To think that boys groping girls is not part of the 'the normal sexual dance' but is sexual assault?

[Clymene]

There's an article in the Sunday Times today by a psychologist saying that Me Too has gone too far and lots of teenage boys are suffering.

She said: “I like #MeToo and would like to give the woman who started it an award but I think it has gone too far. Now any boy who puts a hand on a bosom because he is slightly drunk and has not asked is being in danger of being ostracised and shamed. Girls are viewing teenage boys as aggressive predators. So the normal sexual dance that has gone for ever now seems not OK. Boys are losing their feet.”

This woman seems to think girls should stop making such a fuss because boys went through lockdown so they're all very immature. We don't know what she thinks about the impact of girls going through lockdown as she doesn't seem to be interested in them.

If boys lives are being 'wrecked' because they sexually assaulted a girl, my suggestion is that they don't sexually assault girls.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ac7c5012-a40e-11ed-9d5c-69bd3c5b98b3?shareToken=3491fa7737a645108929eebc50b420322_

Nice little promotional piece, vilifying girls and sympathising with the poor little predators in the making -future clients- .

Making a name for herself, while treading on the battered and abused corpses of victims.

Simply beautiful .

This!!

Funny that they would understand consent if a bloke grabbed their arse or crotch.

Well quite. Unwanted sexual touching is assault because it's unwanted, uninvited. If a heterosexual boy can identify that a man stroking his chest or touching his crotch is assault, then he clearly knows full well what kind of physical contact is not ok unless consensual.

Please a little over dramatic, we've all had a slapped rear off a not so good looking guy it hasn't hurt, a quick thunder eyes usually makes it obvious you don't agree and they move on. I wonder how many of these girls that are so offended over being touched are those who just didn't get any attention.

Going out in jeans and a top usually meant not interested, where as body con dress and heels was on the pull.

For those who have implied that there is no sexual assault amongst gay men that really isn’t true at all. The rate of sexual assault amongst gay men is estimated at about 10 x that of heterosexual men and about half of gay men report being sexually assaulted.

Did you just imply women who haven't been sexually assaulted are probably just jealous of those who have been?

As for the misogynistic bull about women choosing to wear clothes based on what her intentions are.

I despair sometimes.

@Grumpybutfunny two paragraphs with two mysoginistic rape myths. Colour me impressed.

Have not read the article yet but these discussions always bring me back to what happened at DCs school. A girl at the school accused a boy of assault in the height of the #metoo movement - it took off like wildfire on social media around the school and beyond, he was called names and screamed at in the school, online and on the street, attacked by a mobs after school, school suspended him pending investigations. He was dropped from sports teams and asked to leave his part time job because of the attention he was receiving. He committed suicide.

It transpired afterwards that the girl had made the whole thing up, she was jealous that he was talking to another girl made an allegation online and it snowballed.

Sexual assault allegations should be taken seriously but also investigated properly and carefully. The repercussions for those accused are horrific and there should be no place for a pile on of a baying mob that ruins young lives forever.

@FourAndTwentyBlackbirdsBakedInAPie an slap or boob grab is not sexual assault, I would struggle to argue it assault. I went to uni in the late naughties (last time I was on the pull) if the guy was cute it was an ego boost and an invitation to flirt back. Same as a girl going up to a guy, slight hand to the bottom of the back as she says hi.

I do think theres is an edge of jealousy in it yes. Go out in any major town and actually sit back to watch what is going on. People are tactile creatures, we hug, we kiss and we flirt. What would have been an OMG why did I sleep with him last night or a did I sleep with him last night is now a OMG did he assault me.

I enjoyed being young and flirty, I didn't want to be ignored with guys to afraid to try it on just because they might have misjudge the situation. The whole movement at the moment of "protecting" woman is actually hurting us. It is saying we can't be as strong as a guy, rather we have to be cute little jewels in a display case who you ask to touch. That's not a world I would want my son to grow up in. I want him to believe that when he goes into the ring the girl in the corner is just as likely to deck him as the boy. Don't just look for a man to spot him a woman can do the job just aswell.

I want him to know when he settles down he better do half the jobs (& all the bin emptying 🤢), but also have enough respect for himself to make sure she looks after herself.

@Grumpybutfunny it's terrifying that you're the mother of a son, absolutely terrifying.

Let's hope your son has someone in his life that teaches him that grabbing someone's breast, or slapping someone's arse is sexual assault, because you have done a shit job of teaching him right from wrong by the sounds of it, including telling him women are just as strong as him, in 99% of cases that's a lie, and men use their physical dominance against us all the time bacuse they know that.

Nobody out there is jealous that they haven't been sexually assaulted, nor is sexual assault the compliment you seem to think it is.

Parents like you are the reason that men think they can get away with this shit.

@Grumpybutfunny , your posts are staggeringly ignorant. Crass, even.

You are conveniently ignoring the fact that women are physically weaker than men and thus vulnerable, AS IS EVIDENCED BY THE SEXUAL ASSAULT AND RAPE STATISTICS.

Men don't use physical dominance tho do they, they enjoy showing off muscle mass as it's a sex symbol just like heroin chick was the rage in the 90s. It's not something to be intimidated about as the average guy doesn't look like that or have that dominance. Also self defence isn't about pure strength it's tactics 😉

A strong woman is stronger than the average man is my point. If you have two power lifters yes the man would usually be able to lift a higher weight. However if you look at endurance the woman would win. Hence in the real world if a woman can run a man into the ground she can win. But that's a whole other topic to a guy giving a woman unwanted attention. But my point still stands a butt slap isn't sexual assault.

Fully agree @Grumpybutfunny. I had an absolute ball in the 90s, we flirted and partied and I am glad I had those days. Can everyone seriously say hand in heart that they have never flirted with a guy they had no intention of dating? Maybe to get something they wanted or to make someone jealous or for a dare even? Can you look back at those awkward moments where someone has gone for a kiss and say now that was assault? I know I'm some cases it is and that's not what I am talking about. My concern is that every awkward fumble or misread situation is now classed as an assault which minimises the seriousness and severity of actual sexual assault.

You're on the wind up now.

Men don't use physical dominance to sexually assault women?

What a crock of shit.

I seriously hope your son is imaginary and you're just some weird incel sitting in his mums spare room, if not your son is definitely the sort of bloke I warn my daughters about.

FYI a butt slap is definitely sexual assault, so your 'point' is incorrect, in my opinion, and in the eyes of the law.

@Grumpybutfunny

Everything write is so twisted.
How the hell does anyone, and more sadly a woman, become like this?
It’s all so sad.

You’re like a example of what misogyny is.
Horrible to read you have a son, that’s a future problem for women you’re raising.

I read the whole article and was pretty shocked at some of the passages like the ones quoted here.

But the author did also talk about nous' exposure to porn and the damage that does; and how the demonisation of boys has made them easy prey for the likes of Andrew Tate.

We need to raise boys right so they are respectful of women and girls. Not because they are afraid of the consequences but because they actually respect women and girls.

You put it so much better so this x100. @FourAndTwentyBlackbirdsBakedInAPie he's 9, would already like to follow his dad to the gym and is starting boxing so unfortunately I have a feeling he will be boy the girls want!

DH was one of those lads who butt slapped including to me, he's now a grown up responsible married man. FYI the medics at uni were worse than us for sleeping around and touching each other.

an slap or boob grab is not sexual assault,

What ? Never?

@Grumpybutfunny ah your husband sexually assaulted more than one woman, no wonder you don't want to see it for what it is.

Imagine thinking about your 9yo child in terms of being 'a boy all the girls want' as well 🤢

Sadly the only thing that's definite about the poor lad is that he has two disgusting misogynist role models bringing him up. Poor kid.

What a grim article. The Times always published shite like this. Total propaganda rag.

I can't get the link to work, but boys groping girls, is absolutely sexual assault. Anyone who thinks it isn't, should probably have their hard drive checked.

And on and on it goes.

In my youth, I never felt safe in heterosexual nightclubs and only ever went to gay nightclubs, just because of groping, rubbing etc It was so awful, unpleasant and embarrassing. After one visit when I was 20, I never wanted to go to a nightclub again. Now, 25 years later, people are finally calling it what it is- sexual assault.

If a random man grabbed my boobs or slapped my arse it would make me very uncomfortable. It is sexual
assault

It was an interesting article.

Whilst agreeing that assault is never acceptable, there is nuance here. Especially amongst the young, girls expect boys to approach them, ‘make a move’ etc.

And there is a culture of girls admiring boys’ physiques in even the crudest terms, getting a ‘go girl’ comment, but boys making similar remarks are regarded as perverts.

Teenagers don’t need to pay for past sexism.

Ignoring the thrust of the article won’t solve anything. Boys need to listen to girls, but the reverse also applies.