To think people are very quick to forget the pandemic

[BelleMarionette]

Myself, and other junior doctors, worked hard on the covid wards, in appalling conditions. We didn't have decent PPE, and often had little to no relevant experience or training, as many were redeployed with little notice (in my case, 36 hours). Almost all of of us became sick, some very seriously so, and some even died. Many more were left struggling with our own mental health, suffering from PTSD, anxiety and depression.

We are now striking, due to pay erosion over the past 15 years. In real terms its around a 30% pay cut. It's difficult to live on what we are be being paid, especially with families to support.

I have seen an awful lot of negative comments about junior doctors on another thread. Aibu to think the public has been very quick to forget our contribution during the pandemic?

I would dearly love to be wrong and see support

I support junior doctors striking and nurses too.

Neither get paid enough. Also, I've always thought that the government should write off a portion of their student debt for every year worked in the NHS.

Neither do you, it would appear.

Solidarity to you NHS workers during the pandemic and now were/are real life heroes. My 23 year old daughter rotated onto the respiratory ward just 3 months post qualifying in January 2020 in a big London hospital. Her siblings and us were so scared for her that we sent her weekly morale boosting gifts through the post. We were so lucky she came through it stronger than before and highly experienced. She's currently traveling for 6 months having earned it! We're so proud of her and all of you. We most certainly have not and never will forget Covid

Of course YANBU.
My husband is CEV. Our poor son had to study for his A levels at home, seeing no one of his own age for over a year until vaccines were available. It was awful. Yes, of course people have forgotten.

Using the pandemic as a reason isn’t necessary. People have moved on which is good and so many groups suffered. From isolation and damage to livelihoods. Measures were put in place to help the NHS and keep admissions lower than they would have been.

Shutting a lot of the private sector down and impacting people in that way has led to some difficulties we face now.

Some agreed with that approach at the time, others didn’t, but I’d separate out strikes and pay issue now.

I support your right to strike
I support your need for a pay rise

But 35% - you've got to be fucking joking.

I support you. But agree that lots of people have very short memories.

I think it's also based in fear. People know that our NHS is being dismantled by the Tigris and they're scared. Anything that makes them confront that makes them defensive and even more worried. So they blame the thing obvious in front of them 'the doctors'. Bloody unfair and, frankly nuts.

I say agin, I support you

I support fair pay for HCPs but I don’t think harping back to the pandemic helps, that was 2 years ago and people have short memories.

I work in the NHS. The junior docs that I know in our Trust work so very hard and go above and beyond. Good luck x

Another thread about this 🙄.

No I did not clap for the NHS on e because myself and many others were busy worksing still.

You did yours and we did ours, if you want constant praise and sucking up to piss off. You do ajob and get paid and later on you get paid a great deal than most.

As for the superiority bullshit your winning no favours.

YANBU

I worker throughout in a supermarket, I saw the fight over toilet paper I worked long hours and lost 2 colleagues to covid. We were forgotten by everyone

So many people fail to understand how EXPENSIVE being a doctor is.

Paying for childcare around shifts, hospital parking, indemnity, professional exams, renting til your 30s as you constantly move house at minimal notice……

if doctors were being paid enough we would have more doctors in the UK and the NHS would be in much better shape.

honestly if these ignorant replies are anything to go by people will keep voting Tory and the public will get the healthcare system they deserve. And doctors will be much better paid in a private healthcare system without a monopoly employer.

I'm all for pay rises for Junior Doctors. But not because of the pandemic. You did your job in the pandemic. Most NHS staff didn't even work with Covid patients.

YABU to suggest that you did something amazing and unexpected during Covid. Your job is to care for and heal the sick.

Care workers are the unsung heroes of the pandemic. Especially community care workers.

Of course I haven't forgotten. It was an incredibly traumatic time for me.

What a disingenuous arguement.
Do some research into the payscales of everyone you have listed. Then list the qualifications they required to start this job, then how many years you have to train to become qualified in each job, then what the hours are (including those you have to do because you cannot just walk away at x time or clock off)
Then spendxa couple of hours observing each job
Then learn that a junior doctor is on crap pay.

@Choppies , please don't direct your anger at the general public. That is the wrong place for it. We have had a totally inadequate health service for a number of years now.

Maybe you have been fortunate enough that you, your parents, any close family have not been at the mercy of it lately. How can you possibly say that people get the health service they deserve? You know HCPs have to use the NHS too? And social workers and teachers and supermarket workers and countless other people in public services.

This is the typical attitude of doctors I work with.
It's so telling of your privileged backgrounds and what your real agenda with this strike.

Greedy greedy doctors, I see you.

I read the other thread which made for very sad reading. People have been incredibly quick to forget. However, you are trying to rationalise with the irrational. It's better to not get sucked down a depressing social media rabbit hole!

No point to these posts. Some people clearly have fixed ideas about this that won't be moved and proves the clapping for key workers was pointless. Eventually earning more money maybe 15 yrs after qualifying (if, and its a big if! they get a training number and are able to find a substantive consultant post) does not help people that have that financial need now. A significant number of trainees have a much longer arduous slug to becoming consultants. Between rota gaps, poor pay, low morale, defensive practice due to the fear of litigation, and the need to produce more with very little resource I am not surprised they are asking themselves over and over again. What's the point? The NHS is faltering and will collapse and that happening will mean a more difficult time for patients.

I'm not sure how I feel. I have friends who are consultants and know from kids on medicine degrees how tough it is.

But one of my friends said the working conditions are much better for junior doctors than they used to it - some of the practices she had to endure are simply seen as unacceptable now. I don't think they're brilliantly paid in the early parts of their career though.

I have respect for doctors (I think the NHS is a disaster zone at times and would hate to work there) but no clapping from me as it seemed a bit pointless and virtue-signalling. Others also risked getting covid from being at work.

As for the pay, the challenge is how to pay for it. We've all experienced pay erosion, whether in the public or private sector. Our public debt is so vast that big public sector pay rises will likely have to be paid for by tax rises. Which means those of us in the private sector who aren't getting inflation-busting pay rises are even worse off. That's the issue.

You were paid in pot-banging 😂

The pandemic was tough. But for an elderly person severely isolated in a care home, or family missing someone before they died, or child in bad home circumstances, or business folding there’s no where’s my payment for that.

I’d take the pandemic out of it. Focus on rational reasons for strike and pay if that’s what you want to do.

I worked in healthcare during covid and whilst I worked with colleagues I could reduce my exposure to patients (pharmacy). It was stressful beyond belief and I got do £50 covid payment for my efforts.

My brother who is a doctor couldn't, working with inadequate ppe, longer hours than normal, watching more people die than ever before, not being able to comfort people, not being able to visit our parents for fear of being the one to make them ill. It was a shitshow. He had marks on his face from the ppe and was under the most stress I have ever seen, by nature he is a resilient person but it was tough.

I stand with you all the way and support the strike.

That’s such a typically arrogant comment. We have to pay for parking and childcare blah blah. Yes like millions of other people. So out of touch and sneering at everyone else.