Will relocating solve our problems? Or just create new ones...

[RainbowRuby]

My partner moved here from the US in 2010 – we met shortly after and married. He never really adjusted to London or the UK, he feels lonely, like an outsider and all in all hopeless. On the face of it, our lives have progressed very well after a lot of struggle. Slowly moved up the ladder in our careers (after a lot of setbacks), managed to buy a flat in London, two gorgeous healthy kids and our latest ‘success’ has been moving out to a commuter town outside of London to our dream house, with great schools. However, behind closed doors, my partner’s feeling of loneliness and being a misfit in the UK has never eased and also recently been exacerbated by a highly toxic work environment. Now that all the visible ‘challenges’ are behind us – getting a house, moving up in our careers etc, this remains the elephant in the room that is getting harder to avoid. His depression (he is on medication/CBT) is getting worse. We/he have tried for years to move back to the US – but for some reason or the other it just hasn’t worked out. His desperation is heart-breaking. He doesn’t want to quit his job and just go to the US to look for a job (reasons being he is not comfortable with the financial instability that would bring), he has tried for years to secure a job from here but it seems to fizzle out in the last round (which has really damaged his self-confidence as well) and he feels we are too far deep in (have a house, both of us working, my parents live nearby). I feel so stuck – I want to ask him to quit his job and just go and we well follow. Am I being naïve to think if we move to a place where he feels he ‘belongs’ his mental health will improve? That we can just go out on a whim and find jobs and restart our lives at the age of 40? Our kids are 5 and 8.

I'm sorry but I honestly don't think moving will solve anything. He seems I have set up moving back to the US as the answer to his depression when in effect on most cases you can't move away from your problems they just go with you.
You also have to think about your children, health care and job security. Even if he manages to get a job will you he allowed to work there? Also it's common in the US for employees to only get two weeks holiday a year and family friendly policies are uncommon.

Depends what the source of the problem is, surely?

You can certainly become depressed living in an area/country you don’t want to be in, and in those instances moving away can indeed be the proverbial silver bullet. Moving by itself won’t solve problems that are different to that though.

Also, ask yourself why he is idealising a country where he ended up with ptsd from school!

It sounds like he's in a "grass is greener" state of mind, and if you move he may discover that it's not. The grass is green where you water it. How much focus has he put on building his happy here, rather than looking at the US with rose tinted glasses?

That aside - will you even be able to comfortably afford his treatment there as it's a preexisting condition, and may not be covered.

Thank you so much for your detailed post. I was always afraid of living as a split family - did that in my my teens and it took a massive toll on me. But looking at his state of mind, I may have to suck it up and be brave. Possibly more manageable now that the kids are out of nappies and much easier to deal with. We could manage on one salary (with sacrifices of course) for about a year. He had friends from the US when we first moved here - but (as it inevitably is in London) his closest friends have moved out of the UK. What is his biggest struggle in the London/UK? He says he is a cultural misfit. Everything here is 'cold' and too bureaucratic, transactional, low level of empathy. (I'm not saying that is how it is, this is how he 'feels'). I'm at the point where I can't minimise how he feels anymore, his experiences are clearly different to mine and when I try to comfort him - I just think I am at the risk of gas-lighting him. Sorry I am rambling, I have never lived in the US (but have lived in 3 different countries over my lifespan). We have visited for holiday on and off, but not more than 2 weeks at a time. We all have US passports (that is another story). I think if I convince my husband to bite the bullet, face his fears of 'being out of work' we need to be more informed about the location...

Just another thought, can you do a ‘Wanted Down Under’’ analysis of potentially moving abroad?

This is my hesitation - is he idealising a 'dream' or is he right? Has he tried to 'water the garden' here, yes and no. He has tried hard to establish his career here (he is very career orientated) and we have tried to do all the right things. Buying a house, kids in a good school, trying to make friends, moving my parents close to us. Like I said, on the face of it, we have 'succeeded' at it all. But behind closed doors, some days it feels like there is nothing left to 'water' anymore. He is so so miserable and now I feel there is nothing practical left to 'fix'.....

If he thinks everything is too bureaucratic and transactional here, then he's definitely idealising the US.

What is his biggest struggle in the London/UK? He says he is a cultural misfit. Everything here is 'cold' and too bureaucratic, transactional, low level of empathy.

So you know that this is a statement of his perception and not truth, which means moving to the US doesn't fix it. What fixes it is being in a situation he perceives as welcoming, etc. and what happens if the situation you land in on the US side treats him exactly the same? The problem is that he feels this way, not that the situation actually IS this way.

The point of contention here is he doesn't want to work on his issues while living where you are - and there's no guarantee he's going to want to do so while in the US. You have your own emotional state (you've never lived in the US but your background of living in other countries suggests you're fairly adaptable so it's not really that much of a concern) and that of your DC to consider. How will you feel, and how will your DC feel, being apart from your parents? They're young, so they might adapt - and they might not.

I’m from CA and I moved to the UK 20 years ago, so I understand what it’s like to be a fish out of water. But when I go back to visit, it isn’t the same place I left. I grew up in an affluent area and it’s fairly run down now with homeless people everywhere, big camps with dozens of tents. Traffic is horrendous, property is expensive and taxes are high.

There is a saying that homesickness is 90% nostalgia and I think that’s true. You feel homesick and want to go back but the “home” of 10 years ago doesn’t exist. People have moved away, your favourite restaurant has closed, the hole you left in people’s lives when you emigrated has closed.

Your DH has a medical condition, depression, and moving halfway across the world would be incredibly stressful. There might be a short respite with the excitement, but moving is not going to fix depression. There is no way I would undertake such a drastic life change with an unstable partner. What if he’s still unhappy? Would you uproot your dc again? What if he is happy and you aren’t? Have you lived in the States before? What if you want to return and he won’t let the dc? That is a legal possibility.

Will need to look up the term...what is this?

It's a television programme where families from the UK make a trial move to Australia to see if life there is really for them. They trial jobs, schools, cost out properties, and "live the life" to see if it's what they expected.

You could get an Air B&B and do the same, I should think.

Wherever you go…there you are

I can't help thinking this as Brit who moved with their family to the USA in their 40's.
Those are two of my biggest complaints about living in the USA compared to the UK.

In other words, like pp have said, you can’t ‘fix’ what is really going on here by moving

There def is some truth to this. I am totally of the mindset that no place is 'ideal' in this world to live. Just where/what you are willing to make it work ....

It sounds very much like rose tinted specs/grass is greener syndrome to me. The fact that he suffers with depression too makes me wonder if actually, that's the problem, not where he is. If he feels like a misfit here, did he feel like he fitted in when he lived in the US? And if he'd be happy to move to either CA or VA/NJ - blimey - those are two places that could hardly be further apart. Does he have an established network of friends/family in either of those locations? And if you move and he STILL feels like something is missing, what would you do then? Moving to the US is a big deal and if you sell up here and are 'all in' with that option, I fear you'll be stuck there with a DH who is just as depressed as he is here, but with none of your support network and all the medical expenses he'll incur as someone with a pre-existing medical condition in the US.

I wanted to add that moving is stressful but moving country is on a whole other level.

Very interesting. Are there any points you think are better -specifically in terms of a future life for children. What plays on my mind is that will the kids have better life options/choices over there vs the UK?

America will have changed massively in the 13 years since he left. There is a very high chance that even if he moved there it won't be the same as it was when he was last there, so he'll end up with nowhere that feels like "home".

I first visited the US in 2010 and most recently went last year. The price of things out there astounded me, particularly fresh food. We bought enough food for 2 meals and some drinks, bread, butter and jam, etc to set us up for breakfasts in a rental and it cost almost $100!

I would really encourage him to take an extended break there (go too for a holiday for at least part of the time). I too would really be worried about uprooting your whole family from your dream home, only for it to not be the answer he thinks it's going to be.

If his counselling isn't working I'd perhaps suggest a switch to someone different as it may very well be needed if a move isn't the answer he hopes.

I really don't think this is about moving to America. Your husband seems to have idolised a place were he was the most happy/content in his past and is not fixating on that to fix what he feels.

Honestly I think u would just get to America and he would have the same problems, without any family support and unsettled kids.

Something so beautiful yet heartbreaking about this phrase...

...yes...and then what do we fix from there...sigh

Your DH is being naive and actually needs a good therapist to talk through his projection of “home” onto a place that also gave him PTSD. I would work on raising his happiness hormones, make sure he excercises regularly, sleeps well, relaxes properly and has a very healthy gut biome. Focus on what brings him happiness in his real life and go cold turkey on the romanticising of the USA.

Thanks for your insight...you highlight all of the 'whatifs' that are both in his mind and my mind. I think that is part of his fear too...and then he wakes up and tries to make it work again. And there are periods where he realises he is living a lie. My heart breaks for him.

Before I’d consider uprooting my family - I’d be wanting him to work on his mental health and well-being. How much work has he done on himself? Has he sought out therapy to understand his underlying issues and feelings?

what will he do differently in the US that will make life magically better? Inside and outside of work.

what will your children’s lifestyle look like. Their education. Access to friends. Will
they have the same freedom and safety they have here.

medically insurance wise etc.

social wise - what is there for you, partner and family unit….

could you rent your house for a year and try it if one of you can get a job over there whilst still in the U.K.? Or he can set up
interviews and go over for a month?

Id be wanting clear boundaries on what marks the US move as ‘working’ for the whole family and a timeframe to give it.

id also be addressing the need to support his families emergencies if they are still cropping up. Honestly feel he needs to do some work on himself before asking such a big thing if his whole family.