To ask for ex to pay for childcare on his days

[Amblu81]

Will try to summarise.

Myself and kids Dad split March 2021. Due to lack of finances I stayed in the house and lived in the dining room. He point blank refused to move out of house and to preserve my mental health I managed to find somewhere to rent and moved out Feb 2022 (had to save for deposit and rural area with very few affordable rentals)
Two kids 13 and 8.
We were never married.
He remained in house jointly owned and has agreed to pay me 50% equity when fixed rate ends in November this year. Truly gutted as I loved that house but her ho.

He is self employed specialist groundworker. Income unknown and will not confirm. Accounts on companies house are only basic ones so dont show income.

I am part time employed and self employed trying to pursue my own wedding business (Fridays/Saturdays). Had to take on extra work to afford rent and cost of living crisis. Was very lucky to find something I know.

Kids stay with me mostly. Youngest with me 5 days a week, eldest 6 days a week. Ex has kids 3 weekends out of 4. I have them other weekend. Kids come back to me 1pm Sunday.

All is working really well, or so I thought.

Ex calls mediation this week. We attend and he would now like

• every other weekend off so that he can have a social life. (he has now changed this arguement to 'so he can work')
• Have kids one night in the week. Pick up then drop of at school or breakfast club depending on his work. He says he wants to spend more time with them yet wants to send them back to me.

I say yes to him having kids for one night in the week as youngest has expressed a wish to spend more time with his Dad. I put in a caveat that Ex pays for childcare for that 24 hour period. Ex point blank refuses and says he will take it out of maintenance.

Mediator suggests I have kids Friday and Saturday night and all day Sunday for the extra weekend with me. Then ex has them whilst I work. I tend to co-ordinate the day so at work from 8am to 6pm plus driving time to and from venues. Reluctantly I say yes to this as it seems the only compromise. Ex point blank refuses again.

Now we are at stalemate.

To give you some idea he pays £75 pw maintenance. Childcare costs £14 per day afterschool, £5 per day breakfast, £52 per day holiday club.

We have very little family to help out.

To confirm I am more than happy for him to see his kids and am not denying him access.

I have a voucher scheme through work but still comes out of my wage and nowhere near covers it during school holidays.

AIBU to expect him to provide 1 days childcare? To comply with his wishes means I have to give up an extra days imcome and is going to look shocking to my new clients where I am trying to push my business!!!

Thanks all.

On a normal week (Mon to Fri), my kids probably cost me around £50 in food shopping. Then school/college dinners prob another £25 per week. If I was also then paying £95 childcare, for these things in total it wouldn't seem a million miles off what he's paying you to also cover the childcare.

But that certainly doesn't take nto account holiday club, after school clubs, new clothes, uniforms, days out etc.

I'd definitely leave him to sort childcare on 'his' days. Just organise your days and leave him to organise his... it's not your job to facilitate him.

No, we haven't gone through CSA. At the time of the split I still had to live in the same home. I have always been nervous to confront him/suggest things he won't like as he used to be volatile. Not do much now but it put me off pushing whilst still under the same roof.

So, I worked out the maintenance based on school dinners, food bill, clothes, school trips, uniform, haircuts and clubs/activities per year, and divided up to make a daily rate of £7.50 per child. I did not include childcare costs in this as the kids are with me all week so took that sd my responsibility.

Also he is self employed and in previous years took a low income and put the remaining 'income' into dividends into his company to avoid tax (he is a sole trader) Pretty sure he is still doing this so any proof of his earnings won't be realistic. It is not illegal to do this either.

Thats really rubbish. But very interesting to know. Thank you

This entirely! He used to put more of his earnings into dividends in the company rather than an income to avoid tax!! Its so frustrating thinking because I stayed at home and brought up the kids, he was able to grow a successful business.

We have been going through a mediator but our last session was stalemate with him refusing to back down whereas I was prepared to compromise.

I will struggle with legal fees and not entitled to legal aid due to part ownership of the house

Not 100% sure on this but I think only limited companies can pay dividends, sole traders can't. And you can apply to have dividends taken into account by CMS if he is doing that. Might be worth a check.

I'd push for 50/50 custody and let him see how far his £75 goes when he has to pay half for everything.

I've never received maintenance ever so may be bitter towards ex,who also only has DD when he feels like.

Thanks @rizzo999 my mistake....he is limited company. I am sole trader for my wedding business at presentm

Iris1976 I would be bitter too!!!

Oh that's great if he's having them wed to Thursday overnight he can pay for wed afterschool and Thursday breakfast club , Thursday packed lunch or school dinner and holiday club fees for those days and any clubs that are on wed evenings after school

@Tiani4 this is indeed my suggestion. I had no idea he would react this way and refuse as I genuinely thought that was reasonable!

@Amblu81 in that case you can definitely apply to have them included in the calculation by requesting a variation with CMS when you set up your claim.

It's just so unfair. I don't understand why you can't say one week with you one week with me and leave him to sort the rest. Why does he get a social life when you don't!? What a twat and for mediation to not point out how unfair he is being is just wrong. Point blank refuse what he wants.

Perfectly reasonable, maintenance is for the days when he DOESN’T have them.

EOW and a night in the week is usual for lazy men. Its not enough to have a close relationship with children. He should pay childcare on his days - its not your responsibility to sort this any more than its his responsibility on your days. He's behaving like every time he has the dc he is doing you a favour - my ex is the same sees dc as my responiblity and he's helping me out when he has them. Under his suggestion you would have to find weekend childcare for an extra weekend each month to continue your job and he isnt offering to pay for that. A court wont enforce 50:50 against an unwilling parent they will only enforce when one parent wants 50:50 and the other is refusing. He can force you to accept the EOW and week night by just refusing to do any more and not showing up - but he cant make you pay for the childcare arrangements on his days. How much less CM would you get if you had to go through CSA. If he is self employed he can work fewer hours on his weekday if he doesnt want to pay childcare and make up the time on other days.

You are correct, I am an accountant and OP is confusing terms. If he runs his business as a Ltd company then he is not self employed or a sole trader. The Ltd company is its own legal entity and her ex is an employee of that legal entity. Sole traders certainly cannot pay dividends to themselves. Only companies can pay dividends.

His income should be quite identifiable from the company accounts. He would have some as a salary and it sounds like the rest as dividends. He must also do a self assessment to report the dividend income so that is another way of identifying his income. I do not know what the CMS rules are around including such dividends are, but nevertheless it would be easily identifiable.

This is a great plan

Wow! This is shocking!. How are mothers supposed to cope with this 😭. How do they justify ti's to themselves

Getting a better job?

So you feel that the responsibility for childcare should be on the mother?. The mum should pay for childcare when the child is with dad as well?.Especially seeing that the "child maintenance " he is paying isn't even enough to actually pay for the childcare?. Why is that?🤨.

Also, why can't dad get a better job and pay more for his child?🤡

I agree that it’s a crazy rule. Especially as he’ll be getting a shared care reduction for having them. He should use some of that extra money to pay for childcare.

Thanks everyone. Really useful advice, opinions and ideas.

@taxpayer1 if only!! 1 professional part time job where due to having kids I had to work part time and support ex set up and run his business. As front line staff at top of my pay scale I am unable to go back to full time hours until budget (if ever!) allows...whilst my non parent workmates have climbed the career ladder, 1 part time 0 hours contract wfh admin type job and self employed trying to set up my own business. Trust me I trying to get better money coming in. Wish it was that easy. My job is very specialist and I dont wish to start again or relocate.

If he's having them every Wednesday and if you know you will be able to get back a place if he later in decides not to have them in that day, you can cancel we after school club and thurs breakfast club and he can book them in if he wants that. Just let school know and him know and get it into the court order child contact arrangements

Then if he doesn't turn up even twice you have good reason to take back to court that it isn't working as he isn't turning up and school have contacted you to say he hasnt collected

Make sure you tell school to invoice him for those days and that he is unable to add childcare data to your account as they will need to invoice separately