To tell you that a newly qualified doctor only earns £29k?

[Drstrike]

Doctors now leave medical school after 5/6 gruelling years of study - with £85k of student debt.

First year post-qualification is £29k, rising to £33k the following year. Then things stagnate around £40k whilst in specialty training.

The first year post-qualification is more supervised. But you are still the first doctor to be bleeped if one of your ward patients starts bleeding post-op, falls and hits their head, has chest pain etc. and you are the one to initiate management then contact your consultant to let them know. You are still covering wards overnight with seniors at a distance. You are still prescribing medications, ordering scans involving radiation, explaining plans to patients and families. You are still a fully qualified doctor - just not with full registration.

This salary is based on a 40-48 hour full time week depending on rota. That means you can be "part time" working 40hrs a week in a job like surgery.

It takes 5/6 years of medical school, 2 years of foundation training, 3 years of core training and 3 years of higher specialty training to become a consultant. That's a commitment of 13 years, generally from the age of 18.

During this time doctors have to pay for their own progression exams (£500-£1000 each).

There are out of hours premia for nights/weekends on top, but in specialties like psychiatry and GP only basic is earnt.

Does this shock you?

www.bma.org.uk/pay-and-contracts/pay/junior-doctors-pay-scales/pay-scales-for-junior-doctors-in-england

But surely you don't go into medicine without knowing it will be a very hard slog up front?

Not really, but I think there are some outrageous salaries in the NHS for some of the desk jobs.

No.

A lot of professions are like this, you work hard for bad money at the start, but by ten years in you are earning far more than the average wage. Ten years after that you are doing even better.

When I was a junior lawyer I went to a protest to support an increase the pay for school teachers. Imagine my shock when they read out what graduate teachers earn (in outrage because it was so low) and i realised it was far far far more than I earned. I wondered when teachers were going to take to the streets to increase my pay .

Cut to 15 years later and my friends who are teachers have a very clear earning ceiling that they hit some time ago, and my wage is much higher.

That's the nature of the beast. When you are junior in a profession you are learning - the money comes later.

Doctors go into it knowing they'll have to give cancer diagnoses to young people, do unsuccessful CPR on a patient they've come to really care for, order x-rays for babies who've been abused, go a 12 hr shift without a break, stand in theatre holding a retractor for the boss for 8 hours with their hands inside an abdomen, cannulate a patient with dementia while they scream and cry.

The hard stuff that goes with the job isn't the problem. It's the way the NHS has tried to get doctors to miss their own weddings and the poor pay that doesn't respect the responsibility.

I honestly think that fine. They've been trained (mostly) by the taxpayer and are on a trajectory for big money if they want it.

All entry level jobs with good career paths have low starting salaries

I am shocked it's so low, but as others have said, it is the same in many professions where the rewards come with greater experience. What does a consultant earn, out of interest? I imagine that being quite highly paid.

They've not been trained by the taxpayer, they've had to take £85k in student loans

Yes but their training has cost a lot more than that, which is why I said mostly.

I greatly appreciate medical staff but to feel bad that a student doctor has a loan ... nah. We all have to make sacrifices, some of them are choices.

So what, do you want me too feel sorry for them. Student loans only get paid back when you earn enough and inline with your pay.

Their earning potential later in life is huge so no I don't care.

If things continue as they are, our entire medical workforce will be international graduates. Because doctors are choosing to leave due to poor conditions.

Please support the junior doctors.

I left 2 years ago as I couldn't give anymore of my life to such a demoralising and terribly managed career.

More will follow and the NHS will collapse.

Do you know how much it costs us to train Doctors? The amount of debt is a drop in the ocean compared to in the USA though…
starting salaries rise tho - I have quite a few Dr friends from GPS to consultants, none of them are struggling for moneyC they’re all very well off.
not an easy job though. I’ll give you that.

I hope you never need a doctor.

No it doesn't shock me. Are we meant to just be discovering that now?

Send fair enough for first year but I'd have hoped progression in pay would happen a bit steeper after that

Pretty sure that won't happen when 22,000 UK applicants chase 6,000 places each year.

If you think a doctor ought to be paid the same as someone who collects bins, I'm afraid you're not someone who can be reasoned with.

So starting at the national average salary that many people will never get to. Doesn't seem bad to me tbh. Lots of responsible jobs pay less and its similar ar to established OTs, nurses,teachers etc.

Remember this is literally their starting salary. It goes up. Really not a problem - not sure you'll get music support - "we start on a good basic salary wow is me?"

Yeh how lowly they are.... Beneath you. 🙄

What is the full time pay after 5 years, and after 10 years?

I thought the problems in recruitment and retention for schools and nhs was more about working conditions than pay. I definitely think conditions in both sectors are a serious problem that need to be addressed.

£40k while training seems a decent salary.

@SeasonFinale doesn't help when so many of those 6000 places will leave to work elsewhere (either doctor in better supportive countries, or banking in England), and when none of those 6000 want to train in certain specialties like GP as it's so crap.