To tell you the NHS is a frightening failure for children?

[redorbreak]

I suppose when we read headlines it's A&E waiting times and often focused on adults

But I'm here to give a personal account of how dangerous it is for children, something we haven't shone the light on as much as adult care and waiting times being horrible right now.

DD was born very prematurely and she had some awful breathing this morning, which then worsened into sucking in a lot at the rib cage (not that unusual for her but it seemed worse than usual). She couldn't stay awake much

I knew an ambulance would take a long time and needed the car, so I was going to drive her myself. I went to put her into her car seat and she went floppy, like a rag doll. Limp and floppy. I screamed and luckily H was there who phoned an ambulance

I explained calmly but seriously on the phone what was going on. The phone operator said 5 hour wait. I said please, she's gone floppy. Please help us. She said sorry, but 5 hour wait times. Can I take her myself?

I explained I could take her myself but I wouldn't be able to see if she was okay or not? I'd be driving. She said that was safer than waiting for an ambulance

I put the phone down and took her in, frightened, petrified for her life. I got there after 25 minutes and rushed to her. She was still not responding. She was triaged straight away. Her Sats were sitting at 69/70.

She is currently in PICU (intensive care) and I don't know when she will wake up. Nobody seems to be straight with me. I'm not getting a clear picture here. My H is on his way up now and hopefully they will tell me straight what this means for her now

The NHS is fucked.

@wyntersuhn can I ask what country you're in?

@wyntersuhn

Sounds good. What country?

Also agree with @YorkshireTeaCup suggestion of a paediatric first aid course for all parents. We had one run by a paramedic. This was how I knew to ignore the "advice" of the 999 call handler.

@redorbreak

I will say a prayer for you and your little girl, bless you & your family.

Is anyone living in Ireland reading this thread? What is the state of your Health Service, particularly for emergencies? I have no idea of the current population of the UK, but the NHS clearly is in crisis with numbers needing care.

I’m so sorry, things are safe right now. It’s worse than the height of Covid. More needs to be done.

I'm told that in Switzerland if you go to A & E (it doesn't have to be for an emergency) you're seen within an hour. You can then get a second opinion from a different A & E on the same basis if you want. If there's more than a one hour wait, patients complain.

If this gets into the international papers (it will) I predict a sharp downturn in tourism to the UK, which will be yet another economic and reputational blow.

5 hours is fast in todays time it was going to be 14 hours for my fil when he had a major heart attack 5 weeks ago now has 4 stints but if neighbours couldn't get him into a car he would be dead

Not if it’s your mother. Easy to say on social media.

elderly were given priority during Covid that’s why we were all locked up. Children didn’t go to school, teenagers didn’t sit exams because the priority was to keep the NHS going to support the elderly and at risk.

ultimately the nhs has either been under funded for 20 years, wasted finances, growing population but less GP surgeries, inefficiencies whatever. This was inevitable .

Elderly weren't given 'priority' , the most likely to be killed by Covid were, which were elderly and those with certain underlined conditions.

If course babies and children shouldn’t be prioritised on the basis of age. In reality the OP was perfectly capable of getting her child to A and E probably quicker than an ambulance to get to them and then back to the hospital so it seems correct that this wouldn’t be top of the list. I would far prefer an ambulance to be sent to an elderly person who cannot be moved than to a baby who has a parent with a car who can get them to A and E themselves.

I am genuinely gobsmacked that there was a 5 hour wait for a floppy unresponsive baby. That's just horrendous. Only time I needed an ambulance (10week baby, sucking chest, rattly breathing), it was with me within an hour, and we certainly weren't a high priority. I'm glad you managed to get her to hospital, and she's being looked after. Hoping she recovers swiftly.

I am now terrified what would happen if my 2 DC were to fall that ill. Our car broke down last week, so DH couldn't get them to the hospital, and I can't drive anyway. Guess we all need to start planning for the eventuality of what we'd need to do if the worst happens, and help isn't forthcoming any time soon. I think my best bet would be to sprint to the closest GP office if in the day time. At night, bang on neighbours doors and pray someone will take us in. I've had a child first aid app on my phone since DC1 was born, and it's never getting deleted.

There's nothing useful I can add about the state of the NHS , the care you received was appalling. Just wanted to send good wishes for your little one

Perhaps you missed my post where I said if I had to choose between my own 85 year old mother and my 11 year old daughter, absolutely no doubt who I'd choose. In fact if I had to choose between my own 85 year old mother and someone elses 11 year old, I'd like to think I'd still choose the 11 year old.

The nhs is looking very bleak, I feel for the staff so much , lastnight I took my 75yo gran in for a burst appendix she hasn’t been in a hospital in 36 years and she was traumatised by the experience she went in at 10pm and wasn’t even seen or admitted until 11.30am the next day left to sit in a packed waiting room on a hard chair in agony being sick everywhere couldn’t even get pain relief till a doctor seen her, she was joined by about 30 others through the night and there was 7 ambulances parked outside for about 10 hours full of patients one of which the priest came out to and she passed away in the ambulance shortly after! The nurse on the base sat with my gran and cried apologetically saying how hard it was to see her but not be able to help her sooner and kept saying the issue is the government and no funding for people upstairs bed hogging needing care homes or packages which makes a&e now more like a ward than an emergency base. It was very eye opening to experience and I truly hope we never need there services anytime soon

I can only assume you don’t like your mother as if not that is a seriously warped way of thinking. Most parents would prioritise their own child over anyone that’s hardly news, that’s why they should have no role in making decisions in situations and policies that require any sort of equity.

With regard the general state of the NHS and public services, as always, we get what we vote for, everyone know the Tories run public services into the ground. It astonishes me people are still happy to vote for them, I guess they just don't imagine they'll ever need an ambulance.

Sorry @dollymixtured but that's nuts. The OP didn't need the ambulance for a bloody lift. She needed the medical assistance to care for her child while en route to the hospital. An elderly person who can't be moved should not be higher priority. My own gran died last year. The ambulance was with us in an hour and a half or so but frankly if we'd waited longer because a BABY was the same priority level so jumped the queue I would not have disagreed with that prioritisation. And you know what, neither would my gran have!

I don't know when people will stop voting for these people. Do we have to wait until their own relatives are lying in the gutter before they stop excusing it?

There are far fewer people in Australia. The UK is full to bursting and we don’t have the infrastructure to cope with it.

Someone from a remote Scottish or Irish village will be along in a minute to argue that this isn’t the case, but they should try living in London to grasp the reality of what is happening here.

I appreciate that the OP is no doubt extremely distressed and therefore I will assume that she didn’t think through what she was saying. However it leaves something of a bad taste for someone to rant about the NHS being a ‘frightening failure’ for children when it will be NHS treatment at likely a cost of 10s if not 100s of thousands of pounds that is the sole reason this child even survived.

@Cuppasoupmonster Everyone has the equal value and importance and right to be treated humanely. Whether you’re a baby or a 90 year old. It is not about how much is potentially left in your lifespan. It is about now. What if that 90 year old is in extreme pain and suffering? Does being 90 years old mean that they do not need to have medical attention so that their pain and suffering can be alleviated?

This is real life, with real people not a philosophical argument.

All people deserve to be treated humanely. We shouldn’t be in a position to have to choose who deserves humane treatment and who doesn’t.

The problem that many people are saying they are having with the NHS is that there is a supply and demand problem. Not enough ambulances available, not enough bed spaces available for the amount of people needing them.

That problem isn’t solved by deciding who is more worthy of being prioritised.

Oh, and triage shouldn’t be based on philosophical arguments. It should be based on practical need.

I’m not the poster but this sounds like Australia, where I live.

The issue on MN is that, in Australia, there is an option for all medical care to be free, just like the NHS but there is a cost to prescriptions, albeit very low if you are a low earner or pensioner or have a chronic condition.

Whenever this is discussed, a MN poster inevitably says : “If I had to pay 3 pounds for a prescription I would have to do without food. I’ll stick with our wonderful NHS, thanks”.

This is awful, I'm so sorry.
Your daughter is in my thoughts - hoping for a v quick recovery.

Hope you and your DD are doing OK op, what an awful situation.

Yes the NHS is fucked - the government does not care though.