To wonder what part of this statement reminded Gary L of Nazi Germany?

[marmaladeo]

This is Suella Braverman's statement Gary Lineker was reacting to when he said "This is just an immeasurably cruel policy directed at the most vulnerable people in language that is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s" ... twitter.com/GaryLineker/status/1633094764865126400

If she was saying she wanted to stop immigration I could understand GL's reaction. But she's not. I don't understand why anyone would not want to "stop the boats" when 1. they're lethal and 2. they're being run by criminal gangs. If GL had made it clear he wanted to stop the boats but thought this policy was the wrong way to do it, then fine. But he didn't - he just made an extremely inflammatory statement. He might be getting lots of love from some quarters, but personally I think he's an egotist who is playing into the hands of the people smugglers.

Yup. And I think it's also very careful in the use of language saying illegal immigration or illegal immigrants instead of refugees. Anyone has the right to seek asylum and if they are desperate enough and if a country's process for asylum is as backwards as the uks is then people simply won't have the time to wait and put in an application in the correct way or doing so might actually put them at risk of harm anyway which is part of the reason why so many people are smuggled out secretively so their family can claim they know nothing when people come knocking. For example when you consider the case of asylum seeking children, often they need to get out of a country before a particular age. Uks asylum process wouldn't allow them to leave in time and people may not know they'll need to make that application before it would be too late time wise. So yes, the boats are horrifically dangerous but they are a direct reflection on how inadequate the UK processes are. If that was improved then people may not need to use the boats. But there may still be countries where people cannot do anything else.

Oh come on now, those are what are known as facts. And consistently facts have been willfullly ignored in this thread.

They do but not as much as solving the NHS and CoL crisis

Omnisis latest poll

The Conservatives set out their 5 key priorities. We asked people to rank which should be the main focus:

76% Cut NHS waiting lists
71% Grow the economy
69% Halve inflation
50% Reduce debt
33% Stop the boats

Well to be fair the UK is already considered untrustworthy by its nearest trading bloc. Breaking international law isn't a good look.

What has my employment status got to do with anything? That little ad hominem just makes you look - well, like something that sprays ankles. Also not a good look.

'Can anyone explain how that stops or reduces trafficking (that’s a rhetorical question - I don’t expect you to have an answer for such a complex situation.)'

I think it would act as a deterrent so the gangs wouldn't have anyone or as many to exploit?

Yeah sure, I have served in the armed forces, lived in half a dozen countries, including Russia, spent years at sea.

Very sheltered.

Ah, the armed forces. That explains a lot.

Which policies? Stopping the unchecked, uncontrolled migration of men from deeply patriarchal countries (or trying to)? That’s far right, is it?

It’s honestly been at the forefront of my mind over these last couple of threads.

I’m unashamedly to the political left but, while I don’t subscribe to right wing political theories, can absolutely accept them as valid positions to hold. There are certain, moral issues where I personally find right wing positions to be awful, but I’m not the universal arbiter of morality and have to accept that many people perceive their positions, contrary to my own, to be morally correct.

On this particular topic though (and while accepting some of the disagreement stems from opposing world views), the amount of out and out falsehoods being parroted by supporters of the government is alarming. People are either knowingly telling lies or are too stupid to recognize one, even when they’re made quite apparent.

‘Terrifying’ is fair.

You haven’t understood the message (sorry, I don’t mean that to sound rude but can’t think how to phrase it.)

Victims of trafficking will not be able to come forward for fear of being arrested and deported. Therefore the numbers of trafficked people will increase and it will become harder to identify the criminal gangs who organise and run the trafficking.

The UK is already a major draw for traffickers due to our relatively lax modern slavery laws and ability to police them. This new policy will make it harder to crack down on trafficking for the reasons outlined in my post at 21:13.

Why are you apparently sneering about the armed forces?!

They can that without these laws. They can enforce the law and resource it. But they don't.

It does doesn't it because at the same time as all the Gary L fans are calling us all Nazis and remembering the war, people like you are sneering contemptuously at the armed forces. Without them you would be speaking German.

Very few men are ‘trafficked’.

In every crime structure you get the ‘grunts’ lower down. Doesn’t mean they’re ‘trafficked’, they just know that is what they need to say if caught.

Yes, but by opening up safe routes not by declaring them criminals and shipping them off to Rwanda.
Its inhuman,immoral and illegal.

Are they?

Do you think you might be somewhat exagerating in that statement?

No, in the war there was conscription. We defended ourselves, because it was necessary. Don't you pull the us and them

Safe routes would only increase the number of migrants coming here and most people do not want that, for a multitude of valid reasons.

Surely the overlap isn't that he's suggesting Jewish people weren't citizens or were refugees, he isn't comparing refugees to Jews. He's highlighting the government's use of a minority group of people to create a scapegoat that makes the minority group themselves the problem that need to be sorted rather than the government policies (which they are responsible for) that created the problem FOR the minority group in the first place. Its the scapegoating behaviour that is reminiscent of 1930s Germany because that's exactly what happened. So he's not such a daft twat. And as for those saying the Tories aren't becoming increasingly right wing... if it walks like a duck...

No one on this thread had called anyone else on this thread a Nazi.

These are some of the pictures polls / articles I’ve seen

Britons tend to hold a positive view of some types of immigration. By 39% to 30% the public have a positive view of those moving to the UK looking for work, while by 38% to 24% they have a favourable opinion of those relocating from other countries to settle here with their families.

However, when it comes to those refugees taking the perilous journey across the Channel, a majority (55%) hold a negative view, with fewer than one in five (19%) holding a positive view

Would you support or oppose banning migrants who come to the UK in small boats from ever re-entering the UK, being able to settle permanently in the UK, and receiving British citizenship?

Majority strongly support and somewhat support

I think the pressure is there and increasing. Not on skilled migration but channel crossings.

The measures I support include putting in place systems whereby people can apply for asylum from elsewhere in the world,

It sounds good although not sure on practicalities, and I think safe routes are being added, but how would you deal with numbers? Is it unlimited or capped

As far as I'm concerned they are entitled to their opinion and shouldn't be censored or cancelled. I'm not in Gary's camp but I support his right to free speech .

Are you sure Moonicorn? My understanding is that a lot of men are trafficked into forced labour. In fact the majority of trafficking victims we see in forced labour situations are men. So I wouldn't for a second suggest that 'very few men are trafficked'.

If you're meaning a comparison to women being trafficked in general for sexual slavery or domestic slavery then I do see where you're coming from in that women are higher represented in those categories. But it doesn't mean there's very few men being trafficked.

And as for those saying the Tories aren't becoming increasingly right wing... if it walks like a duck...

Well that's enlightened us all hasn't it.

So are borders intrinsically right wing then? Is that for all countries or just the UK? What about Ukraine? Is their border right w

Well don't worry because Suella is anti free speech. She's pro leaving the ECHR (drafted by British lawyers) which contains that right.

So there you are. Vote Conservative to shut up because there's no basis in law for you to object. Next election