Are you patriotic ?

[janet0001]

Do you feel patriotic ?

I do feel patriotic and I got laughed at and basically mocked when I said it.

I was quite upset about that - AIBU?

OP, people often equate patriotism with nationalism, jingoism and blind loyalty so perhaps that’s why you were mocked. I feel fortunate to live in the West with clean water, toilets, electricity and a solid infrastructure. I am proud of English literature, inventions, the ability to laugh at ourselves. I am not proud of English racism, classism and snobbery. Am I patriotic? Probably not.

No I'm not. I equate it with being a royalist, which I'm not, living in the past and being a Tory.

I did a lot of travelling in my younger days. I always missed this country. The music, the TV, the humour, the old fashioned customs but most of all the feeling that we looked after each other by being proud of our NHS, giving kids a good education and being tolerant of each other.

It's changed and it seems to be the people who claim to be the most patriotic who are destroying the things that made us a great country.

When it come to Scotland, yes very much.

When it comes to the UK, no not at all. The opposite actually.

OP, I'm struggling to understand how you could not be aware of the potentially negative connotations of patriotism? As others have pointed out, it's often simply a cover for racism, and a way to declare others as alien to you (not just discriminating against people of actual different nationalities, immigrants and refugees, but also people who are of that nationality and from ethnic minorities).

Identifying with one nation versus another is also the basic basis for wars between nations. - protecting or gaining more for your nation at the cost of another.

There is a reason why far right, nationalist groups often use the flag in their branding!

Of course, there can be a benign form of relaxed affection/ pride in one's country. But surely you aren't unaware of the negative connotations- especially, since you are British, in the wake of seeing how national pride was used for racist means during the brexit campaign? Or how the US and confederate flags, and 'Make America Great Again' mandate fuelled far right extremism in the US over the last free years?

No. In fact I'm embarrassed to say I'm English.

I am generally embarrassed by my nationality so in that sense no

It seems silly to be proud of something just because of where I was born

No, i find the whole die for my country stuff very odd

This is such an immature attitude. Were struggling because were short of working age people so lots of people moving abroad is not a great idea. If there a lot of people who are unhappy, can't we work out a way to make it a better place to live.

They shouldn't have to sacrifice their happiness living in a country they hate because we have workforce problems! Would you say that to a nurse who can't bear working in the NHS anymore? Some people just don't like living in Britain. Don't make them feel guilty, let them go. And lets recruit from peoplec who do want to live here.

For Wales 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿 yes. For the UK no not really.

Absolutely this.

It broke the belief I had that we would basically do the right thing. I'd always felt there were groups of mindless idiots who waved the Union flag and bashed up bars abroad during the football but that the majority of people were sane and reasonable. It's not just the vote itself but the number of weirdos that became obsessed with it posting on a daily basis and telling people to get over it without the slightest attempt to understand the implications and why people were upset.

Similarly with continuing to vote for an obviously politically bankrupt and corrupt Conservative Government when it was clear the country was already starting to fall apart. Not realising that you can't have decent public services and ever lower taxes. Still voting in people who clearly have their own agenda to enrich themselves.

I've just given up with them. I live here because my friends and family do and because I'm too old to start again. But I would not choose here as my preferred home if I could have chosen where I was born.

It's changed and it seems to be the people who claim to be the most patriotic who are destroying the things that made us a great country.

And absolutely this.

Yes and no. There are a lot of things that are embarrassing about being British but there are also lots of things to be proud of.

I always try and be the best ambassador I can for our country when I go abroad as I hate the (not always untrue) notion that British people are rude and ignorant louts when travelling.

I remember feeling real pride in our country during the London olympics. The opening ceremony, the success of our athletes, the volunteers, the diversity and inclusivity of it all. It summed up everything I felt made Britain great. And then Brexit happened and the Tories did what we all knew they would do. I also came to realise that a significant proportion of our population is racist.

i’m now ashamed to be British. We’re at best a laughing stock. At worst, we’ve become a horribly divided country with nasty thugs parading their St George crosses as a weapon against anyone they don’t like.

The hard right has destroyed everything that was good about this once great country.

I'm not patriotic in the slightest.

I'm not proud to be from the UK at the moment! We are in a mess.

The most patriotic I have been is when we held the 2012 Olympics. It was truly magnificent, and for me showed the best of being British.

Its all gone a bit shit since then!

Lots of people don't have the skills... have family commitments or are too old to emigrate.

You people voted to make moving to Europe extremely difficult & have divided the country, probably forever, you ve also wrecked why many were proud of the UK but aren't now.

You ve also added to the stresses on the NHS with so many EU health workers who have left the UK.

...and pls don't insult us by saying you didn't.

Visa and health insurance costs make lower paid workers coming here not practical... we have higher immigration now because we are allowing in 5m HK Chinese, regardless of skill or age, they are not able or interested in doing the work EU workers used to do and the Ukrainians whilst younger, often have young children and will return to Ukraine when they can but when they are able to work, are fantastic employees.

I think you wont be surprised to know i'm not particularly patriotic... what is there to be patriotic about? Liz Truss? NHS? Transport? roads? or Sunak?

If you actually read what they put, it sounds like they liked living here until 2016 which was the year we voted to leave the EU. There could be potentially millions of people who want to leave. We can replace them but how easy would that be?I

Also if the PP is in my position then it will be really really hard to just go and live abroad. I'm in my 50s, I don't have skills that are in demand abroad. Also my loved ones are here. I have friends that go back 40+ years and my is nearly 80 and I want to live in the same country as her.

It is comparable to the NHS nursing situation. I've got two relatives who are NHS nurses and they were so proud to join in the 90s and they're both senior nurse s. They love the NHS but it's on its knees and they are struggling to provide the service they want so they're very unhappy. However they still have the passion for nursing. They could go and work in the private sector but they'd rather improve where the work.

No, I don't. I think it's weird to be proud of being a particular nationality as if it's not anything other than an accident of birth.

People who make this argument never explain why they didn't leave prior to 2016, if living as part of the EU was so intolerable.

@Alexandra2001 You people voted to make moving to Europe extremely difficult

I take that as you think I voted for Brexit. Which shows how little you know about me, my background or my work.

What's done is done. You might have the energy to keep going over the vote and talk about getting another referendum, but I have other more compelling things to think about at present. There are more places in the world to move, live and work than the EU. Instead of people being unhappy with their lot in life, why not set goals to change that?

Billy Bragg wrote very interesting on seeing at George flags, albeit sometime ago. As a left winger he immediately thought of the bnp and racists etc But he realised and thought “why should the left allow the “baddies” to appropriate a flag which represents one of the nations making up the uk who fought for workers rights, who not only abolished slavery in its own territories but fought to outlaw the practice globally, who welcomed into its education system many from overseas eho fought against unjust laws devised by the uk elites.
Why should the resilience and resistance to naziism in 1939 not be admired? To realise that the rest of the world has either been conquered (Europe) supports the enemy(Russia) or does not want to get involved.
The brexit vote did not go the way I wanted-but did those who voted the same as I did jump up and down like crazed chimps and overthrow the government. We accept a high number of asylum applications. The last few years have been trying, but it’s down to us to make it better.

Yes I am 100%. Both myself, my husband and my son are veterans (my son actually now deceased lost his life whilst serving with the peace keeping forces in Kosovo) - we took our coin and we served for our Queen (and now King) and country. Yes, very patriotic.

Yes but in the sense we should be proud of our past glories like the empire, two world war victories, our time as top dog on the world stage. Yes in the sense of all the good we've done for the world (whether they appreciate it or not) and yes in the sense that traditionally our country has undoubtedly been "the best", whether that's the people, the culture or whatever else.

That doesn't stop me looking around now and wondering how we've allowed it to turn to shit like it has. The Will Durant quotation "A great civilization is not conquered from without until it has destroyed itself from within" sums us up nicely, the period since WW2 has seen us allowing the systematic deconstruction of all that made Britain "Great" for so long.