So angry at all these threads on useless and selfish men

[Winterday1991]

Off the back of the thread where the H refuses to care for his sick child so the OP can get some much needed rest as he is on annual leave from work 😡. I am seriously fed up of reading threads like this, why are so many men so selfish?

Why is it always women who have to do the lions share of caring, pulling themselves in all direction whilst their male counterparts glide through life uninterrupted? Why is it always women who carry the mental load for family life and the men just show up. Why is always women responsible for maintaining the household?

Even in the 21st century, why do so many men get such a bloody easy ride, whilst often their poor wives/partners are running around like headless chickens keeping on top of everything.

@MsMarch

Yes, I understand the reasons too.

I think we can say women need to raise their bars. Otherwise nothing will change

No one said it was easy and of course its so much easier to theorise than to do.

Probably why I don't think we will ever change anything

Selfish men make it clear from the start. The trick is not to breed with them hoping you can fix them.

This forum is absolutely vital for any female coming into adulthood. Men just aren’t evolved enough for civilised society and the sooner we all realise that the better.

This is really true. I’ve seen this so often. In a lot of cases a woman is the one leading the decision to have children.

They seem to feel that because he has acquiesced in this she has some obligation to do the lions share of the domestic work as if this is the wages she owes him.

Good lord, what a dramatic post. So what should we do with all of the men? Round them up and ship 'em to a deserted island?

No that wouldn’t be possible. Something like unilateral civil disobedience in society, refusing to engage in sexual relationships with men across the board and empowering other women to be completely reliant on each other for support are 3 great steps.

Men just aren’t evolved enough for civilised society and the sooner we all realise that the better.

At risk of being accused of misandry I couldn’t agree more.

Women are just so much better at almost everything you throw at them. More competent, less selfish, more responsible, harder working, more intelligent and kinder. The only thing in which men consistently exceed in is brute strength and speed.

We are capable of doing everything in the home and for the children and running full time jobs/running businesses/running countries. Most women work infinitely harder than their partners cheerfully and without complaint at hard jobs and running families. How many men can do this? Almost none.

I love many individual men and want to keep them around but as a rule I think families are usually healthier without them and a social group and in the way they operate as a pack I think their benefit to society is negligible.

You said it better than I ever could. Perhaps as earlier hominids men would have been vital as well protection against predation, but we as a species have moved far beyond that now. We are an apex species that can control society without any need for conflict and violence which essentially makes males as a group pretty redundant.

Women are part of the problem. They hold sexist and enabling views

The irony of your position appears to be completely lost on you.

We are capable of doing everything in the home and for the children and running full time jobs/running businesses/running countries. Most women work infinitely harder than their partners cheerfully and without complaint at hard jobs and running families. How many men can do this? Almost none.
🙄😂
Yet this forum is full of women complaining they have to make a bed and cook a meal. Women decide that other women should bring up their children so they can have a natter, obtain an education cert or buy a car.
What hard jobs, admin.😂

This is my position. I just think men haven't evolved to suit modern life.

Bear in mind @PrincessConstance is a trad Christian who thinks the gays should burn in hell.

@NocturnalClocks

I don't think you understand my position or irony to be fair

Yes. And often worse than negligible: detrimental. Those men who behave like that have made themselves obsolete. Many women are perfectly capable of running a home, buying our own houses, having successful careers etc without a man. If many men can't behave in such a way as to make women actually want to have them around then we simply won't. Hence so many women now deciding to be single and not even interested in dating.

I hope those of us raising sons now can reverse this so that they are worthwhile human beings who the women of the future want in their lives and add something positive to it.

In the meantime all of the men with such ridiculous and entitled views can disappear into incelhood. It's absolutely not women's fault they are like this: they are adults and choose their behaviour.

But the women proclaiming that it's women's fault that so many men are so useless are almost as bad as those useless men and also need to take a long, hard look at themselves.

Yes, the resentment must come not from being unable to do all the things, but the fact they have a man-baby cluttering the place up. In return they get sperm, sometimes for leisure, sometimes for breeding.

I think unless women acknowledge they're part of the problem nothing will change.

Men won't.

Unless we raise them differently. Unless women stop tolerating poor behaviour. Unless we admit women are part of the sexist society we want to blame

My knowledge is based on facts around sexism and research on division of labour.

Again, nobody has claim the division of labour is equal, as it should be.

We disagree on the reasons. You claim that women are largely responsible for this because they tolerate it. I've said some do, but we do not know what proportion, compared to the number of women who experience it. Based on the number of women who become single it's pretty clear that a large number don't tolerate it at all, rightly. You've provided no evidence that men who behave this way generally continue to do so because women tolerate it. Stop blaming women for men's behaviour when you have no evidence of even a correlation at a population level let alone causality.

What a man would say is that all this chat about the amount of work being done detracts from an honest appraisal about the value of the work being done.

Donkeys can work harder than men too. Doesn't mean society reveres them or is built around their needs though.

Unless these super-women start creating homes, businesses, enterprises, communities and societies that are so successful others want to emulate them, you really have to wonder where the appreciation of value really resides.

I don't think my view is damaging

I've explained to you at length why it is.

@NocturnalClocks

As I said, you don't understand my position

What a man would say is that all this chat about the amount of work being done detracts from an honest appraisal about the value of the work being done.

You think the value of work done by men is greater?

Women earn more than men on average, until they shack up with men.

@PrincessConstance

Are you saying, as someone who I'm sure said they did no housework because their job is too hard/long /important, houswork isn't hard so women should just duck it up and get on with it? Without complaint and stop annoying their ohs to do their share?

You're up there with Mark who seems to be suggesting we should worship at men's feet for the value they provide

😂

I agree, this argument is all about value. There's been a constant barrage to devalue the family and work in the home.
You can have it all at the expense of children, relationships all for materialism, and a false fleeting sense of self-worth. Sad.
According to Mumsnet folklore, any man who works long hrs has a big job yet all that matters in life is who remembers to send out the Christmas card or book the dentist.

People always say this:

Women choose to procreate with unreliable men who show no signs of ‘stepping up’ to fatherhood. Many people should be more discerning before committing to family life, rather than waiting until the second or even third DC to actually figure it out

But so often it is down to pure luck. My friend got pregnant on a one night stand and that man committed himself to supporting her and being a 50/50 parent. Comparatively, I married a man who future faked me into believing he wanted a family and would throw himself into it (and backed it up with housework, childcare for niece and nephew, being scathing of male friends who were lazy).

Sure, I watched your posts getting deleted for homophobia on a recent thread. Surely you're not going to deny it?