Issue with neighbour

[user01082312345]

My husband and I recently moved into what I suppose you would call a triplex apartment (we have neighbours who live upstairs and below). In the contract we signed, the landlord was very strict about no smoking and no dogs in the building, which is perfect since we're nonsmokers and we have a 2.5 year old son. The first day we moved in, the entrance smelled strongly of cigarette smoke which I was disappointed about since one of the reasons we chose this particular building was it's no smoking policy. We weren't sure which neighbour it was, so we messaged the landlord who immediately got back to us and said he would contact the tenants to remind them not to smoke. Afterwards, the downstairs neighbour approached my husband (she lives with her boyfriend and two kids, around 9/10 years old), and apologised for having smoked inside. She said she usually smokes on the balcony, but she was drunk celebrating the New Year. We said no problem, but then a few weeks later the entrance smelled of smoke again. It was a really cold day, so we guessed she just didn't want to go out on her balcony to smoke. Even still, my son's health is really important to me, and since the landlord was coming to visit us about another issue, my husband once again mentioned it to him. Again, he reminded the neighbours not to smoke. Since then, the woman neighbour doesn't smile or return our greetings, so I'm guessing she's pissed we 'snitched' on her. Not long after, they got a dog which is also against the building rules. The dog occasionally barks and whines, and has almost woken DS up from his naps during the weekend, and it also barks at us when we're getting into our car and it's tethered on a leash outside. My son is well behaved for a toddler and rarely throws tantrums, and if he does we deal with it pretty quickly. However, he is an early riser, and he is usually up between 5-6am most mornings. When he wakes up, I try and keep him occupied in his room with his toys and whatnot and stop him from making too much noise until it's time to get dressed and have breakfast, but he's still an active toddler, and sometimes he'll drop a toy on the floor, or run around. On two occasions now, the neighbour below has banged on her ceiling when my son was being 'too noisy.' It happened again this morning when he ran from his room to the kitchen (he wasn't wearing shoes, he was still in his pjs), and it was 6:20. It's half-term here so the neighbour's kids will be off school and I guess the neighbour was still in bed, but my toddler doesn't know that! It really pissed my husband off that she knocked, so he knocked back. I'm not a confrontational person and I was hoping to have good relations with our neighbours. I also thought she would be more understanding having two kids of her own. Like, how quiet were her kids when they were toddlers? Has anyone been in a similar situation and do you think she's overreacting? I now dread the early mornings and I panic every time DS makes a noise, thinking the neighbour is going to make a complaint. If she does, then I'll be tempted to tell the landlord about their pet dog!

Thanks for your comment! I haven't complained about the dog, nor am I going to! I only used it as an example that my neighbours also make noise but we tolerate it, yet they won't tolerate my toddler making noise. There is no tv/music playing early in the morning when he wake, and we hide his noisy toys. But it's impossible to keep him completely silent unless we muzzled him and tied him to a chair lol

Does it also mention the hideous racket made by toddlers running around in the middle of the night?

Because seriously, OP, to most people, 5 am is the middle of the night.

Nothing useful to add but I have a 2.5 year old DD and we live in a house so no one below us but, dear Lord, the racket that her tiny, unshod feet make when she’s trotting from one room to another make me so thankful I’m not inflicting that on anyone else because it IS objectionable even if it’s your own child. Some kids are just heavy footed and, shoes or no shoes, it’s not something anyone wants echoing from the floor above at 5:30am to be fair.

Your health isn't being put at risk from the smell of one cigarette a month. Also reporting her after new year eve? What a killjoy.

You saying your son doesn't run about all day means eff all. It's him doing it at silly o clock hat is the issue. I'd rather live next door to them than you.

The shell beach, my son does not make 'hideous racket' in the middle of the night. He is in bed by 8:30 and sleeps through (if he wakes he simply calls 'mama' and I'm right there with him putting him back to sleep. He wakes around 5:30, and like I said we try and keep noise to a minimum. This morning he ran ONCE from his bedroom to the kitchen. He was in his pjs, so no shoes. And the time was 6:20am so certainly not the middle of the night. Stop exaggerating my post.

Tbh it sounds like you’re not suited to living in such close quarters with neighbours, this sounds standard for living in a flat. You caused the issue by repeatedly complaining about someone smoking, your neighbour is now retaliating. Perhaps find somewhere a bit more suitable in the near future, this won’t have a happy ending.

I agree with @Barannca , the OP chose her apartment based on certain factors, her neighbours could have chosen to do the same.

When I lived in flats when I was younger I chose the top floor precisely because I didn't want noise from floors above me.

I also chose non smoking accomodations as I find the smell of cigarette smoke pretty grim, for no other reason than I think it stinks (to me) and that's okay, I made my choices based on my preferences.

If the OPs neighbour doesn't want to get cold when she smokes she should move somewhere she can smoke inside or find a way to be warmer on her balcony.

Likewise if the neighbour wants a dog she should look for somewhere that allows dogs.

But the OP isn't unreasonable to be annoyed that the terms of the tenancy aren't being held by the neighbour and it's impacting her.

It sounds like you're trying to keep your child quiet and humans do make noise and there is nothing to preclude you from having kids in your tenancy I'd guess.

I'm trying my best. I wish we could afford a detached house somewhere in the countryside but we can't. I keep my son in his room when he wakes and we play on his bed and I try and keep noise to a minimum. Like I said, he ran once from his room to the kitchen at 6:20. He attends nursery on weekdays and at weekends we go out or plan activities or take him to see family, so it's not all day everyday they have to 'endure' him running around like some feral cat!

Oh so the dog’s occasional barks have ‘almost’ woken your DS up from his naps have they? 😂 Maybe if the dog tries a bit harder your kid would actually wake up and perhaps not be running around waking the neighbours at 5am. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Read my post. I didn't complain about the dog. I was using it as an example that they make noise (their dog barks, they shout at it and they argue, occasionally slam doors etc) but we tolerate that! They won't however tolerate my toddler making a little disturbance, which I try my best to control and minimise. I only complained about their persistent smoking since the smell was seeping into our apartment and I don't wish my 2.5 year old son to breathe in any toxic fumes.

You are willfully ignoring the issue by saying it's not all day. I'll say this AGAIN.

It's him doing it at silly o clock that is the issue. If they banged on he ceiling at 6.20AM, it's because you woke them up. You are being more inconsiderate than them. You live in flats, you need to be realistic.

I definitely prefer my dog to some random child, but if I lived in a flat or other property where dogs and smoking were prohibited, I wouldn't get a dog or smoke indoors! Doesn't seem that complicated, really. Any other time, people on here would be falling over themselves to say that no-one has the right to expect silence when they live in proximity to other people, OP.

At this point, the relationship with your neighbour has already soured, so I'd do what you feel is right, regarding reporting the dog and any further smoking. On the subject of noise, I'd deal with that on a day-to-day basis. Try to keep noise down to a reasonably level on your side, try to accept minor noise on their side, and just do the best you can.

A duplex apartment is a flat on two floors. So I presume a triplex is a flat on 3 floors. Not what the OP is describing

Yeah it's a second floor flat. I'm in Quebec so they use different terms here.

I do sympathise with you OP, but I think a PP nailed it when they said "you've set the tone". Instantly escalating to landlord (which could have potentially had bad consequences for the neighbour) is a pretty unfriendly move. It's not that you aren't entitled to do that, of course you are, but it was a choice you made, and it didn't exactly create a friendly, laid-back impression. Not only that but you did it a second time, going straight to landlord. Again, that could have been really problematic for your neighbour. I consider reporting to a shared landlord a pretty last-resort option to be honest, considering it could affect someone's tenancy. Unfortunately it seems like the tone has continued to remain rather intolerant.

I agree with this unfortunately. These issues are very standard in apartment blocks. In fact I'd say you'd be very lucky to find one that doesn't have the same or equivalent issues. It's incredibly close-quartered living and rubbing along with other peoples' sounds and smells is one of the downsides. Most people find that mildly annoying as a baseline, but I think if it really distresses you it might be better to find an alternative if at all possible.

Yes looking back now I wish we'd approached the neighbour first, but we weren't sure which neighbour it was and we were incredibly busy with the move, looking after DS, and doing our full-time jobs that it seemed easier to simply message the landlord.

I'm not going to report the dog, never was. I kinda feel bad for it though, since it's one of those sheepdog types and they don't walk it enough. Whenever it barks they shout at it, and one really cold days (it can get to -20 here), they simply tie it up outside so it can do its business.

I hope that one day DS sleeps in a little later, but until then I'll continue trying my best as a mum. I know it's a 'silly o'clock' time for DS to be up, believe me I wish he wasn't up so early! I can only try my best. We were hoping to buy a house but my husband lost his job while I was pregnant, so yeah life happens and you just have to deal with it the best way you can. I was hoping for a little more understanding, advice and reassurance from other mums on this board but I guess not. Hope you all have a nice day anyways!

Poor dog.

Although a toddler isn't against the rules

OP I also think you're also getting a hard time by the PP that are conveniently ignoring the fact that dogs are not permitted in your building and are downplaying dogs 'occasional' barking. Guaranteed they're the same ppl that allow their unleashed dogs to rugby tackle children to floor and climb up strangers whilst claiming 'they won't hurt you, they're fine, they're just being friendly' 😂

Sounds like the relationship with the neighbour has soured, so I'd just report it to your landlord (as is within your rights). If the neighbours want to keep their dog then they should find a home that allows it (which is what they should have done in the first place).

Having a quiet toddler isn't a prerequisite of your contract so you've done nothing wrong, but anything you can do to minimise the disturbance first thing to your neighbours should be considered.

but we don't complain

But you did. Twice about the smoking.

On what planet is five in the morning an acceptable time to be woken up by a toddler running around?
Every day?
Because I go to bed at 11 pm and sleep till 8 am, and 5 am is definitely in the middle of the night to me and to most reasonable people.
Stop minimizing, OP.
Your child is being noisy. Every day.
I pity your neighbours.

I meant we don't complain about the noise the neighbours make, which they can actually control (they shout at the dog and argue loudly, for example). I can't help my toddler waking up so early. I've tried putting him to bed later, giving him breakfast later, moving his nap times (which is difficult since he attends nursery full-time), but to no avail. I try my best to keep him as quiet as I can when he wakes early. What else do you suggest I do?

Neighbours should not be banging on walls and ceilings, that's just immature. You have a toddler, OP. Toddlers shouldn't have to watch their step so the neighbours don't complain. It's pressure for you too. Maybe look for a ground floor apartment? Sometimes it's easier for your own sanity to bite the bullet and move? Your child should be moving, dancing and enjoying himself and you do not need to be keeping him immobile until the neighbours decide to wake up. He's developing and should be allowed to do so. Don't understand the negative comments tbh.