Other than that I'd leave her to get herself there - she needs to learn to manage on her own without you but of course some people seem Incapable of doing anything in their own other than using the bathroom and will never change and improving her English language skills rather than relying on you.

She’s got your number, right? So if she has a problem with the bud she can ring you? I think you’ve got to let her try to do this all alone. Speaks well of you but ultimately she needs to build confidence and the way to do it is to do it.

*bus!

My concern is that if she wishes to remain in the UK that she has made little progress in learning the language or trying to gain some independence from you.

That said, I do not wish to discount the trauma of leaving her home country and what she has experienced (and is still experiencing).

When the hosting scheme started many posters, myself included were worried about the ability of kind people like yourself being unsupported and especially how the "off ramp" would be managed.

Your situation is difficult as without your help she may not attend the meeting at all (and it's in your interests that she does).

That said you need to follow the guidance from your LA. They want her to make her own way to the meeting and to attend alone and make her own way back.

This is your backstop. It's not your decision; it is that of the LA and if she wants their forward assistance re: housing and welfare then she has to meet those requirements (and your subversion of those requirements are not helpful to her - which you can point out).

So I would assist in making sure she knew the location/bus route but no, do not take/attend or pick up from the meeting.

I'd give her exact bus and google map instructions to find her way (and perhaps do a dummy run with her to show her).

Also tell her to use google translate on her phone if she doesn't understand words/phrases in the meeting. The council surely already understands her limited English and can offer some translation.

Are there any explanatory videos she can watch to show her what she is likely to be asked in the process.

It's hard at this stage,as you are (as you say) exhausted, but now you have an end goal in sight it's a shame not to help her final placement through.

Hi yes we’ve gone through the bus route, shown her on google maps etc.

im expecting the LA to give her a little pep talk about being independent and also to emphasise how lucky she is to be on housing register, (she has rejected several possible homes as they are not exactly what she wants in the location she wants, even said that she didn’t think one of the flats was built correctly as the foundations weren’t like they have in Ukraine).

she can use the translation app when she has to but normally she points at me to use mine.

Would you feel confident doing this in Ukraine after 10 months? Would you be fluent in Ukraine/Russian in 10 months? I know I wouldn't.

I would go over the bus route with her a couple of times and also work with her to come up with three or four questions for her to ask. Build confidence that you're sure she can do this.

Then on the day, it's up to her to get herself there and engage as fully as possible.

You sound amazing and very generous. I feel given it sounds like she's made little effort in almost a year, you should step back. It'll probably do her good in the long run

Has your guest joined any local Ukrainian groups? We live in a small village outside a town and my guest has a network of local Ukrainian friends now. That has been a great source of support for her and has been really good for developing her independence. It certainly has been an important factor in her becoming less dependent on us

Hi @Southerngirl99 you're not being unreasonable, she may be stressed out but her depending on you like this is going to stress you out.
My Mum came to the UK in the 70's, her English was not great and getting out there and being independent really helped it's the only way she became confident.

I personally would take her so the new housing situation goes through quicker than if she messes about but then RUN FOR THE HILLS!

Nobody is expecting her to be "fluent," for goodness' sake.

I spent months travelling in remote parts of China in the early 2000s where I didn't speak the language very well and very few people spoke any English, and that was before all the translation apps and things they have nowadays. I went around with a point-and-say phrasebook, pencil and notebook; if I couldn't say what i wanted to say, I would use the phrasebook or draw pictures and diagrams on the notebook. I memorized the Chinese characters for stuff like things on menus and locations on bus stops and things I needed to be able to know or use. You get by. It's not easy, but this lady needs to try a bit harder to cope; it sounds like she has developed a bit of learned helplessness and has got into the habit of letting others do things for her.

and in the USSR they didn't have buses?

sorry, but I don't think you know anything about the USSR if you think that being raised under them prevents her travelling alone - of course it doesn't. What difference do you think that made?

It might give her a boost if n confidence if she achieves it.

How does she manage work of she doesn't speak English ?

I spent months travelling in remote parts of China in the early 2000s where I didn't speak the language very well and very few people spoke any English, and that was before all the translation apps and things they have nowadays. I went around with a point-and-say phrasebook, pencil and notebook; if I couldn't say what i wanted to say, I would use the phrasebook or draw pictures and diagrams on the notebook. I memorized the Chinese characters for stuff like things on menus and locations on bus stops and things I needed to be able to know or use. You get by. It's not easy, but this lady needs to try a bit harder to cope; it sounds like she has developed a bit of learned helplessness and has got into the habit of letting others do things for her.

I agree she should make more effort, especially now (different when she first arrived and it may have been v temporary).

But your comparison isn't a fair one. You were not travelling around China watching Britain (assuming you're British) being blown up. Your town destroyed. Places you want as a kid being flattened. People you know being killed, your friends being scattered all over Europe and not knowing if some were even alive.

Then you have the age part and as someone who needs to gain proficiency in another language in my 40s, I can tell you it's vastly different then remembering words in my 20s - which I did as I studied languages at uni.

OP you need to let her go alone. Perhaps have some tea and cake waiting for her when she gets back if you want. You're not doing her any favours by being so helpful and kind any more. She needs to be able to make mistakes now, hard as that is.

@Kokeshi123 that's not a valid comparison. You chose to travel in remote areas of China armed only with a phrasebook. That's the sort of choice very few people would make - it's not the norm.

I agree with others you have done all the right things and she needs to go alone. Am I right to presume that like most council buildings this is in your local town centre? Surely she must be familiar with the place?

also is she clear you have a hard deadline for her to move out? She may be turning properties down in a bid to stay with you. You might have to be firmer with her about your deadline and explain she will have to pay for a hotel if she hasn’t secured a council property

Perhaps because she actually is quite brave and resourceful?

This is to do with the mindset of being told what to do rather than whether or not there are buses. The USSR in the 70s and 80s will have been pretty regimented. Gorbachev slowly relaxed the strict rules and regulations (Perestroika) after he came to power in 1985 and made political systems more transparent (Glasnost), which paved the way to Ukrainian independence in 1991.

It sounds as if the situation with housing isn’t going to resolve if you don’t take a step back. Refusing several offers of accommodation is not normal behaviour so it’s very likely not about the accommodation, rather about this lady.

I know it’s hard when you see her struggling but you need to put yourself first. To this effect, I would stand firm on the rules.You are actually being cruel to be kind as she isn’t going to increase her independence if you’re always in the background. I also think you should consider giving her a deadline so that she understands if she doesn’t accept the next offer of a flat she’s in danger of being homeless.

I get that it's hard, but there is no alternative. The OP can't spend her life looking after this woman. The woman has a choice of either adapting to life in the UK in order to live there long term, or rebuilding her life in a war torn Ukraine after the war - both of which will be very hard. It's shit, but that's the reality. It's not the OP's job to be her secretary for ever. Most Ukrainians have been proactive about adapting to their new countries.

There is a wonderful group here, however after three weeks she decided she didn’t want to meet them anymore. She’s a loner and happy in her own company. I’ve tried to arrange 121 meet ups with various other hosts and guests and she never wants to continue with anyone.

Rejected several homes? Not exactly what she wants? Is she taking the piss? . The housing lists are years and years long for most and she has rejected several properties?

She sounds pretty damn ungrateful.

Im surprised there's no uproar about this zooming up to the top of housing lists. Like their usually is with refugees/asylum seekers. But then i forget they are fleeing war unlike the others...