15 minute cities and the conspirators

[ivykaty44]

15 minute cities being organised to mean that you don't have to rely on a car to get to everything and can easily walk to many places therefore only have to use the car for longer journeys

the conspiracy theories im seeing on social media are suggesting its a world wide control formula and we will be fined for moving from one district to another.

www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2023/02/08/15-minute-city-conspiracy-theories-insane-says-15-minute-city-creator/?sh=121378916156

I'm wondering if the car manufactures are behind the conspiracy, as they would have a lot to lose if people live in places where they don't need a car and can just ave one family car or hire a car. Billions of sales could be lost if this takes off.

Some cities have gone car free - theculturetrip.com/europe/spain/articles/the-car-free-spanish-city/ and found after much objection, that it works well - especially for the elderly

@ExistenceOptional my local pub is a Wetherspoons too! It's great.

The issues you describe are things the 15 min city concept is trying to address. Wouldn't it be nice to have more things nearer to you?

Of course population density will mostly dictate what can be supported in a 15 min walking distance. But a pub, a few local shops, a post office etc.. should be an aspiration for a lot of places. Plenty of small villages and towns used to support such retail parades.

This is how it used to be. Even in my rural village growing up we had a hardware store, postoffice, news agent and mini market - when I was very young you could add on a butcher and bakery too!

Now there's just the mini market, and a cafe (nice to get a cafe I suppose)

I've lived in cities other places, and in all of them, living non-centrally, I could still walk to get pretty much anything I needed day to day. Its better when you can wander down the road and get a pint of milk rather than having to drive to a supermarket once a week.

I live very rurally now, but when I lived closer into town, I could walk to 2 different mini-mall type places in 20 mins, I could get to a local shop in 5, and public transport in 15. If I had chosen a closer school for my kids I wouldn't have needed a car at all.

Those who say this isn't possible- how do you explain the countless places where it does work?

Is there something wrong with Brits than we need to drive everywhere?

@ivykaty44 You wondered why people are reacting the way they are? I don't believe in conspiracy theories around this. But I know I am reacting in a bloody hell way, because it just feels like one extra major stress being imposed at a time when many of us are already struggling loads. And a major stress being introduced that will make the air cleaner but bring no real benefits to families like mine. We are not the target market of benefit. Middle class families living in nice neighbourhoods are the beneficiaries.

And those who can't afford a car or can't drive for medical reasons?

Based on how many sections of new ring road will have to be built from scratch around here to facilitate this, and how many of the city car parks are now being sold off for housing (because they apparently won’t be needed), I’d say it’s far more likely to be someone on the local councils with shares in a building company pushing for this. We don’t seem to have the ‘lock in’ conspiracy theorists here though, we do, however, have a lot of people wondering why so many green spaces and villages on the edge of the city will be built on and irreversibly changed for something that is supposed to be of environmental benefit…

@QuertyGirl Plenty of places on the continent still have markets, independent greengrocers and butchers, decent bakeries. We have ladbrokes, a Tesco Express or Iceland, a nail bar and charity shops. That is the major difference. And that is why this will only benefit middle class neighbourhoods while making life harder everywhere else.

Buses - I used to rely on them. Make them better.
My DH and DD are disabled. Taxis are essential for DD. But they all involve going further than 15 minutes walk.
Even the cemetery that I go to frequently is further away than 15 minutes walk as the small local one in the churchyard was full up decades ago.

Why do you think that is? Possibly because people continued to use those shops.

Also 15 min cities won't force you to stay in your neighbourhood, just have a framework to improve it.

But fine, stay unhappy and miserable convinced nothing can be improved..

Yeah—they want to expand their workforce and their life sciences sector but they can’t build new houses for employees within their city limits. So they have pushed their housing needs onto the districts and we have huge estates. But then they don’t want people driving into the city. Everyone must go on the ring road, which is already choked. There are buses. Sometimes.

They want us working in Oxford but commuting via teleportation.

It's not just the bike, it's having the right sort of clothing. Layered clothing, decent waterproof and windproof coats and waterproof over trousers make such a difference but they aren't cheap.
You need to have a way to smarten up and get dry/rid of mud splashes at the other end.

That's the point!

To increase those amenities in all areas.

@Buzzinwithbez

Hair brush, jumper, Mac.

Sorted.

I'd live in such a place in a heartbeat. Not going to happen though.

I imagine the theory appeals to Americans who can't use the bathroom without getting in an SUV. They love to fantasise about some evil shadow government in a hollowed out volcano about to stick them in a labour camp.

Sorry I'm a bit salty - a family member is spamming my inbox with garbage by Russell Brand and John Campbell. I just don't have the energy.

I leave in a medium size town (125k), about 25 minutes walk from the town centre.

Within 15 minutes walk of me I have 3 small supermarkets, an Aldi, two farmfoods, a Polish supermarket, several takeaways, a couple of hairdressers and barbers, a greengrocers, 3 post offices, a library, several community centres, 2 scout huts, a builders merchant, 2 pharmacies, I think 3 churches, I think 4 parks but there is a 5th that may be within 15 mins. Doctors, dentists, an opticians.

I don't have a theatre, cinema, museum etc within 15 minutes (and tbh I wouldn't expect to - I would class them in the same category as a hospital). They are I think all within 2-3.5 miles.

Things I don't have within 15 minutes walk (but do within 30) - swimming pool, leisure centre, gym, full size supermarket (like a big Tesco or whatever), shops that sell "useful things" like The Range or whatever, and a DIY shop. Also my office is 30 minutes walk away.

What I don't have close by (because it's not a very well off area) is a nice cafe and/or a pub serving food. There are a couple of wet pubs though, and a greasy spoon, so that is ultimately just my taste.

It works pretty well for me, I'm a semi-fair-weather cyclist (it doesn't have to be sunny it does have to be not chucking it down unless the parking situation is truly horrendous) and in the spring/summer/early autumn I often only use my car once every couple of weeks.

In the winter it is more but I think it's a really good planning mechanism if nothing else.

I glad I don't live in one of these places where you have to shop at Asda because it's the supermarket in your quarter

We did have it until tesco etc popped up and put the high streets out.

my only gripe is my love of choice. Sometimes I go to lidl, mostly aldi, occasionally sainsburys.

there won’t be room for houses between all of them

@QuertyGirl So how do you turn the parade of shops near me into the kind of shops that were there in the 1960s and 1970's? The old shopkeepers all closed up because rents became higher than they could afford and lots of people were going to supermarkets. The growth of retail parks encouraged by Local Authorities anti car attitude and high car parking killed off the last few older shops. Any high streets that are thriving are in well off areas and are full of fancy cafes, restaurants and very expensive artisan bakeries and similar.
You are trying to turn back time by making life harder for many people. It won't happen. Our life will just be harder.

The thought of being forced to use the dogshit Morrisons in my area. God forbid.

So the solution is to sort the public transport out.

Yep! Oh well at least the weatherspoons in my quarter is cheap.

That's what this idea is- to try and bring that back.

LA policies allowed this to happen and they can encourage positive change too.

Have a look at this history of Amsterdam. Look at Paris and parts of London right now.

Let's be honest, you just like driving and have lost the confidence to get about by any other method.

That's understandable, policies have pushed you and millions like you into that lifestyle for years. Cars are status symbols. They're consumer items subject to billions in advertising. We're fed endless bad news about the dangers outside and we hide in the safe space of our cars.

It can and will change in urban areas.

Everything is so broken these days. It seems a pipe dream to have everything within 15 mins.

It won't always be so

didn't oik or gas companies know about melting ice caps and climate change back in the 70s but kept it quiet to be able to keep getting rich? Thats a conspiracy that seems far fetched but it was proven to be true.

I don't think it's far fetched, big companies will do anything (including planned obsolescence, space labour, purposely depleting resources to 'catch' a workforce, destroy the whole planet for profit, claim 'primark cares' when dumping kids of vrand new clothes made by hand in bad conditions by brown people. Always brown people getting fucked over, next is poor people and women. Brown, poor women really are fucked.