To wonder if manager did this deliberately

[Eastie77Returns]

I had my annual pay review today over a call. My manager opened the document up on a shared screen and began talking me through it. It was immediately clear to me I was looking at someone else’s document and the base pay was completely different to mine. Overall this person is paid £80k more than me. I was so stunned at this discrepancy I could not register what my manager was saying to me. After a few minutes she ‘realised’ the mistake and shut down the document.

She is usually meticulous and can’t believe this was an error so I think for some reason she wants me to know. She made a point of telling me at the start of the call that she had just finished ‘Jane’s’ pay review (my colleague) so I don’t know if I’m suppose to conclude this is Jane’s pay.

Needless to say I am job hunting.

I am so confounded by this whole situation, I am just in a daze. I knew people in my team were paid different amounts but never dreamt the discrepancy could be so wide. I think I am probably the lowest paid member of the team.

The assumption that it was Jane's is a bit of a stretch? She'd just finished Jane's, so she'd have lined the one up, thinking it was yours.
It wasn't, but it could have been literally anybody's.

It’s called Blind. I think a company needs a have a minimum of 20 employees sign up before the App will create a channel specifically for your organisation. But useful anyway as you can benchmark across other orgs if yours is not there.

Please don't trust those apps. MANY people put in fake data, usually overinflating their salary.

they always say that. If that is fixed you look for alternatives - you ask for a prmotion within your grade and ask for the grade boundaries and push for what you think is reasonable.

How do you get on with her? Can you have a quiet word?

She’s a tricky character and two people have already left the team amidst accusations of her bullying them. I opened a thread about her a while ago that ended up in Classics when she tried to force everyone in the team to keep a gratitude journal.

She is a Mental Health first aider which is ironic because one of the people who left the team ended up on long term sick leave which he said was related to the stress of her bullying.

We are due to have another call in a few days. I can raise it but honestly feel at this point a fresh start elsewhere is for the best. I’ve been at this company for too long.

I think you should just leave. You've said earlier they've told you to network more etc and you can't be bothered, so time to find somewhere else where you're a better fit

Well you know what to ask for in your next job!

There are two ways to get a pay rise beyond a certain level of experience - promotions and new jobs. If promotion isn't on the cards (and it sounds like it isnt) then its time to look for a new job.

PP is correct - women put up with this far more than men and pay for it (literally). Polish off your CV and start looking. Big tech has laid off some of the extra people it took on in the pandemic but was heavily overstaffed in some areas. Some orgs are using the opportunity to thin out some senior levels.

However in general there is still a significant shortage of good people in IT and I don't know anyone who has struggled to find new roles if they want them.

If OP's boss wanted to give her a pay rise, she could just give her one. She doesn't need OP to ask for it.

Promoted into the same job that you both now do?

Yes, like a lot of women I think I’ve sat and settled for so long because this company is ‘family friendly’ and I kept thinking if I leave for the unknown my routine with the DC might suffer.

Currently I can do the school drop off and pick up on occasion as work is flexible. But it’s come at a (literal) cost to me. Men do not generally worry about a company’s family policy when they go for a new job.

CV is up to date because, ironically, this same manager has always encouraged our team to do this. I just need to brush up on interview techniques as haven’t interviewed for years…

I was told in one review “you do an excellent job l, customers love you and so do your peers. But you will not be promoted by doing your job. You need to go the extra mile and work on your internal brand”.

Ah.
Given your update about the niche industry pay levels you did, & your longevity with current employer, maybe that feedback could be translated as:
"we're taking the piss & we know it, but we reckon you;ll keep tolerating it, & if you don't, we've already had our money's worth from you. Suck it up."

It could well be the old unspoken "your face doesnt fit".
Take comfort from that, as it's company-specific, not industry-specific.
It's a common thing, to be overlooked by providing loyal service which is interpreted as lack of drive or whatever buzzword/excuse is going round.

However - I could be barking up the wrong tree & even though you are there to interpret nuance & your own manager's likely motivation - so could you be.

Are you going to give it a shot, even just for personal satisfaction, by talking direct to your manager about what happened & what she can do to help you negotiate a batter deal?

Leaving is the quickest way to get a big pay rise. This is nothing to do with me being a woman and too scared to ask…
Logical, sensible ... but don't let this conclusion make you miss an opportunity to compensate yourself without leaving, in a climate of global lay-offs in your niche.

Doing that won't preclude you from seeking a new employer.
It would also be logical & sensible to maximise your chances by doing both.

My post was just asking if people thought my manager deliberately let me see that I’m underpaid for some reason.
You won't know until you ask her.
Line up some job interviews, AND bite the bullet & just talk to her!

I'm guessing you've never worked in sales ..?

What does that mean? Are you suggesting that if you work in IT sales and your boss would like to give you a pay rise, then they would accidentally on purpose reveal somebody else’s salary, just so that you are so outraged you demand a payrise.

I used to work in IT and came out of one annual review reeling and crying.

“I was told in one review “you do an excellent job l, customers love you and so do your peers. But you will not be promoted by doing your job. You need to go the extra mile and work on your internal brand”.”

my manager DURING that review told me what nobody else had ever bothered to. Everything is “perception” aka squeaky-wheel/self-serving office cock-end.

in big organisations it matters not one fuck WHAT you do, but what people perceive you to do.

at that point I could’ve taken his advice and set my career on a very different trajectory- instead I chose not to play “office politics” and quit. Zero regrets.

I think you’ve nailed it in that I’ve been there for years, haven’t ever made waves or kicked up a fuss about anything and so the company basically feels that I’ll put up and shut up.

I think my failure to network properly is also partially due to my face not fitting. For example in a previous review I was told I needed to “reach out” to senior execs and spend time shadowing them, learn about leadership roles etc and enhance my visibility. Kind of my worst nightmare but I took a deep breath and messaged a couple to set up time but didn’t hear back. I then followed up with emails and suggested just brief calls as I knew they were busy. No response. ‘Jane’ did the same and I learned she went for coffees and a weekend brunch with those same execs. In a previous team I was the only female in a team of 6 who wasn’t invited to the managers hen night and wedding. We got on fine, I just wasn’t and have never been in the inner circles.

I am described as friendly, approachable, helpful and a great colleague in peer feedback. Customers have fed back similarly. I have picked up extra projects and took on the work of the team member who left after suffering mental health problems. I’ve just never had that…I don’t know what…that has enabled me to cultivate the right working relationships with senior managers.

Not exact same scenario but I caught wind that colleagues (including some people junior to me) were making significantly more than me. I started job hunting and got an offer and resigned. At least with my employer, you had to have an offer in hand before they would do anything re your pay (you couldn't simply ask for a big pay rise). If you're good at your job and they want to keep you, they'll find the money. They may even get creative with bonuses, etc. Finding out colleagues were making more than me was the best thing to happen to me and has made a huge difference in quality of life (my pay doubled). Get yourself an offer and use it to your advantage!

I think this whole situation is a blessing in disguise. I’ve spent the morning working on my CV as I haven’t looked at it in so long. I’ve had to go through my emails and files to compile a list of my achievements and actually realise how much I’ve accomplished.

I'm wondering whether legal advice is appropriate. The 'fixed pot' argument does not wash with me. I could speculate all day as to why your colleague gets £30k more than you, but it does seem an opportunity to force a rise, even if you do plan to move as soon as possible.

If you get an offer and your employer counters, don't take their first counter if it's not enough. I negotiated hard (and ended up staying), but we went back and forth a few times. Their starter was a £25k pay rise as they cried about pay bands. I ended up accepting that pay rise in the end, but also negotiated a series of retention bonuses (totaling £125k) and what my new base pay would be following an upcoming promotion I was planning to go for. Still really pleased I stood up for myself as like you, I knew I was doing good work and was woefully underpaid. Good luck OP! 💪

I would advise spending a bit of money on your cv if you can afford to. It can really improve response rates through ATSs.

Poor you OP, that’s really crap.

A lot of what you’ve said resonated with me. At my last company I got all the crap about internal brands and networking at appraisals. It was basically code for you aren’t part of our clique/ your face doesn’t fit but we can’t say that. Like you I did my job, often went above and beyond, got great feedback from clients and colleagues, but nothing was good enough because I wasn’t all pally with the right people. It was very “Mean Girls”. Funnily enough I’ve seen people on glass door write that progression at the company was inconsistent and unclear.

They were really shocked when I handed in my notice, I think they just thought I’d put up with it forever. I left and got an instant 20% pay rise at my new company. Being undervalued will continue to wear you down. I hope you find something bigger and better.

Really glad to hear you found a new role and the pay increase you deserve. I can definetly relate to the Mean Girls analogy.

The hilarious thing is my manager has a cliche tagline on her online profile that reads "People don't leave bad jobs, they leave bad managers"

@Wallywobbles is there a particular CV service you'd recommend?