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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

How much does my tenant owe me?

521 replies

Golaz · 10/02/2023 12:25

Hi all,

I’ve had a tenant in my flat on for a few years. She’s been on a rolling contract since the first six months. She normally pays rent on the 11th of the month for the month ahead.

I gave her notice on 22nd January, that I would need the flat back by 16th April. (Under a rolling contract I need to give 2 months notice, but I wanted to let her know earlier rather than later, to give her some time to sort something).

On the 4th February she informed me she had found somewhere and would be moving out probably around the middle of February. I followed up today and asked if she had a date. She told me yes- she’s moving out on the 18th and will return on the 20th to clean the place.

How much rent does she owe me? She’s already paid until the 11th. She seems to think she only needs to pay for an extra week until the 18th , but in the rolling contract she’s supposed to give me one months notice so I feel like she should pay until the 4th March.

AIBU?

OP posts:
kitsuneghost · 10/02/2023 13:00

1 month notice (from when you told her) would be the 22nd Feb
So I think that would be fair.

Sharkpenis · 10/02/2023 13:00

You gave notice. Your date in April isnt a move out date. Its a move out by date. Which makes a difference. So she has between the day you gave her notice and the date in april to move out.

She will need to pay you until the date she hands back the keys.

Original poster
Golaz · 10/02/2023 13:00

Stopandlook · 10/02/2023 12:54

You’ve given her notice to leave what was her home. She’s found a new home without any complaints and told you when she will be gone.
She wouldn’t have given you notice if you hadn’t wanted her to leave.
So, she pays til the 20th. Demanding more would be bad form.

Ok so my understanding from these replies is legally she actually owes me until 11th March, but that it would be good form to just ask for the days she stays.
I definitely want to be a decent person so I guess I’ll just say she can pay for the days she stays.
definitely wish I hadn’t given her early notice now, but I thought that was the decent thing to do. As you say it’s her home and I feel terrible asking her to leave it 😔

OP posts:
Scepticalwotsits · 10/02/2023 13:01

Might be wrong but doesn’t notice giving on properties run from rental due date to rental due date (unless the start of rent was a different day)

so if you gave 2 months notice on the 22nd that would cover from the 11th Feb to 10th April which cuts its fine to the needed date of the 16th.

I would take your win that they are leaving early and agree that they pay until they hand the keys over which looks to be the 20th

Iris1976 · 10/02/2023 13:02

I was given handed a s21 with 2 months notice on the 21st shown a housing association house on the 24th and had to sign contract straight away,ll still insisted on months notice,so ended up paying over 3 weeks rent on 2 properties,crippled me as single parent.

OsirisservesAnubis · 10/02/2023 13:04

Technically you are correct in that if she does not leave by 11th Feb, she should pay rent until the 11th March (if the rental period is 11th to 11th, rather than just pay day on 11th) however I would only charge her for the 11th - 20th as she has left so promptly. She has every right to remain beyond the 16th April and force you to go to court for eviction, she hasn't done this and I would just thank your lucky stars for that!

MeMyCatsAndMyBooks · 10/02/2023 13:04

Doesn't mean she owes you till the 11th at all, till the 20th February the day she hands back the keys.
Nobody in their right mind would pay rent on a house they don't even have the keys for anymore Ffs. If you ever rent again get a agency, it's very clear you haven't got a clue.

user1471548941 · 10/02/2023 13:04

I’m a LL. Technically she owes you until the 4th but in this scenario I would not make a fuss about a week and would agree until the 20th (the date you are actually able to access and use the flat post her clean up) for the sake of an easy check out!

2bazookas · 10/02/2023 13:06

You gave HER notice, on january 22. Therefore her tenancy ends on 22 March.

You are very fortunate that she has willingly agreed to depart earlier (and to clean the flat . Which says she hopes to recover her deposit).

My advice, is to excercise your right to inspect the flat after she moves out; and do it (before the cleans up) . Assuming she does return to clean up, take a second look afterwards. Take a camera; and a checklist.

If all is well, I would be so grateful I would let her pay rent until the day she hands back the keys; refund her deposit, and give her a good LL reference.
Make sure you get a forwarding land address.

Even though my teannts were responsible for power bills and CT, when they left
I also took my own meter readings to notify the power supplier, and council that ex tenant no longer lives there.

SomePosters · 10/02/2023 13:06

When I have been in this position and it was handled by professionals we paid until the day the key was handed in

Mumsnet is not the place to get proper legal advice for a landlord. It’s a social media platform. Going by advice from unqualified internet randoms is likely to end in legal problems for you

Onnabugeisha · 10/02/2023 13:08

Technically, she owes rent until the day she turns in the keys to you. So that would be the 20th or 21st.

Sidge · 10/02/2023 13:09

No she doesn’t legally owe you until the 11th. She doesn’t need to give notice as you’d given HER notice. Your notice of intention to terminate her rental agreement means there is no need for her to give notice. She just needs to let you know when she’s going.

Shes notified you of her moving out date (the 20th as that’s when she can hand the keys back after cleaning) so that’s when she should pay until.

If you insist on charging her rent until the 11th she’s well within her rights to keep the keys until then. But that would be shitty of you as I assume she’ll be living elsewhere and paying rent there from the 20th.

Showersugar · 10/02/2023 13:09

You'd be thick as mince to push her to pay beyond her moving out date OP, as that could very easily cause her next tenancy to fall through rendering her homeless (in which case the council will instruct her to stay put until you have gone through the courts to evict her). It could end up costing you thousands!

Octopusmittens · 10/02/2023 13:10

Ultraninja · 10/02/2023 12:26

I'd just be relieved that she's going without any fuss and is even going to come back and clean.

This, if she had refused to move it could have cost you a lot of money in court fees (bitter experience).

Onnabugeisha · 10/02/2023 13:10

You gave HER notice, on january 22. Therefore her tenancy ends on 22 March.. That’s the vacate by date, not the tenancy end date.

On a rolling contract, since LL has already given section 21, the tenant is not required to also serve notice they are leaving. That only applies to a fixed term contract.

Undercoverdetective · 10/02/2023 13:11

Not commenting on the legal aspects but if she expects to pay until the 18th when she moves out you may find she rushes the cleaning to be finished if she will otherwise have to pay two extra days.

PrimrosesandPears · 10/02/2023 13:11

i would just charge until the day she moves out given that she has lived there “a few years” and you gave notice to her.

1983Louise · 10/02/2023 13:11

From what you have said the tenant has been with you a few years, hopefully always paid on time and kept your property clean and tidy. I wouldn't charge her anymore, she's going to come back and clean the flat for you. You only have to watch programmes re nightmare tenants to realise how lucky you've been to have a good one. I'd finishes the tenancy on a positive note and breathe a sigh of relief that you have your flat back in one piece 😊

MissMaple82 · 10/02/2023 13:12

I don't think you should be a landlord at all, you don't sound like you've got the foggiest about what your doing!! I think you shot yourself in the foot by giving more notice than the contact states. She's done the right thing and started looking elsewhere straight away, and found somewhere suitable, time is of the essence in these situations. I think you're incredibly cheeky by wanting excess rent off the poor woman. Be grateful you've got a smooth process and be a good human instead of a greedy human

MeganLogan · 10/02/2023 13:13

As a landlord who has to take a tenant to court to get them out, I would say let it go

BellatrixLestrangesHeatedCurlers · 10/02/2023 13:13

You're a massive CF

Sirius3030 · 10/02/2023 13:14

Be nice.

strawberryandcreams · 10/02/2023 13:15

Just demand she pays you till 16th April. Watch her house fall through, then she will stay longer. She's found somewhere within the time limit you gave her. Don't screw her over and demand she pays for both old and new place to live.

SherbetDips · 10/02/2023 13:16

@Clymene She hasn’t kicked her out or her home. She’s given her 4 months notice to leave OPs property. A property she was renting ..do you not understand how rental properties work? They don’t belong to the renter they belong to the owner.

Bingbangbongbash · 10/02/2023 13:16

Scepticalwotsits · 10/02/2023 13:01

Might be wrong but doesn’t notice giving on properties run from rental due date to rental due date (unless the start of rent was a different day)

so if you gave 2 months notice on the 22nd that would cover from the 11th Feb to 10th April which cuts its fine to the needed date of the 16th.

I would take your win that they are leaving early and agree that they pay until they hand the keys over which looks to be the 20th

This is correct. The notice aligns with the contract date. You giving her notice early doesn’t matter - it’s 2 months from the start of the next full month (so 10th or thereabouts - depending on what the tenancy commencement date is - not necessarily the same as the rent paid date).

Did you issue the S21 in the correct format? And provide all the required documents at the start of the tenancy? Protect her deposit in an accredited scheme? Otherwise you may find you owe her money.