Is being dry at night parenting or nature?

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I have DS nearly 11 and DD 8.

DD is just getting dry at night. She still wears a pull up but the last couple of weeks they’ve been dry in the morning and she’s either got up for a wee in the night or first thing in the morning.

DS however has never had a dry night in his life. Is it something we’re doing or not doing? I thought it was something would happen naturally without training for, unlike potty training, but it’s not. His school residential is fast approaching, he understandably doesn’t want to go if he is still in pull ups, I’d love for him to be dry to be able to go. Any advice would be gratefully received.
This is our routine… he wears a pull up to bed, takes desmopressin 1 hour before bed. This does cut down his urine output overnight but doesn’t stop it. Without desmopressin he would wee 3 times in the night on average, with it he wee’s twice I’d say. The reason we continue with the desmopressin even though it’s not fully effective is that without it, he would wee too much for the pull up to hold and wets the bed. Taking the medication at least makes it contained in the pull up.
Just for clarity, he sleeps all through this, he is such a deep sleeper (which I think is his problem), it’s me getting up checking in the early days to see if/when he had wee’d to give a proper description to the Dr before they prescribed desmopressin.

He only drinks water, occasional lemonade. Doesn’t drink an hour before bed. Wee’s before going to bed. On advice of Dr we make sure he has big drinks throughout the day so as to make his bladder work during the day.

Sorry for the long post but I’m willing to try anything to get him on his residential 🤞🤞

It's a hormone that wakes you up, usually kicks in at some point around 4-5 so 11 is late, go back to the Dr?

Nature.
Have the continence clinic seen him and tried the alarms etc?

Def not parenting, if he sleeps through what else can you do? Especially if he wouldn't wake up if he did wet the bed and be asleep in urine.

of course isn't parenting - it is just later for some boys than others.

Yes, we’ve tried alarms, he sleeps through them and they wake the rest of the house up instead!!
Yes, seen at the continence clinic who gave all the advice i mentioned.
It was in covid times though and a bit rushed, I feel it may be time to go back and re assess.
He doesn’t like talking about it though so that’s why haven’t really pushed for that, but I think we’re at that point now.

Yes, I’ve gone into him once at 4am and he is was in a cold wet bed and hadn’t woken at all.

Stop the drinking two hours before bed. Bit exceptional to be peeing in sleep everyday at 11 years.

Definitely nature. My eldest was dry at night long before he was dry during the day. During the day, he'd get too distracted and leave it late. Can probably count on one hand the amount of times he's ever wet the bed. It's nothing we did or didn't do.

My youngest is wetting the bed most nights at the moment.

Our desmopressin routine is different to yours and followed exactly as told to us by the nurse.

Stop all drinks 1 hour before taking the medication.

1 hour later get ready for bed and go to the loo
10 minutes later go to loo again.

Double voiding (going to loo closely in succession) is important incase the bladder does not empty fully the first time.

At 11, I would think it would be good to reassess. Have you spoken to the ERIC charity? Some people have found them helpful.

Nature, my 7 year old wets every night and is in nappies to keep the bed dry as she'll learn at sonepoint soon

I will try 2 hours tonight. It’s a difficult one as he is a big drinker, he loves his cold water. But he is old enough to understand. I’ll let him have a big drink 2 hours before and just a sip to take his tablets an hour later

Nature

DS was in pull-ups until 11 when he hit puberty. The GP wouldn't prescribe desmopressin, we couldn't face the alarms, the clinic told us it would get better.

For residentials I had a quiet word with the teachers or scout leader and they sorted things out so that the other children didn't see the pull-ups.

Definitely not parenting. My 2 girls were dry overnight at 3.5 with no effort at all on my part but dh had issues until he was 14. My mil tried a lot and he had a number of appointments at various clinics, alarms etc. nothing helped.

The only thing which helped was time and a stern order to his siblings not to tease. He had a waterproof mattress protector and was taught how to change his sheet himself and put it in the wash. No one said anything either positive or negative just accept it as his way. Even as an adult he has to get up at least once so it's just how he is.

You need to discuss coping strategies on the residential with him. It partly depends how long it is, if it's just 1 or 2 nights, there are ways of being discreet with pull ups. If he's in a sleeping bag, could keep it at the bottom of the bag and put it on once they're all in bed, take it off before they get up and dispose of it at some point when everyone else is busy. Worst comes to worst, keep a water bottle by the bed and if he has a leak "accidentally" spill his drink in the bed. Have a teacher on side who knows the situation and the planned coping strategies. (They'll need to know about his medication anyway) If there's a bit of time in hand, definitely speak to GP about re referral as the are other meds that can be used in addition to desmo and also he may be able to increase the dose of desmo. I do feel for him though, it's a very stressful situation for you both and feels at the time like it's never going to improve but it will eventually.

I look at their website for advice but haven’t spoken to anyone there. Good shout… I will look into that

It is a tough situation. I actually wet the bed until I was about 11; this in the days before pull-ups, my poor mum had to change my sheets every day.

I missed my residential trip because of it. I can't actually remember when I stopped, but I do remember not wetting the bed by the time I got to secondary school. Hopefully it will be similar for your DC

It's nature.

But at their ages I'd be expecting the GP to get them referred fir further investigations

Great advice. Thank you.
I have spoken to the GP about 6 months ago about it and asked for the desmo to be increased but he said he was taking the maximum… 0.4mcg. Didn’t offer any other meds along side. Now he is nearing 11 maybe the Dr will look at things differently

My nephew had similar problems, I can't remember the actual figures but the doctor told my sister how common it is, certainly not exceptional

Luckily he grew ot of it at around age 12 and never looked back

As far as I'm aware it's not to do with parenting

Go to the GP and get desmo, it works from night 1! Then get excited about the school trip.

The alarms did work for us but they didn't wake up DC, only DH and me and we'd have to run in (up to 4 times a night at the beginning) and wake them up immediately. Eventually their brain starts to associate the feeling of needing a wee with waking up. It took about 6 weeks but it was HARD WORK.
I did read that kids tend to wake up more to the sound of their parents voice than to the sound of an alarm - apparently they're actually "programmed" to allow their adults to listen for danger and their brains just listen for their adult. No idea if that's actually true but I know you can get alarms that you can record your voice rather than an alarm sound. Didn't try that sort though.

Did you or his DF bedwet until a late age? I wet until 13 and not fully dry until 14. My DF was similar and now my DS(7) is still wet. There is a strong family history with bed wetting if parents have been bedwetters.

We are waiting for our second referral to the Enuresis Clinic and I’d suggest you go back to yours for further advice.

Contact ERIC charity for advice.

For the residential contact the school and a teacher should be able to help him manage a pull up without others noticing. We have done this for 3 Beavers sleepovers.

I remember the Enuresis nurse giving us the following advice (which I’m sure you probably know):
No apple & blackcurrant drinks
No drinks 2 hours before bed
Two wees before bed - do teeth/toilet, read a story, then toilet again
Drinks at least 1.5L water daily to stretch the bladder (the volume is age dependent though)
Child to help take responsibility for changing wet pjs, bed sheets etc

Can you record his drinking over a few days to calculate volume?
I am seeing a women's health physio and had to do the same. She pointed out I was drinking an awful lot more than I needed too.
Little changes have helped quite a lot.
Definitely try continence clinic again. Going in with the volume information will help, also messauring urine output if he is willing.
Do also try ERIC.

He's already on it, says in the op.