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AIBU?

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Original poster

To wonder if manager did this deliberately

182 replies

Eastie77Returns · 26/01/2023 22:38

I had my annual pay review today over a call. My manager opened the document up on a shared screen and began talking me through it. It was immediately clear to me I was looking at someone else’s document and the base pay was completely different to mine. Overall this person is paid £80k more than me. I was so stunned at this discrepancy I could not register what my manager was saying to me. After a few minutes she ‘realised’ the mistake and shut down the document.

She is usually meticulous and can’t believe this was an error so I think for some reason she wants me to know. She made a point of telling me at the start of the call that she had just finished ‘Jane’s’ pay review (my colleague) so I don’t know if I’m suppose to conclude this is Jane’s pay.

Needless to say I am job hunting.

I am so confounded by this whole situation, I am just in a daze. I knew people in my team were paid different amounts but never dreamt the discrepancy could be so wide. I think I am probably the lowest paid member of the team.

OP posts:
SmileWithADimple · 27/01/2023 07:20

I agree with @Hoplesscynic - I think it's entirely possible that this was a genuine error (we've all done it!) and it wasn't necessarily Jane's salary at all.

BloomingXmas · 27/01/2023 07:24

@Eastie77Returns contact ACAS and do some research into unfair discrepancies in pay.
I would also let your manager/senior management team know that you are aware of the pay gap and will be taking legal advice on where you stand.
You should, at the very least, get advice.

Nutmegger · 27/01/2023 07:29

I wonder are you a nihilistic type? I would have interpreted that incident as the manager telling me to look for a pay rise.

Bikeybikeface · 27/01/2023 07:29

Do you think she showed you deliberately? Maybe she thinks it’s unfair on you and wants you to push for a pay rise?

WeAreTheHeroes · 27/01/2023 07:30

If your instant reaction to this is to leave then it suggests you're already not happy. There have probably been other things going on which you haven't posted.

TennisWithDeborah · 27/01/2023 07:31

It could have been anyone’s paperwork. Maybe your boss’.

WhyCantPeopleBeNice · 27/01/2023 07:39

I had 2 team members same job, same title, same targets but with a £45k pay difference.
Not in a million years would I consider telling them, I did however fight to get the pay made fair.
If your boss was showing you on purpose, they aren't a good boss, either they haven't tried or they tried and failed so now they want you to try....but that then points to the company not being very good and who the heck wants to work somewhere like that?

Companies that only give pay rises when fought for will loose valuable employees.
Personally I think you're wise to look elsewhere

Parisj · 27/01/2023 07:50

Nothing has actually changed for you. Don't judge your worth or happiness based on other people. If the job suits and your pay is enough for you, stay. If you want to get promoted, get promoted. If you want to develop elsewhere, job hunt. You can choose how to think about this.

Elle54321 · 27/01/2023 08:03

Does your company have an equal pay policy? I realised that my predecessor was paid 15k more than me and the role had expanded since I took it on so I complained referring to the equal pay policy and they had to increase my salary.

DonatellaBella · 27/01/2023 08:04

You saw 'someone's' income details on the screen. You don't know who's it was. It's irrelevant that your manager had just been talking to Jane.

The base salary is £30k more than yours the rest is commission (down to performance) and expenses (down to qualifying for them).

My guess is that it was either your manager's details you saw or another manager. Either way you can look for other jobs and see what they're offering at the same level.

billy1966 · 27/01/2023 08:05

This.

If she gave you a good review, it's the former...............

You definitely need to establish if you are being underpaid for what you do because that is a huge discrepancy.

Vermin · 27/01/2023 08:11

If Jane is earning £50k more in commission, it suggests (assuming at least similar commission basis) that Jane is far more successful and therefore deserves more pay.

Boomboom22 · 27/01/2023 08:14

Vermin · 27/01/2023 08:11

If Jane is earning £50k more in commission, it suggests (assuming at least similar commission basis) that Jane is far more successful and therefore deserves more pay.

Not if her base rate is double and commission matches. It means she gets 2 times op for the same sales plus a higher base.

Glitteratitar · 27/01/2023 08:16

So you don’t know whose pay it was but you have concluded it’s Jane’s and that it was done deliberately.

Sounds like a genuine mistake to me…

deeperthanallroses · 27/01/2023 08:16

you don’t know it’s Jane’s. If it isn’t, could be anybody? If it is, you are in the rare position of having clear salary information to use to push for a pay rise. But you want to waste that info by just quitting?? For gods sake give it a go, it is so frustrating the extent to which women refuse to just ask. (Yes yes penalised for being too hardline when negotiating pay like men do etc but they are still better off than just ignoring the problem and taking whatever crumbs they are given!)

Original poster
Eastie77Returns · 27/01/2023 08:18

Thanks for all the responses.

I am sure I am being underpaid. Within my specific industry (niche area of IT) there is an app that people can use to discuss pay (amongst other things) within their company. You have to apply to join the app using your work email address and you are then given an anonymous username and added to your company’s channel. I joined a few weeks back and can see people at my level are paid a huge amount more than me, albeit in different offices globally.

The document I saw was not my managers. I didn’t see Jane’s name but assumed it was hers as she had her review just before me. I understand pay is based on performance etc. It’s just upsetting as I realise I’ve undervalued myself by staying at this company for so long. Every single performance review I’ve had has been extremely positive. However I’m told that I’m not visible enough (even though I put my hand up for extra projects all the time) and I don’t network sufficiently with senior managers. As a result I guess I’ve m been left behind in terms of promotion and pay.

I was told in one review “you do an excellent job l, customers love you and so do your peers. But you will not be promoted by doing your job. You need to go the extra mile and work on your internal brand”.

I’ve gone so many extra miles I’m exhausted.

I’m completely demoralised this morning but need to dust myself down and look externally at other jobs in order to make the jump to a salary commensurate to my skills and experience.

OP posts:
Original poster
Eastie77Returns · 27/01/2023 08:22

deeperthanallroses · 27/01/2023 08:16

you don’t know it’s Jane’s. If it isn’t, could be anybody? If it is, you are in the rare position of having clear salary information to use to push for a pay rise. But you want to waste that info by just quitting?? For gods sake give it a go, it is so frustrating the extent to which women refuse to just ask. (Yes yes penalised for being too hardline when negotiating pay like men do etc but they are still better off than just ignoring the problem and taking whatever crumbs they are given!)

My industry has just laid of hundreds of thousands of people. We have been repeatedly told pay rises are not negotiable. Even if I asked for one, it’s not going to get me to the level it should be. I’ve now done my research, have seen salaries of other people doing my exact job on the app I described (I was prepared to let that slide as they are based in the US office) but now know that my colleague here earns £££ more. Leaving is the quickest way to get a big pay rise. This is nothing to do with me being a woman and too scared to ask…

My post was just asking if people thought my manager deliberately let me see that I’m underpaid for some reason.

OP posts:
LeCarre · 27/01/2023 08:29

I think shendidnitnon on putpose for one of three reasons:

  1. She likes you and thinks you should be demanding more money, or
  2. She’s trying to motivate you into working harder, or
  3. She wants you to quit.

As you’ve been specifically told to work on your ‘internal brand’ I suspect you’re one of those people who are excellent at their job but don’t realise that job progression and pay rises are hugely about networking and socialising with colleagues.

Original poster
Eastie77Returns · 27/01/2023 08:33

LeCarre · 27/01/2023 08:29

I think shendidnitnon on putpose for one of three reasons:

  1. She likes you and thinks you should be demanding more money, or
  2. She’s trying to motivate you into working harder, or
  3. She wants you to quit.

As you’ve been specifically told to work on your ‘internal brand’ I suspect you’re one of those people who are excellent at their job but don’t realise that job progression and pay rises are hugely about networking and socialising with colleagues.

I do realise the importance of networking and socialising.

I socialise with colleagues and managers to the extent that I can (young family and difficult to go to all work events etc).

I’m crap at Networking and can’t be bothered with it so that’s my own fault.

OP posts:
Lalliella · 27/01/2023 08:41

Are you sure it was Jane’s? Maybe it was your manager’s?

Justalittlebitduckling · 27/01/2023 08:48

Do you think she was trying to hint that you need to push her for a raise? Or maybe it was a genuine mistake.

MountedbyHarryWindsor · 27/01/2023 08:53

There are rumours in my own organisation of pay discrepancies but we have no way of finding out. I'd love to know how to find out these things but no chance of my manager sharing that kind of information with me either deliberately or by mistake.

Tandees · 27/01/2023 08:55

I used to be an HR Manager years ago and handled compensation data day in, day out. Believe me, managers and HR know the salaries of every employee off the back of their hands. They know you’re paid significantly less.

what I would say is this - the vast majority of people who would confront HR/Management requesting a salary review/pay rise were men. Don’t come at me, but it’s true. Experience taught me that men are far more assertive with these things.

You’d be mad not to raise this with your manager. Someone earlier in the thread has already suggested a template. Put it in writing so you have a record of the request. This is a significant data breach, your employer will be worried about this once it’s been documented.

NotAnotherTaco · 27/01/2023 09:15

@Eastie77Returns

I'm also in IT, I've not heard of the app you mentioned but it would be very useful for upcoming negotiations! There are a few apps that come up in search, which one have you used?

SleeplessInEngland · 27/01/2023 09:16

I very much doubt she did that on purpose. Why would she want to make her life much harder?