There is no way the government can let these next lot of nurses strikes go ahead

[fissty]

They are going to have to back down.

During the last lot of strikes we put forward certain cases for derogation (ie cases we wanted excluded from strike actions and staffed) ie emergency operating lists which always run 24/7, big complex surgeries (I put one forward for a complex case involving 6 consultants which had been 3 months in the planning and it was refused). The only thing we had running was one emergency theatre which had life and limb cases only on the day (so nothing pre booked). All cancer, all paeds, all other cases cancelled.

now the RCN are coming out saying they are going to be stricter with what they allow to run this time, the government are going to have to back down. How can they not?? It was literally life or limb last time!

I support the strikes, I went out on the picket with them last time, surely the government are going to have to capitulate now?

I personally think the Conservatives know they are fucked at the next election so are holding out on all of this to leave a big steaming pile of shit for labour to clean up when they are voted in. Election needs to happen in the next 18 months.

Their hope will be Labour then quickly lose popularity as they will probably need to raise taxes to pay for salaries.so the Conservatives get voted in again the election after that.

None of it is about making life better for the actual voters, its all about power.

Sad as it is, if people come to harm as a result of the strikes, the right-wing rags like the Fail will have big headlines blaming it on the nurses and the people will just lap it up

There’s no hope while the Government controls the narrative through the media, as evidenced by comments on this thread about public sector pay rises increasing inflation. No, that’s just what they want you to think!

If they stopped paying for agency staff for both hospitals and schools they'd have more than enough money for a huge pay rise for both sectors. They won't though as private business profiting from our basic rights makes them cum.

I'm sick of these strikes. They are getting us nowhere. On strike days they cancel all our surgery. And then throw staff at us, so we are better staffed than normal. So we sit around eating McDonald's breakfasts because we've got about four patients. If they were going to have an impact. The first ones would have worked.

There were approximately very few people on the picket line last time, compared your first ones.

This is exactly why, whilst currently on maternity leave, as a nurse I plan to cut my hours when I go back and join an agency to make up any money I need. More pay for less hours worked but still have the back up of a minimum number with the T&Cs of an NHS contract. That's unless they continue to completely ignore the fact they have destroyed the service and we leave the county all together. They forget nurses are needed elsewhere in the world with better T&Cs and are all degree level (something the Tories brought in) so have qualifications to leave and work in places like Australia and New Zealand..... won't have much of a health service if lots of us do that and they cannot recruit nurses in this country

The government don't care, they will just sit back and watch us all turn on each other. Then they will profit as they pick up any pieces.

The NHS isn't in a mess because of government. A lot of the issues are lack of personal responsibility for health and misusing the NGS and ambulance service.

Nurses are not badly paid. They are overworked.

The Govt will blame the Nurses for longer waiting lists and waiting times, aided by right wing media anti nhs / nurse headlines.

I said at the beginning of this that they will not back down.

I hope they act soon.
Wondering if every health profession in the same banding would get the rise of granted or they will make something specific just for nurses.

I agree with this. I'm pretty certain that we will have Boris Fucking Johnson as PM again after a one-term Labour government.

Have you tried working in the NHS op? Well until you have you don't get to tell nurses what they should do. There are 40000 that's 40 thousand registered nurse vacancies. Ask yourself why.

I do both. And we have agency staff on my ward as well. It's not always double the wage. It depends on the agency. And anyone can join an agency if they choose too. I work full time on my ward then pick up an extra shift if I want to.

I want the nurses and others delivering my healthcare to not be burnt out and stretched too thin so they can give the best possible care! I hate that striking seems to be the only way to get the point across.

I'd be interested to know if our rates of "people not taking responsibility for their health" are really significantly different from other Western nations. I don't think that expecting people to not become ill or injured is a very realistic way to run a health service. I don't disagree that people should try to take care of themselves, but I also think we need to be pragmatic.

@secretmumofthree do it. It's very easy money. Though one agency that's well paid takes six months to get signed off. So I'd get on with it now.

The strikes only make headlines if there is no other news, last one I think was at the same time as the earthquake so wasn't really in the news.

The point is that if the NHS paid nurses properly in the first place, they could do away with the need to have as many agency staff, which would save them money in agency fees.

Or if the use of external agencies was banned and the flexible staffing needs managed in house so that there was no company getting a profit out of this and all staff got paid the same

The government won't back down. Inflation is beginning to fall. If they back down for nurses it would cost billions. Then what about Teachers. Civil Servants have only had 2 percent. They have been on pay freezes and 1 percent for about 6 years now. If they give in to nurses demands of 17.6 percent it means no money left at all for others like Police, Firemen/women, Teachers or Civil Servants to have anything. It is a rediculous demand. In the UK in general most pay deals are between 2 and 5 percent this year. We'd all like 17.6 percent but it is unrealistic and nurses who think they will get it are living in fantasy land. Best bet is to get inflation down so everyone's life gets a bit easier.

@caringcarer Private sector pay deals average 8%, BT agreed 16% !

As i said earlier, there was the money to continue the triple lock for 12.1 million pensioners... at 10.1%.

Inflation plus 5% isn't an unreasonable demand but as you think it isn't, how would you address retention etc?

But the real issue here is the Govt refusing to even engage in talks on pay...

If you think the government will agree to an inflationary pay deal for one section of the public sector, then you are living in cloud cookoo land. And on a personal level, I work in ICU ( just come off a night duty ) and I would NEVER EVER go on strike because patients would die. In fact I would go further. If you, as a nurse, are willing to see people suffer and potentially lose their lives, then you are in the wrong job.

Nursing is doing a great job of flagging itself as a problem profession & the nhs will find ways around using them. Ways we haven’t thought of yet will be invented.

”oh woe is me I can’t survive on band 5” 🙄 give over.

The miners thought they were indispensable too.

Under agenda for change they’d have to, that’s what the whole idea of afc was sold as when it came in.

Yes im old enough to remember afc coming in.

The government can't prevent union members from striking, it's their right under law. The only people with the power to stop the strikes are the union members themselves. All the government can do is try to change the legislation to make striking more difficult, hopefully they can get that into law as soon as possible.

On a top band five, working FULL time, with two children I qualified for universal credit.... and that's acceptable for a degree level qualified professional how?? Universal credit is there to top up LOW wages! Let's face it though, the only way this government will listen to us if is one of these top politicians is directly affected by lack of care. And for all the private health care available in this country emergency care cannot be sought privately. Maybe that will be what it takes 🙄