To think we could make housing estates like Center Parcs re cars

[QuertyGirl]

The USP of Centre Parcs is for many, the fact that they are mostly car free. Kids can play out and ride their bikes like I did when I was kid.

Can't do that now due to the amount of cars, speed and size of cars and, attitude of some car drivers.

People (including myself) pay a small fortune to holiday at CP.

Why can't we make housing estates more like that?

Communal car parks in walking distance, deliveries by small electric vehicles from a hub (like old fashioned milk floats), exemptions for blue badge holders and funding for electric mobility scooters for those that need them.

Yet, if the council suggests a couple of cycle lane and all hell breaks loose.

"I know that some people cannot walk, ride a bike, a mobility scooter or even a self propelled wheelchair."

Even if a person with a disability can do those things they should be able to park close to their home if that works better for them.

Reasonable adjustments are not just about what someone absolutely can't do. They go beyond that.

Have you ever been 'on ca;' or worked shifts? Would you be happy to walk 15 mins at 2.00am?

Are you going to have some security at the car park?

Agree entirely.

Did your mother and grandmother work? I think in this society we have completely different lives to how it used to be.

If you don’t have a choice but to use public transport that’s different but a lot need a car and have lengthy commutes. Children in breakfast clubs from 7.30am etc. Why make your day any longer than necessary? If you can’t drive then you build your life around being unable to drive.

It sounds like you’re making the presumption that people don’t spend time outdoors unless they’re walking to their car, in my family this definitely isn’t the case at all.

Youre also making it sound very idyllic this lovely 15 minute walk to the car with children. We all know this wouldn’t be the case at all!

Wouldn’t it be lovely for your kids to one day be able to safely be able to walk or cycle to school on their own? Shame about all that traffic!

Yes they worked.

What they did have was local services; work, school, shops, library etc all nearby. We need to get back to that.

It still exists in many towns and cities, the commuter belt round London is terrible for that though. Needs fixing.

I think this depends largely on where you live though? If you’re in a busy city then you’re going to have more traffic? We walk to school and my children will be able to walk to school safely. This isn’t the case for everyone though and making people in residential areas park 15 minutes away isn’t feasible in a city?

Procrastinating - low traffic neighbourhoods in cities make it safe for kids to walk and cycle to school

Those 50% don't own a car but most with physical disabilities will be driven by others because they can't drive what world are you living in where the blind and physically impaired can all just walk or cycle. Disability also includes mental ones of course if love a brain injured non coordinated individual with no spacial awareness cycling into grandad.

I lived on an estate like this. I quite liked it (though we only had one child when we lived there - I do think I'd have found it more annoying with a baby and toddler), but it was SUCH a nightmare when we came to sell - it was really clear and prominent in the listing but we still had so many waste of time appointments where viewers would turn up and instantly declare they couldn't possibly live there. I think people didn't quite believe the listing! The horror from family and friends about things that I didn't think were a massive deal - eg that I would put the baby in the sling to take him to the car - also made it very clear to me that this is not an option that very many people at all would willingly choose.

If you read the next comment I elaborated as I realised it could be read that way; it meant not people with no disability who just can’t cope with rain or wind or the dark (there plenty of comments using this as a reason for it not being an option on this thread).

But parents don't let them walk or cycle anyway they don't let them out even the gardens in summer are empty. Parents don't want their little angels to get cold or wet walking to school...or busing...no amount of pedestrianisation will change the attitude that children even at 16 need to be kept safe from child snatchers and getting wet it's not the traffic parents are scared of.

Blind person driving a car coming through.....

Yes of course. But you are still not reading what I am saying and not arguing in good faith so I am not going to comment anymore.

But how do you make a decision who has no disability and can't be bothered? I went 5 years without a diagnosis. 5 years being made to feel it was all in my head because my blood tests were normal. 5 years of finding it so hard to cope with moving to much or getting cold but beating myself up that I was somehow lazy. Then finally I was diagnosed with a neurological condition that is not just disabling but life threatening. I was just as ill with the condition in those preceding 5 years before I was diagnosed, in fact more so.

And my story so sadly is not at all unique.

"I think this depends largely on where you live though? If you’re in a busy city then you’re going to have more traffic? We walk to school and my children will be able to walk to school safely. This isn’t the case for everyone though and making people in residential areas park 15 minutes away isn’t feasible in a city?"

I agree. My kids, until they went to secondary school, were able to walk to and from school. One very busy road to cross (typically the one the school is on) but that has a crossing and a lollipop lady.

They have been able to play out too. There has been a fair bit of derision about these of us who chose to live in a more rural location, as that does tend to mean we need cars more, but there is a payoff.

what on earth! 😂🫣

Lots could be done in rural locations though that's not being done. I used to live in quite a rural village, which had some facilities of it's own but the GP, bigger supermarket, health visitor appointments, gym, swimming etc was a village over 3 miles away. Options for cycling were either a very busy road or a broken canal path. Buses weren't great.

If the council had made a proper separated cycle path along the busy road I would have bought a bike and my life would have been easier (no more relying on DH who took the only car with him to work).

You know who would have had the biggest benefit of this? Teenagers. They wouldn't have had to be stuck in a village with not much to do.

And your refusing to understand the various different disabilities and stages of diagnosis harping on about the magic 50% without understanding it's nothing like that number who do not need access to cars and many many more who do not meet benefits definitions of disability but are not able to walk.....if you get cerebral dementia you are not automatically classed disabled from day one of symptoms and may well still be unaware your not capable but nobody would expect you to make your own way anywhere and possibly your so effected that you could suddenly become a danger even if walking accompanied your carer needs a car....there are many many examples but it seems unless your struck down your blinkers are fully up.

I am not saying we should ban cars.

I am saying we should make sure people can walk and cycle everywhere and that will help disabled people too.

To be honest, these are all reasons for better infrastructure and walkable cities! Cars do not equal freedom but I don’t think you are going to change your mind. It’s a bit like America and gun culture for some people.

No I don't mind walking and cycling being made easier but until you have a system that makes getting around possible (not just easier) for those with issues labeled, rubber stamped by a badge or not you can't make life harder for them as if they are worthless waiting to die and costing us money.....at the moment we are still building infa structure like railways that are not disabled friendly we still have a mental attitude such as prams on buses thinking they are as needy as disabled and not enough buses....you can't ban cars until you address the other issues and you can't address them while people are all saying there is no money, were not paying more taxes but I have 4 or in one case on here 7 holidays a year but need more free childcare. The problem is money is limited and disabled voices not as loud as eco worriers who can easily protest or parents who are needed to work.

How does it help disabled as in all disabled not just labelled ones

@jannier

1, Nobody wants to ban cars

2, No single change will fix everything for every disabled person. We're a diverse group. Right now, we actively discriminate against anyone (disabled or not) who doe's have access to a car.