To ask if my landlord is being unreasonable?

[waveyc]

We live in a private rented property. Last night I was upstairs in the bedroom when I heard the loudest crash and bang. Obviously went to investigate absolutely petrified thinking somebody had bricked our window, to find our glass shower screen had exploded. Glass covering every single surface in the bathroom and it had travelled outside all over the landing carpet. Thankfully our 3 year old DS was nowhere near at the time.

Me and DH spent the best part of an hour cleaning up as best as we could. I was shaken up just because I was so shocked and the noise was so, so loud.

Anyway, I reported it to my letting agent who has told us that the landlord will not be paying for the cost of a replacement and has blamed us for the damage.

For context, just over 12 months ago our oven door also shattered which he did replace. Another freak incident which we just couldn't explain. We have not damaged the shower screen in any way and now we are being told it is our fault and he is suspicious because of the oven door incident. He's said we either pay now or he deducts the money from our deposit at the end of the tenancy agreement

I have no idea if we are being completely unreasonable in saying we do not want to pay for the replacement as it wasn't our fault.

AIBU?

I'd stick a shower curtain up and be done with it. If they try to take if from your deposit, and even if the deposit scheme sides with them, they won't allow for betterment - so will only give the value as a percentage of new based on how long it would typically be expected to last Vs how old it was. At 7 or 8 years old the deemed value would be peanuts.

We had a massive walk in shower in our last house that we had installed (not personally but had someone reputable put it in for us) and after about a year the whole thing shattered and there was glass everywhere. There was no 'obvious reason' in terms of impact etc, and luckily there was nobody in the house at the time. It was scary to think about what could have happened if someone had been in the bathroom at the time though

Keep the glass, it needs checking.

This happened to my neice when her daughters were children, a glass door exploded and severed an artery in the older child's leg. She was in hospital for days, and still limping 5 years later. The glass was proven to be sub standard and the land lard was liable

This was the letter we had from the manufacturer. Clearly they have a standard letter so this is not entirely uncommon! I had only enquired about a replacement and made no mention of any other claim for damages (there were none).

We were sorry to hear of your product shattering.
As you will appreciate, it is not possible for us to speculate on the cause of such an incident but please be assured that all of the glass used by XXX is manufactured and tested to the European Standard EN:14428:2004. This standard ensures the safety of the toughened glass used in our shower enclosures and bath screens.
In the unlikely event of glass breakage, the glass is designed to shatter as safely as possible into small fragments as would appear to be the case in your situation.

As the cause of the breakage is unknown, we cannot accept any responsibility for this or indeed any other material damage (including any claim for costs relating to any damage to the surrounding area, including tray and tiles or any other consequential loss etc. when you are removing the old product and fitting the new one or any consequential damage caused by the breakage) or personal injury under the terms of our Product Guarantee.
XXX guarantees apply to the original purchaser, and are of a non-transferrable nature.

However, as a gesture of goodwill and on a strictly full and final settlement basis of all further claims associated with this incident, we would be prepared to supply a replacement free of charge. The installation of which would be up to you to arrange at your discretion.

YANBU it's up to your landlord to sort.

Yes it happened to our neighbours below us once. Just randomly exploded.

Talk to the scheme that holds your deposit, @waveyc . They should be able to advise you.

Make sure you have some data on this to hand. Google is your friend.

Spontaneous shattering of shower screens is not common, but it definitely does occur. Happened to us - and it certainly wasn't a cheap enclosure.

You need to reply to the estate agents email as otherwise they may consider you agree.

Just send them the link and state that it should be repaired within a reasonable timeframe.

Tenants cannot be asked to carry out repairs to the property, even if they have caused the damage. That’s what the deposit and insurance is for. A shower screen is just part of wear and tear.

If the screen is 7-8 years old, they wouldn't be able to charge you replacement cost anyway. Even if it was your fault. Which it isnt.

@messybutfun which link?

Definitely can - I had a TV cabinet do the same with no warning whatsoever!!
I went through insurance and it was fine.

This happened to me so you have my sympathy OP

Hi OP, I’m a Landlord and I would claim this sort of thing on my LL insurance as I have accidental damage included on structural contents - like showers. It’s really simple and absolutely irrelevant whether it exploded randomly or you were playing cricket in the bathroom. Accidents happen. He’s being a dick.

Agree with PP - use shower curtain for now and dispute any deposit deductions when you leave.

Only caveat is can you make the room safe? If there are sharp bits left your LL may be forced to fix it? I’d be very worried about liability if I were him.

Landlord here. Your LL has insurance for this and should be replacing the screen. If were them, I'd replace with a shower curtain.

I've been on the receiving end of a shattering oven door myself and know these things can happen - though Bosch tried to blame me.

@RaiseTheStakesAndMakeTheLastWordDuckhead The hinge is still in with glass shards sticking out but we have been told to remove it ourself and make it as safe as we can as they won't send somebody out to do it. It's absolutely ridiculous!

Your deposit is safe in the independent deposit scheme, if you contest the deduction the landlord can't touch the money until and agreement is reached. I don't understand landlords like this? It's not a huge expense if in general you are good tenants?

Reply to the agent, reiterating that it was spontaneous shattering (use the link PP have provided to Wikipedia and probable causes). Say you note that the LL will not be replacing and you will install a curtain pole and shower curtain.

Keep the documents and deal with the deposit scheme dispute at the end of the tenancy.

Fwiw, I’m a LL and I’d feel suspicious because of the oven door, but I’d understand it could be total coincidence. I’d probably install you a curtain pole!

@NoSquirrels We've been so unlucky with the oven door and now this it is actually almost unbelievable!!

My neighbour had a fairly new showerpanel shatter into tiny bits just like that; she wasn't even in the bathroom. The fitter told her it sometimes happens.

This happened to us! Still no idea how

This seems to be a case of suspicion because it's happened before with the oven and therefore the landlord is sceptical. It doesn't mean he is right, though. He could have investigated, inspected the damage and questioned and discussed with you - or got the letting agency to do so - before deciding to refuse to carry out the responsibility as a landlord for maintenance of the property.

Contact the local council housing department as they have general responsibility for monitoring and enforcing the law of landlord and tenant. The section that deals with private landlord and tenant can advise you about landlord's and tenant's respective responsibilities.
They often have information about other cases and about individual landlords in their locality. They have probably heard of disputes before over shattered glass.

Probably a longshot assuming he’s well supervised, but is there any chance the toddler has been messing around with the glass (ie banging things against it) without you knowing it and it finally gave out? And maybe the same thing happened previously? Or does he like to idly knock toys and whatnot against it?

I can’t fully fault the landlord for thinking this seems a little unlikely to be a complete coincidence, even if it’s unclear what the common cause is.

How is it your landlords fault?? Does he shower there regularly?!!

What are you on about? It's not like the OP has taken a hammer to it, it spontaneously exploded. It is down to the landlord to replace it. Nothing to do with the fault of the landlord.