To tell you that a newly qualified doctor only earns £29k?

[Drstrike]

Doctors now leave medical school after 5/6 gruelling years of study - with £85k of student debt.

First year post-qualification is £29k, rising to £33k the following year. Then things stagnate around £40k whilst in specialty training.

The first year post-qualification is more supervised. But you are still the first doctor to be bleeped if one of your ward patients starts bleeding post-op, falls and hits their head, has chest pain etc. and you are the one to initiate management then contact your consultant to let them know. You are still covering wards overnight with seniors at a distance. You are still prescribing medications, ordering scans involving radiation, explaining plans to patients and families. You are still a fully qualified doctor - just not with full registration.

This salary is based on a 40-48 hour full time week depending on rota. That means you can be "part time" working 40hrs a week in a job like surgery.

It takes 5/6 years of medical school, 2 years of foundation training, 3 years of core training and 3 years of higher specialty training to become a consultant. That's a commitment of 13 years, generally from the age of 18.

During this time doctors have to pay for their own progression exams (£500-£1000 each).

There are out of hours premia for nights/weekends on top, but in specialties like psychiatry and GP only basic is earnt.

Does this shock you?

Thank you for what you do.

I think the NHS needs much more funding so you work conditions are better and that you should be paid more too. No doubt about it in my mind.

You should be embarrassed that you can't even string a sentence together! Go and troll off with your sad little emojis. And when you need a doctor, and you will one day, I just hope you get the same respect back.

@Teddybear120 I’m grateful that people like you still want to pursue this career, despite the adversity, as I know, whether we like to admit it, we all will require medical intervention.

This

Thought I asked you to trot off 🐎, not the sharpest pencil on the box are you ✏️

👋Bye bye now 😂

It's "pencil IN the box". I rest my case Einstein.

Exactly. Many people come out of Uni with the same level of debt but for a variety of reasons will never have the same earning capacity as a doctor.

But you don’t expect to get shit on.

No wonder they go to Oz!

It astounds me, I thought doctors/vets earned a comfortable salary. Government need to increase the salary and conditions, before the shit hits the fan.

Most people are NOT retired at 60, state retirement age is 66 and rising!
A lot of drs will retire by 60, because they can afford to...

I do have sympathy for drs but your argument about debt levels applies to all students and is a daft argument imo.

Scientists for example will often do a 3 or 4 year 1st degree, plus then a post graduate degree and then have a lack of job security.

I think offering the course for free, with a requirement to work in the nhs full time for 10 years (Inc junior Dr years and allowing for maternity periods) would mean that this level of pay would be acceptable based on potential earnings, as it is it is too low - particularly noting the hours these people put in.

It's called dyspraxia, Einstein. As I said shows the sort of person you are. How clever 🙄

I know no other students who have £80,000+ debt. Those who don't know how it works, you accrue 6% interest from the day you take out the loan. After 10 years, paying off what you owe, and assuming promotion every year, you will owe £120,000. What a fantastic system !

No pay rise, less doctors, system fails even more. More pay, more doctors stay in UK, less locums needed and system works. Simples.

Not RTFT but if doesn't shock me as I know doctors. I'm also not surprised that many people don't seem to care.

It feels like professions like medicine, nursing, teaching etc just don't feel respected, whereas they were once.

The huge recruitment issues we will face from people leaving these professions from burnout are already starting, but people won't realise the impact until it's too late sadly.

You only pay back something like 7% of your earnings for a period of 30 years then cancelled. Many doctors are from wrath backgrounds and won't have any maintenance loan/tuition fees paid. Of all the problems doctors may have, this is undoubtedly the least significant.

I took out a student loan of about £50k and it's fine. I'm not living in poverty because of it, barely realise it's there and I'm not on a doctors salary.

Good point. I'm perfectly happy, in fact I prefer it, when I get an appointment confirmation as an email or text, but my parents (late 80s/early 90s) don't use mobiles, never mind smart phones, so write appointments down in paper diaries. This will die out as we all get older, though.

£29k is well below UK average. Truck drivers are earning £50k+.

A bricklayer could earn £45k working on main contractor jobs.

You’re not being unreasonable . It’s shocking. Remember googling this when I was a newly qualified band 5 in nhs - and seeing that they only earned 2k more than I did. I think the point is you reaaaaallly need to want to do it. And, I imagine there’s a lot more/ faster career progression/ payrises than nurses/AHPs x

£29k is well below UK average

Not for initially qualified people it isn't

Some.of us like and are very good at what we do (I am actually a very good GP) once upon a time. But now we feel devalued and disrespected at best, hated and abused at worst.
Pay cuts, below inflation rises year on year, ever increasing workload coupled with this is the issue.
I think if we felt valued and appreciated. As it is we don't.
I don't want to do anything else. I have been a doctor for more than half my life. I just want to be appreciated and respected for my training and expertise. Not shat on every day.
So I am building a portfolio career and will leave the gruelling day job as soon as I can and retire as soon as I can. And I am not the only one. In fact pretty much every GP I know especially of my age (50s) says the same.
If you feel you can manage without us crack right on because that will be the end game

£29k is well below UK average. Truck drivers are earning £50k+

Glass door says £30k average
Jobted says £30K
indeed says £38K
check a salary says 27K

Would love to know where your pulling these figures from.

society is a jigsaw - each piece (role) is important .
Saying that I don't agree with footballers being paid millions of pounds to kick a ball of air around!

Doctors will pay back all their loan plus half again in interest.

Of course they can be paid more.

They are paid more elsewhere.

They are desirable elsewhere because of their level of education and training.

If you want British doctors a few decades from now, at any stage of their profession, investment in doctors is needed. It's short sighted in the extreme, in fact a complete denial of reality, to insist they put up with pay and conditions that make it so hard for them to get through their training and establish their careers when there are places abroad where they would be welcomed with open arms and cpuld earn a lot more, earlier in their careers.

Great lecture, but oh dear, they left the room and got on the next plane to Oz.