To find media discussion about trans issues far overstated compared to the actual seriousness of the issue?

[BarmyBrunhilde]

Full disclosure, I happily accept most trans people I've met as their transitioned gender which I know puts me at odds with most people on MN. But as a feminist and a lefty, even if one views trans women as men which I don't, in terms of political priorities it ranks so list on my list of concerns. I assume that applies to most people too (trans people included!).

What someone has listed on their birth certificate has no impact on my life, and surely minimal impact on most women's lives? Imo we should be focusing on cost of living crisis, housing, properly funding women's services including rape crisis services, funding childcare, sorting out the health service and bloody schools! Gender recognition comes way below those for me (even though I'm broadly supportive with some checks in place).

I know gender criticals won't agree with me, and maybe some trans people who feel very strongly, but I do feel there's a silent majority of us who just aren't that fussed?

It will be hard for people to admit it, but many have been had.

They were co-opted into thinking they were fighting for the next big human rights campaign. They joined the cause for the struggling trans person, uncomfortable in their body/gender identity. They wanted to make life better for these people and that was a good and noble aim. It still is.

But it's not these people who want unfettered access to women's spaces and lies to be legalised. Being vulnerable themselves I'm sure they wouldn't want to do this to vulnerable women.

The more aggressive campaigning has come from the out and out misogynists and those who get a kick out of invading women's spaces and forcing compliance from others.

Whether these people are 'truly trans' or not, I'm not sure it matters. But these are the people being indulged and accommodated now. At the expense of vulnerable women.

The same applies to transmen in terms of social acceptance.

It's less prevalent in alternative culture - & unfortunately, I think PPs are accurate as to why it's mostly male people who have glommed on to cultures with club cultures featuring a fair bit of flesh, & shiny or tactile black clothing.

The fetish crossover was never NOT there.

But no one needs to fret about transmen in quite the same way. They are female. They might or might not self exclude from female spaces, but they have every right to them.

Thanks @rufus. Yes, exactly that.

I didn't take that from her post. I could be wrong but I interpreted it to mean she's changed her mind about gender dysphoria and thinks it is all about male supremacy and men trying to access woman spaces.

Oh, let me clarify for you, Orchid.

I think both of these things can occur. I think it's only male supremacy that looks to destroy female rights & spaces.

I could be wrong but I interpreted it to mean she's changed her mind about gender dysphoria and thinks it is all about male supremacy and men trying to access woman spaces.

I know how stupid are we to think that some men are claiming a trans identity to access women's spaces. It never happens.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/scots-sex-offender-who-abducted-29012078

Yes, absolutely brilliant for anyone needing a sharp and enlightening summary of the issue.

Helen's book "Trans" is also worth reading. Just because the truth is inconvenient and/or uncomfortable doesn't mean it can be disregarded and lies put in its place.

The scotgov in particular has attempted to enshrine lies into law, to the detriment of women, children and actual trans people. Allowing anybody, anybody at all, to claim a GRC on their own say so is the total opposite of safeguarding.

I have serious concerns about the motivations behind it from some if the politicians who pushed this through, especially one or two in the Scottish green party. I cannot imagine a world where we honestly think a 6 year old should be allowed to decide on their legal sex. Maggie Chapman can. There's danger here, right in front of us, and access to our kids is the ultimate aim for someone.

Are you all just going to watch?

So this now means that it becomes remarkably easy for any male to legally become a woman. So now we can't chuck the beardy bloke out because he may very well legally be a woman.

YY. It will change the whole basis of what "female only" means.

I think part of the problem with reading posts on mumsnet is the intent behind the understanding

so if youve been on FWR and youve seen transphobic posts (albeit deleted) or you’ve seen some of the camaraderie on here you might read a post and put a bad spin on it

it doesnt really matter what the post says, its obviously got a ‘bad’ meaning because a FWR regular/KJK fan/JKR fan said it and FWR is a hive mind

well obviously thats not the case and again obviously im doing the same in reverse, i know most of the regulars as thoughtful, empathetic, friendly, caring people and i read the posts with a positive spin

it makes the middle ground…if there is one….very hard to find because SOME (not all) posters are reading some of the posts made as having an agenda which quite honestly doesn’t exist in a lot of cases

and being fair it works the other way as well…i may well misread/misunderstand a post from ‘the other side’…i dont post often cos ive read the original post a few times to make sure ive understood and then the threads moved on

which is why its incredibly frustrating when someone says that you hate trans people, or don’t think they exist, or want their rights taken away etc

If being transgender is nothing to do with gender dysphoria and is all about men wanting access to “women only” spaces, how do you explain existence of transmen?

Very few people on this board deny that a tiny minority have a psychological condition where they reject their sexed body. There are other perception-based conditions, like anorexia, body dysmorphia, BIID.

However, I don't believe they are the majority of the people calling themselves "trans".

I do not include shit stirring fuckers in my last post….

YANBU OP, I’m with you. So is pretty much everyone I know (to my knowledge).

Because you and everyone you know cba to think about the implications of the removal of the concept of 'woman'?

I do love a bit of in depth analysis of the situation.

A fair post there, Rufus.

”i may well misread/misunderstand a post from ‘the other side’…i dont post often cos ive read the original post a few times to make sure ive understood and then the threads moved on”

I agree. And I too seek to find the truth in posts. Hence my habit of asking constant questions to work out just what a poster believes and work out if, and cut through, any manipulative tactics that might be used.

Demo in Glasgow today. That's 2 female SNP politicians standing in front of a placard that advocates we "decapitate terfs"

How lovely.

#bekind

Yep, two cool gals.

I saw there were demos all over Scotland today. Do you know what i noticed? (apart from the vile placards)? a singular lack of spit-flecked women screaming and generally trying to intimidate them into silence

Yes, I know they're not holding the sign. I doubt they painted it either. They're just hanging around, swapping period stories with the " gals" and offering advice on how to do their eyebrows...and someone takes a snap. How were they to know that Jocasta had held that silly, jokey, we really didn't mean it, sign up at that exact moment?

And I think this has been the MO. Infiltrate groups that have had to fight for rights and hijack them, eat them up from the inside so that groups main purpose is to protect them and give them access to what they want first they infiltrated the LBG community and used their established networks and rights campaigning to infiltrate government and try and equate their rights with those hard fought for by the gay community, but their misogyny shone through when they tried to get rid of the gay women and deny their voice, being gay and being trans are totally different - trans people really are a separate group,

Then the tried to infiltrate womens hard fought for rights to create divisions between women, literally taking our spaces and trying to shut down women’s voices, getting them sacked, excluded from social media, shutting form their voices (esp rich successful and intelligent ones). They want to use womens as human shields, to play along with them. They don’t like women. Now why would they want to remove womens voices?

Then they infiltrated children’s safeguarding…, normal safeguarding procedures around children have been set aside… parents removed from discussion…,why? And why has this been allowed?

One could speculate, but it would likely earn you a deletion or ban

.

What about when your children are grown up? Maybe their life takes an unfortunate turn and they end up in a refuge or a prison. They're adults by this point of course, but still your children, and in a very vulnerable position.

Oh I would never speculate, just sharing some random questions that popped into my head.