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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To expect my exH to rent rather than buy?

199 replies

PopitPop · 19/01/2023 08:43

Asking for your viewpoints on the morality of this - I know I need legal advice.

H is useless, mean, doesn't help, I've tried again and again to talk and been ignored or laughed at. It's over for me. He won't accept it but I'm cracking on working out how it will work.

We have been married 6 years.
We own a home worth £600k.
£280k of this is equity
I put in ALL this equity (from savings, inheritance, a sale of a flat before I met him)
I earn £75k
He earns £30k.

I work full time and also do all the housework and childcare. I am the higher earner but also do most of everything. He is pretty hands off. He likes video games more than his job/family/friends.

Anyway - I spoke to a solicitor who said that he will get a much bigger % of that equity because he can't afford to buy a house round here on £30k without taking a huge % of that equity.

I want H to live in a home that is suitable for our 3 young DC to go stay and I want to be fair.

But is it really fair that he takes say 75% plus of the equity to allow him to buy somewhere?

He chose a job that pays £30k. He quit his high paid job. He chose to have no savings. He can afford to rent somewhere suitable but for him to buy somewhere with 3 beds - he would need to take a huge % of that equity. I would need to sell the home. I've worked bloody hard and have saved, worked overtime, pushed for promotion etc (and been fortunate to get an inheritance from a relative I know).

Do the settlements always look at what someone can BUY?

AIBU to think that he should have enough money to rent somewhere but shouldnt expect to be given enough money to buy somewhere?

Pls don't feel sorry for him. I can't tell you how awful he's been over the last 2 years.

OP posts:
Saurus72 · 19/01/2023 16:12

Ugh this really is rubbish but I was told the exact same thing when I got divorced. I honestly thought the splitting of assets would be based on how much we each paid into the mortgage etc but it totally isn’t. My blood ran cold when there were conversations re: whether my then H could potentially apply for some of my pension savings (that I had worked so hard for over so many years while he didn’t), it made me feel sick and also very stupid. Luckily nothing came of the pension allocation but we did have to split house equity 50/50 when I had paid c. 70% of mortgage and bills.

Wetblanket78 · 19/01/2023 16:12

My brother had to do this to add indult to injury. He took a mortgage out on they're house that they scrimped and saved to buy without a mortgage. Though added value to it with a double extension and a lot of work. So he payed half of the house she chose to move to over 200 miles away with his son and the bloke she was leaving him for. She had been a STHM until nephew was at school. She left him in debt with all the money spent on the house that she wanted on credit. My brother is on a good wage. But she had contributed a lot working to support him while he got his degree at uni. I don't think he would be where he is today if she hadn't. He also had to pay £60 per week maintenance as well as his phone when he got older. His ex wouldn't meet half way with his son either. So only saw him in the holidays and special occasions. If there's children involved and your the higher earner. I don't think you have a choice in the matter to provide a stable home for them to stay with both parents if you have the finances. If it was the other way around with him being the higher earner. You would expect the same.Could he stay with someone until he saves enough to buy.

JudgeRudy · 19/01/2023 16:22

ICanHideButICantRun · 19/01/2023 14:13

WHY ON EARTH WOULD SHE DO THAT?

Show quote history

Well the children would have a home where they could spend time with their dad (thats a concern for her) with minimum upheaval, she would recieve some income from his rent, which she could put towards mortgage on another property (which she's got to get anyway if they sell the family home) and she doesn't loose 3/4 of the equity. As I said, random suggestion

gogohmm · 19/01/2023 16:24

As the marriage is under 10 years you could argue to take into consideration what each of you brought to the marriage financially

Testina · 19/01/2023 16:34

“She left him in debt with all the money spent on the house that she wanted on credit” @Wetblanket78 that was at least equally his decision - possibly more his decision as being the earner, he could have cut the money off.

Reugny · 19/01/2023 16:37

Testina · 19/01/2023 14:30

Most things aren’t “quite simple” though.

Sure, the process of owning a house as Tenants in Common with a Deed of Trust for the deposit is really really simple bash stuff.

Works fairly simple with death or split of an unmarried couple.

But not divorce. You have no guarantee of “simply” ring fencing that deposit entirely outwith the finances considered. It’s not bad thing to have done it, it shows the intention of the parties to treat it separately. But a judge can still decide that it’s relevant to the overall financial picture - which means it’s effectively not longer ringfenced at all.

Show quote history

This.

That's why lots of older couples in long term relationships were at least one of them has children I've met since I was a teen weren't/aren't married. Some of the couples were/are in relationships that lasted longer than their actual marriages.

Testina · 19/01/2023 16:38

gogohmm · 19/01/2023 16:24

As the marriage is under 10 years you could argue to take into consideration what each of you brought to the marriage financially

@gogohmm where are you getting your 10 years from?

If you’re referring to the concept of “short marriage”, whilst there’s no exact rule, the guideline as per White vs White (2000) is generally less than 5 years. And that’s where there are no children - here there are 3.

BunchHarman · 19/01/2023 16:49

I’m really sorry for you, OP. Women seem to lose out so often, whatever the circumstances. And so do the children.

He sounds like an useless, lazy, selfish, neglectful cunt. I know that doesn’t help but you might feel heard. Good luck.

Reugny · 19/01/2023 16:50

JustAnotherLawyer2 · 19/01/2023 15:29

Firstly, you're saying he's abusive and won't leave - apply for a non molestation order and an occupation order.

Secondly, find another solicitor.

This isn't about him being able to house the children in the same way as you - you're clearly the main carer, you have childcare arranged, despite him being the lower earner, and you say he doesn't do anything for the kids anyway. All he needs is potentially a two bed, so that if in the future he has the children to stay, they have a bedroom to share, and when they get older, they can have the two bedrooms, and he can sleep in the sitting room (housing criteria says all rooms can be used as bedrooms except kitchens/bathrooms). You need to be creative with your suggestions when you go to the FDR. Provide evidence of what he can afford on his salary (shared ownership properties if he wants to insist on a 3 bed) - each party is obliged to provide three properties for the other person, and three for themselves when going to court...so you pick what works for you as the main carer and what would work for him. You also point out what is less disruptive for the kids (staying in current house, and how that could work - you giving him 50k as deposit on shared ownership for example.)

A decent family lawyer should be able to NEGOTIATE this with him outside of court and get agreement for a consent order. People always say 'get a SH lawyer', but you need a lawyer who knows how to negotiate and settle when it comes to family law.

The bar is high to get non-mol and occupation orders. Just saying someone is abusive without evidence won't get you them.

Also the OP can get an opinion from another solicitor or even better a direct access barrister but is unlikely to change the outcome very much.

She can also and should actually try to negotiate a settlement but her husband may refuse to co-operate - remember you need to parties to come to an agreement. He could then drive up the OP legal bills by being as difficult as possible.

Even then if he does accept it but self-represents the judge may refuse to rubber stamp it if it is completely one sided.

UneasyMe · 19/01/2023 16:53

God OP, I get it with bells on. I found my divorce sickening for very similar reasons. I’m free now, but still have a mental jolt when I think of the vast sum of money handed over to someone who could hardly have been a worse husband.

FloydPepper · 19/01/2023 17:09

Testina · 19/01/2023 16:34

“She left him in debt with all the money spent on the house that she wanted on credit” @Wetblanket78 that was at least equally his decision - possibly more his decision as being the earner, he could have cut the money off.

So the higher earner holds the purse strings and can cut it off? No family money?

wouldn’t that be financial abuse according to many on here?

FloydPepper · 19/01/2023 17:11

BunchHarman · 19/01/2023 16:49

I’m really sorry for you, OP. Women seem to lose out so often, whatever the circumstances. And so do the children.

He sounds like an useless, lazy, selfish, neglectful cunt. I know that doesn’t help but you might feel heard. Good luck.

Not here. When it comes to divorce higher earners or those with assets lose out. Regardless of sex.

Testina · 19/01/2023 17:13

FloydPepper · 19/01/2023 17:09

So the higher earner holds the purse strings and can cut it off? No family money?

wouldn’t that be financial abuse according to many on here?

Show quote history

I was speaking in relation to unnecessary items for a house, bought on credit. It’s not financially abusive to not take out a DFS credit scheme for a sofa you don’t need, for example.

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 19/01/2023 17:14

Get a second opinion. A friend of ours was earning much less than his wife and ended up with a bigger court settlement from the equity because the court decided her earning power was a lot more. Would you not be better just cutting your losses and splitting the equity 50/50 so that you can both afford to buy rather than rent ? I know it would stick in your throat but unless you ring fenced your contribution to buying the home, I can’t see much option other than relying on the fact that a court would rely on the short nature of the marriage in apportioning entitlement. Which they may not.

Marmight · 19/01/2023 17:24

Can you go p/t at work to reduce your salary so it is much more on parity with his? You could say that you are now finding it too stressful.
Would work allow this and then back to f/t once the divorce and finances are finalised?

Wetblanket78 · 19/01/2023 17:47

A lot of it wasn't discussed though she just went and did it. Anything for they're child she wouldn't buy supermarket clothes. It had to be from monsoon or next. She wouldn't consider shopping elsewhere if she could get it cheaper.. She insisted on top quality saying they'll pay it off in no time when both are earning earning. She also had an online gambling addiction that she hid. Then she chose to walk away from the house. Didn't want it. My brother was stuck with a 4 bedroom house he couldn't sell. He rented it out for a while and rented a small one bed flat for himself. He did eventually sell it. But he hid it from her that he made a small profit on it. It was enough to cover half the debt's and he was a to buy a small two bed.

Original poster
PopitPop · 19/01/2023 17:52

Thanks for all the advice -and the stories - some of which are encouraging, and some of which are horrifying. A woman who discovered her husband cheating on her with men from Grindr and she had to pay him off??? GAH>

I started thinking today reading this thread that maybe splitting isn't best option. It will be such a mess and I lose so much. We can just co-habit.

But H got home and I started talking about DS being quite unwell and sent home from school - and he instantly started looking at TikTok on his phone on full volume. I can't live like this. I think he hates me. But yet he won't accept splitting. Messes with your head.

OP posts:
emptythelitterbox · 19/01/2023 18:04

You need to talk to a different attorney that represents yours and only your interests.

Do your research as there are plenty who aren't for women around. Same with posters here.

Someone who talks about what's fair for the other party is ridiculous. They don't represent him.

You don't have to divorce him but that doesn't mean you have to stay living with him either if you get my drift.

Living apart means you don't have to put up with his shit nor do you have to pay for him.

KettrickenSmiled · 19/01/2023 18:17

But H got home and I started talking about DS being quite unwell and sent home from school - and he instantly started looking at TikTok on his phone on full volume.
Precisely the kind of incident you need to document & time-stamp.
Not as compelling as evidenced proof of H's lack of involvement in his own DC's care, but a pattern of this kind of low level behaviour adds up to a significant indicator of who should be the main RP.

caringcarer · 19/01/2023 18:20

How much was your inheritance? In some cases judges take inheritance out of equation. You could try arguing after you split you will have to go part time to accommodate DC.

BabyDriversMummy · 19/01/2023 18:22

Get a really good Divorce Lawyer.

Reugny · 19/01/2023 18:30

KettrickenSmiled · 19/01/2023 18:17

But H got home and I started talking about DS being quite unwell and sent home from school - and he instantly started looking at TikTok on his phone on full volume.
Precisely the kind of incident you need to document & time-stamp.
Not as compelling as evidenced proof of H's lack of involvement in his own DC's care, but a pattern of this kind of low level behaviour adds up to a significant indicator of who should be the main RP.

That is worth SFA.

The bar for parenting in family court is set very low.

Testina · 19/01/2023 18:31

“A woman who discovered her husband cheating on her with men from Grindr and she had to pay him off??? GAH>”

Yep, that was my friend.
But what if she was a total shit to him? Emotionally and financially abusive? Left him to look after the kids whilst she forged ahead in her career, and blocked him at every turn trying to have one of his own? Insisting he takes the time off when kids are sick, puts him down before and interview. Has affairs left right and centre. And then one fateful day, she walks in on his one wrong doing - which you could say he was pushed to - and then rubs her hands with glee that she can now divorce him and keep all the money.

There’s a good reason why the financial settlement in a divorce isn’t used as a punitive measure. It sucks for individuals, but it’s right for a society.

Testina · 19/01/2023 18:32

KettrickenSmiled · 19/01/2023 18:17

But H got home and I started talking about DS being quite unwell and sent home from school - and he instantly started looking at TikTok on his phone on full volume.
Precisely the kind of incident you need to document & time-stamp.
Not as compelling as evidenced proof of H's lack of involvement in his own DC's care, but a pattern of this kind of low level behaviour adds up to a significant indicator of who should be the main RP.

Do you have any experience of such information being used?

I’m with @Reugny

Starseeking · 19/01/2023 18:35

As you were married, you're not going to get away with giving him £50k if the house is worth £600k.

Think yourself lucky if you manage to get an agreement to pay him £200k. It's not so he can buy, more because he needs to have an equal share of the assets.

If the DC are staying with you, you should be awarded over 50%, though given your comparative earning potential I can't imagine you'd get much more than 60% of the joint assets.

Good luck OP, some men are absolutely awful.

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