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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Issue with neighbour

129 replies

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 13:43

My husband and I recently moved into what I suppose you would call a triplex apartment (we have neighbours who live upstairs and below). In the contract we signed, the landlord was very strict about no smoking and no dogs in the building, which is perfect since we're nonsmokers and we have a 2.5 year old son. The first day we moved in, the entrance smelled strongly of cigarette smoke which I was disappointed about since one of the reasons we chose this particular building was it's no smoking policy. We weren't sure which neighbour it was, so we messaged the landlord who immediately got back to us and said he would contact the tenants to remind them not to smoke. Afterwards, the downstairs neighbour approached my husband (she lives with her boyfriend and two kids, around 9/10 years old), and apologised for having smoked inside. She said she usually smokes on the balcony, but she was drunk celebrating the New Year. We said no problem, but then a few weeks later the entrance smelled of smoke again. It was a really cold day, so we guessed she just didn't want to go out on her balcony to smoke. Even still, my son's health is really important to me, and since the landlord was coming to visit us about another issue, my husband once again mentioned it to him. Again, he reminded the neighbours not to smoke. Since then, the woman neighbour doesn't smile or return our greetings, so I'm guessing she's pissed we 'snitched' on her. Not long after, they got a dog which is also against the building rules. The dog occasionally barks and whines, and has almost woken DS up from his naps during the weekend, and it also barks at us when we're getting into our car and it's tethered on a leash outside. My son is well behaved for a toddler and rarely throws tantrums, and if he does we deal with it pretty quickly. However, he is an early riser, and he is usually up between 5-6am most mornings. When he wakes up, I try and keep him occupied in his room with his toys and whatnot and stop him from making too much noise until it's time to get dressed and have breakfast, but he's still an active toddler, and sometimes he'll drop a toy on the floor, or run around. On two occasions now, the neighbour below has banged on her ceiling when my son was being 'too noisy.' It happened again this morning when he ran from his room to the kitchen (he wasn't wearing shoes, he was still in his pjs), and it was 6:20. It's half-term here so the neighbour's kids will be off school and I guess the neighbour was still in bed, but my toddler doesn't know that! It really pissed my husband off that she knocked, so he knocked back. I'm not a confrontational person and I was hoping to have good relations with our neighbours. I also thought she would be more understanding having two kids of her own. Like, how quiet were her kids when they were toddlers? Has anyone been in a similar situation and do you think she's overreacting? I now dread the early mornings and I panic every time DS makes a noise, thinking the neighbour is going to make a complaint. If she does, then I'll be tempted to tell the landlord about their pet dog!

OP posts:
harriethoyle · 27/02/2023 15:56

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes OP. PP nailed it saying you set the tone and now you're stuck with it.

SeasonFinale · 27/02/2023 15:57

Totally with you OP and I would report the dog too. People should stick to the terms of their lease . There are valid reasons why they are in the lease. If the neighbour is being an arsehole to you, then you don't owe then the courtesy of turning a blind eye tk their breach.

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 15:58

tattygrl · 27/02/2023 15:53

Nobody cares about the dog, OP! You're dodging the fact that you reported your neighbours twice without so much as a knock on their door first. That's a pretty hostile thing to do. Did you think about the impact it could have on them? If someone reported me to my landlord I'd be so panicked. I'm not absolving them of anything - clearly they don't respect the lease or their neighbours, and that's shit. But it's not that everyone here loves dogs and hates noisy toddlers. The root of the issue is how it started with you and your neighbours.

I know, and I already said that I wish we'd done things differently. We weren't sure which neighbour it was and we were busy with the move etc., so it was easier to simply message the landlord. Also, I was kinda pissed that the neighbour told us she wouldn't smoke inside again, but then went ahead and smoked anyway!

OP posts:
helloimnew123 · 27/02/2023 15:58

tattygrl · 27/02/2023 15:53

Nobody cares about the dog, OP! You're dodging the fact that you reported your neighbours twice without so much as a knock on their door first. That's a pretty hostile thing to do. Did you think about the impact it could have on them? If someone reported me to my landlord I'd be so panicked. I'm not absolving them of anything - clearly they don't respect the lease or their neighbours, and that's shit. But it's not that everyone here loves dogs and hates noisy toddlers. The root of the issue is how it started with you and your neighbours.

They obviously didn't care, as they did it again a few weeks later... she's not saying she wants to be best friends with her neighbour, she just doesn't want them banging on her floor.

Fine she reported them but she's not been confrontational.

tattygrl · 27/02/2023 16:00

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 15:58

I know, and I already said that I wish we'd done things differently. We weren't sure which neighbour it was and we were busy with the move etc., so it was easier to simply message the landlord. Also, I was kinda pissed that the neighbour told us she wouldn't smoke inside again, but then went ahead and smoked anyway!

In that case, why not extend the olive branch?

Maybe if the neighbour didn't feel resentful (or whatever) towards you, she'd make more of an effort to pop outside for a smoke (as she should). I wonder if she's continuing to smoke inside because in her head she's going "eff you" to you and your DH.

Why not knock with a bottle of wine or something, say you think you got off on the wrong foot, and that you don't want to make life difficult for either of you living there. You could apologise for the noise, explain why you went straight to reporting the smoking (in your words, overwhelmed with the stress of moving), and see how receptive she is. If she continues to be an arsehole, well, what can you do. Report away if you want to. But it could be a turning point and make life nice for the lot of you.

tattygrl · 27/02/2023 16:01

tattygrl · 27/02/2023 16:00

In that case, why not extend the olive branch?

Maybe if the neighbour didn't feel resentful (or whatever) towards you, she'd make more of an effort to pop outside for a smoke (as she should). I wonder if she's continuing to smoke inside because in her head she's going "eff you" to you and your DH.

Why not knock with a bottle of wine or something, say you think you got off on the wrong foot, and that you don't want to make life difficult for either of you living there. You could apologise for the noise, explain why you went straight to reporting the smoking (in your words, overwhelmed with the stress of moving), and see how receptive she is. If she continues to be an arsehole, well, what can you do. Report away if you want to. But it could be a turning point and make life nice for the lot of you.

*in your words, weren't sure which neighbour it was, etc. Misremembered a previous comment.

caramac04 · 27/02/2023 16:07

Of course your neighbour should abide by the rules but tbh I wouldn’t report her having a dog.
You’ve got off on the wrong foot and it might be in your interests to build bridges.
Could you ask her how your day to day noise impacts on her? Is the flat carpeted? Hard flooring can be hellish noisy.
I would speak to her about the noise and hopefully be able to discuss your concerns about the smoking. Explain you can hear the dog but accept it’s not excessive and hopefully she will accept your noise. Life is a compromise no matter what we would like.

jannier · 27/02/2023 16:37

Is your floor wood or tiles? If so noise carries really badly so I'd ask the landlord about carpets or lay rugs.....no body wants to be woken at that hour one run along a floor or not....you walking along, any TV etc will carry...
The smoking I'd hate but I'd have explained to the neighbour the health issue....for my mum one whiff would have hospitalised her 9 times out of 10.
The dog wouldn't bother me unless it barked all day or early morning late evening

Cantseethewoodforthetree · 27/02/2023 17:19

im not sure about how laws apply in Canada, but the unicef rights of a child apply in the UK allowing children to do child like things - like getting up at 5:30am - and there is nothing the neighbours can complain about. I think that’s a good thing. As long as you try to prevent them from making a ridiculous amount of noise you shouldn’t have to be stressed the whole time about the noise your normal kids are making.

the neighbours on the other hand have breached their tenancy agreement and I’d be straight on to the landlord. Sod them.

GabriellaMontez · 27/02/2023 17:25

She needs to move to a building that allows smoking and dogs.

I'd contact the landlord.

A child may be noisy but they're allowed! And, he won't be a toddler forever.

WonderingWanda · 27/02/2023 17:53

This all sounds like part of the problem with living in flats. When you have people living above you every footstep sounds like banging or running even if the person upstairs is being fairly quiet and just walking. Likewise, dogs barking, talking, televisions and music. It's the same in terraced housing and is why most people aspire to having their own detached house.

I think that your neighbours sound like people who don't give a shit about the rules and are now pissed off you complained so will take any opportunity to get back at you with banging on the ceiling. This was inevitable from the moment you noticed they were smoking even though it's against the rules. If reporting the the landlord doesn't result in them being kicked out then I would start looking for somewhere else.

Maray1967 · 27/02/2023 17:59

Barannca · 27/02/2023 14:28

I think people are giving you a hard time OP.
OP said she chose the flat because the landlord said they did not allow smoking in the building or dogs. The neighbour does smoke in the building and has a dog. The OP has a child and children are allowed in the building. The OP is within her rights to complain but she hasn't complained about the dog presumably if she did the other tenants would be evicted.
It's the neighbours who are not abiding by the terms of the contract not the OP. She has a child and children do sometimes make a noise. People living in flats have to accept that. But you don't expect to have smoking or dogs in a building that doesn't allow smoking or dogs .

Yes, agreed. I would report the dog straightaway and any further smoking.
Id also put rugs down to try to reduce toddler noise and train him not to run in the house for safety as much as anything else.

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 17:59

WonderingWanda · 27/02/2023 17:53

This all sounds like part of the problem with living in flats. When you have people living above you every footstep sounds like banging or running even if the person upstairs is being fairly quiet and just walking. Likewise, dogs barking, talking, televisions and music. It's the same in terraced housing and is why most people aspire to having their own detached house.

I think that your neighbours sound like people who don't give a shit about the rules and are now pissed off you complained so will take any opportunity to get back at you with banging on the ceiling. This was inevitable from the moment you noticed they were smoking even though it's against the rules. If reporting the the landlord doesn't result in them being kicked out then I would start looking for somewhere else.

We really like it here, the location is perfect and I love our apartment. It's cozy, in a nice residential area with a primary school just down the road, and it's near my husband's family. No way are we moving! We will try and make a few changes (buy some rugs for DS' room etc), and hopefully he will start sleeping in later. We haven't smelled any smoke since the landlord spoke to them about it the second time so hopefully they got the message. I feel bad for their two kids since my mum would smoke inside when I was little and it wasn't until I developed breathing problems that she stopped! If the neighbours below want to smoke and not be disturbed by people walking around upstairs, then they're welcome to move!

OP posts:
SunshineLoving · 27/02/2023 18:04

The smoke in the hallway would very much annoy me too. If you don't smoke, you don't want to be breathing in someone else's fumes and you definitely don't want your children breathing it in.

I would definitely ignore the dog.

Pp's suggestion about taking a bottle of wine round and apologising for getting off on the wrong foot is a good idea. You could go and explain that you were annoyed about the smoking as that's the reason you chose the flat but you don't want to have any tension. If you do extend an olive branch like this, make it clear that you don't want the smoking inside. You don't want to risk her thinking that now you've apologised and been nice, that the smoking inside is acceptable.

TheShellBeach · 27/02/2023 18:09

If the neighbours below want to smoke and not be disturbed by people walking around upstairs, then they're welcome to move!

Wow.
They are welcome to move but you're staying put, with your son thundering around all day, disturbing them and waking them up in the middle of the night.

Don't you see how selfish this is of you?

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 18:12

TheShellBeach · 27/02/2023 18:09

If the neighbours below want to smoke and not be disturbed by people walking around upstairs, then they're welcome to move!

Wow.
They are welcome to move but you're staying put, with your son thundering around all day, disturbing them and waking them up in the middle of the night.

Don't you see how selfish this is of you?

Seriously have you read any of my posts? He isn't 'thundering' around all day and night! He attends nursery full-time during the week, and when he comes home, he has a snack while I read to, then we do playtime in his bedroom until 5:30, when it's dinner, bath and he's in bed sleeping by 8:30! He sleeps through the night, and if he wakes up, he stays in bed and calls out for me, and I'm with him straight away! Yes, he's an early riser, but I also try and keep noise to a minimum as best I can until it's a more reasonable time. I never knew mumsnet was THIS judgey!

OP posts:
PretendingToBeStupid · 27/02/2023 18:21

You should tell your landlord about the terrible treatment you've had in this thread.

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 18:26

TheShellBeach · 27/02/2023 18:09

If the neighbours below want to smoke and not be disturbed by people walking around upstairs, then they're welcome to move!

Wow.
They are welcome to move but you're staying put, with your son thundering around all day, disturbing them and waking them up in the middle of the night.

Don't you see how selfish this is of you?

Also it isn't selfish of my neighbours to breach the terms of their contract and smoke in their flat when they have kids, and the tenants in the floors above do?

OP posts:
Ffsmakeitstop · 27/02/2023 18:32

We should change the name from Mumsnet to Mean girls Central.
You were perfectly in the right to report the smoking as it is against the rules and one of the reasons for you choosing the place. As for trying to appease the selfish mare no chance bugger that for a game of soldiers.

Nandocushion · 27/02/2023 18:34

Barannca · 27/02/2023 14:28

I think people are giving you a hard time OP.
OP said she chose the flat because the landlord said they did not allow smoking in the building or dogs. The neighbour does smoke in the building and has a dog. The OP has a child and children are allowed in the building. The OP is within her rights to complain but she hasn't complained about the dog presumably if she did the other tenants would be evicted.
It's the neighbours who are not abiding by the terms of the contract not the OP. She has a child and children do sometimes make a noise. People living in flats have to accept that. But you don't expect to have smoking or dogs in a building that doesn't allow smoking or dogs .

YANBU OP. And you're not misusing the term triplex - in North America we can use it the way you used it. Your mistake was complaining about a dog on Mumsnet.

You moved into the building in part because of the rules outlined in the contract, and one of your neighbours is breaking those rules. Inform your landlord as often as you need to (ie whenever the dog barks), in writing/email. I assume your contract does not say that children must be seen and not heard, so don't worry about normal family noise - put down a rug if you think they have a point.

Eventually the landlord may well evict them if they find it impossible to follow two extremely simple rules.

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 18:34

Ffsmakeitstop · 27/02/2023 18:32

We should change the name from Mumsnet to Mean girls Central.
You were perfectly in the right to report the smoking as it is against the rules and one of the reasons for you choosing the place. As for trying to appease the selfish mare no chance bugger that for a game of soldiers.

Thanks for your support. There are some really mean women on here. I thought mums would be there for each other! Reckon I'm just going to leave this thread and have a g&t

OP posts:
maddening · 27/02/2023 18:37

Growlybear83 · 27/02/2023 14:14

I think there's a big difference between having a dog which barks occasionally and having an odd cigarette and being woken up by noise from a toddler running around band dropping things at 6 in the morning! I'm not surprised that your neighbours have banged on the ceiling - I think many people would be banging on your door at that time!

A - there is bo indication that the toddler is making noise at a greater frequency than the dog.

B - the op is not complaining or banging on walls when the dog barks - she is stating that the neighbour is making noise but not accepting what is normal living noise.

C - both smoking and dogs are against the rules of that apartment block - toddlers are not.

GrumpyPanda · 27/02/2023 18:45

user01082312345 · 27/02/2023 18:34

Thanks for your support. There are some really mean women on here. I thought mums would be there for each other! Reckon I'm just going to leave this thread and have a g&t

I've been reading this thread and shaking my head in disbelief at some of the posters. I suspect you must have triggered some die-hard smokers and there's few people on earth as unreasonable and antisocial as that particular species. You did absolutely nothing wrong complaining about the smoking - especially if it's an older building it's horrendous how the stink just permeates every nook and cranny.

2pence · 27/02/2023 19:03

Just take it as a lesson learned. You started it by risking a good relationship over something petty and now the neighbours are joining in because your kid is waking them up at a horribly early time.

You don't know if they would have been this petty anyway but it sounds like tit for tat. At least they haven't reported you for noise. I wonder if this is because of the illicit dog.

I enjoy a bit of pettiness myself though so when they knock on the ceiling would be stomping loudly over to your toddlers room saying equally loudly, oh no, you've woken them downstairs, back to bed now rather than buying rugs to soften the noise.

You've got the upper hand with the knowledge of the dog if you want to up the pettiness but beware, this could escalate.

DoraSpenlow · 27/02/2023 19:19

I'm with you OP.

It beggars belief that someone signs an agreement for a lease which states, no smoking and no dogs. Then smokes and gets a dog!!

Just another example of the "I'll do what I like and sod everyone else" mentality so prevalent these days.