The gentle parenting philosophy makes me feel guiltily for having any feelings other than love

[michellet86]

Why is it not ok to show my anger? i mean appropriately and safely, not violent or aggressively. How is it ok to tell our kids their feelings are valid but then we have to suppress anything thats "negative"or only show it stoically?

I don't want to raise a kid who can't understand that he can't do whatever he wants without consequences. There ARE people in this world who will react with anger and he needs to know that.
I prefer the term "responsive parenting". My kids see when i'm getting angry. They also see how i process and handle it- if i need a few minutes to myself to help calm myself down or need to move my body to get some of that energy out, if i need to kind of check in with myself about why something is bothering me.
Sometimes i do loose my cool and yell and then they get to see how i handle that, they see that i feel bad for doing it and learn how to make amends with others when they mess up. These are all important lessons for them as they learn how to process and handle their own emotions in a healthy way. The reality is at some point parents will get angry with their kids. There might be a tiny percentage that doesn't- but that percentage probably has some combination of no outside stresses, lots of support (including the ability to have time to themselves) and that rare child that never pushes their buttons. Now if you're constantly angry and frustrated, yelling constantly somethings off and you might need to find a way to change those patterns but bei absolutely tired of your toddler whining all day for the 27th day in a row with no relief some annoyance is normal.

@waynesworldpartytimeexcellent ’Beam me fucking up’ 😂😂 roll on an opportunity to use that one 😁

I think roughly parenting is probably about right for me tbh 😅

Roughly like when you draw something for the first time, not right like the way Amazon handle my packages

Not roughly*

@GentlyBen your poor nephew. He's absolutely crying out for someone to love him enough to set some boundaries. He hits and hits his mother and she never tells him it's wrong? She doesn't feed him properly or ensure he has enough sleep? He must feel abjectly unloved.

Who will socialise the child if his parents won't?

I remember having a conversation with my daughter and asking how she would feel if I let her stay up as long as she wanted in the evening? How would she feel if I let her eat sweets and didn't ask her to eat vegetables? It was asked in a very light hearted way when she was about 5. "I would think you didn't love me" was her answer.

@Babiesarenotrobots · Today 20:35
I absolutely detest the phrase "gentle parenting". It implies that everyone else is roughly parenting!
I am also, yet to find someone who says they are gentle parenting who actually is. Every single one of them is indulgent parenting. Having no boundaries and never saying no - like some of the pp - is absolutely not authoritative parenting. Authoritative parenting btw, is the actual name for gentle parenting and far better explains what it should entail. I do believe in the principles - just not in 99% of peoples interpretation.

Let's take a scenario: leaving the park, child doesn't want to:

The indulgent parent - allows the child to stay (no boundaries, child does not feel safe and often leads to other 'bad' behaviours as the child tries to find the boundaries)

The authoritarian parent - shouts at the child that they're annoying and if they don't leave now, their iPad time will be taken from them. (Punishment rather than consequence and child feels misunderstood. The behaviour might stop that time but will happen again next time)

The authoritative parent - comments on how tough it is to leave somewhere fun, asks if the child wants to hold your hand or walk out alone AND if they still refuse, picks them up and removes them because it is time to go. (Child is given empathy and choices but the parent follows through with leaving. The child feels safe)

100% this. Everything you’ve said.

the Aha Parenting second book (from Lisa Markham) Calm parents, Happy siblings is excellent on how to mediate sibling disputes constructively.

Our kids rarely fight and we get lots of compliments on their behaviour. It’s all from her books.

i agree the ‘ controlled choices’ thing does let work for all kids (didn’t for ours).

but the heart of what she’s saying is in her explanations and scripts for toddler tantrums, and in her guidance on sibling arguments.

also how to build the positive side, use games for connection, etc.

some kids are very extrovert and need firm and clear boundaries as they don’t consider others at all. But they also need to be taught that they should, otherwise they take the message ‘if no one is shouting at me, it must be fine’

If another child bit, and really hurt your child, would you want the parent to 'respect and empathise' with the biter?

Also.. if you're explaining something for the hundredth time (more realistically, the 10th time) it's clearly not working.

Gentle parenting is really 'one's size fits all..'

It's the same with these Damn crunchy mums. Boak.

@Dystopiawarming a lot of what you said resonates and I am pro gentle parenting in principle. It has taken a long time but it is now paying off with my second DS and he's becoming a wonderful young man (DS1 is already an adult). But there is definitely an element of class privilege in many who follow it or claim to. These are the twatty and entitled ones who spoil the image of gentle parenting for everyone else. I see so many people (mostly mums) online who seem to have well paid partners and consequently don't work or run some sort of small and flexible home based business. They usually live on a small holding or similar with their single NT child and have all the time in the world for negotiating which organic cotton leggings to put on, deciding what (organic, sugar free, home made) food to have for breakfast and digging through mud to learn about bugs instead of going to nursery where someone might say no. There are those who have withdrawn their children from school because the teacher was abusive and humiliated them (by asking them to listen in class rather than "express their ideas") or they think that being expected to be able to read at least somewhat by the end of year 2 is ridiculous and prefer their kids to run around all day. They claim to be kind and open minded but are actually really judgy of people who don't share their privilege and can't afford home education or ethical choices (and yes I am probably judging them here too). Meanwhile in the real world some of us have to get to work. Everyone gets their supermarket school uniform on, has a bowl of frosties flung at them and gets in the bloody car now as it's already 8:20! If you get a detention for not doing your homework it's on you. I think my philosophy is basically gentle parenting with a big dose of realism thrown in. I've survived the last 24 years.

Would be really interesting to hear teacher views on children who are “gently parented” or “permissively/submissively parented”! I’ve always wondered what all the ineffectual chats I witness from friends/relatives was about and thought they were all just very chilled compared to me. The children of this softer parenting generally really suffer in the long term from what I have seen, but my style is very different (I think I’m in the firm but fair camp, but discussing the problem later when the crisis has been dealt with and everyone has calmed down) and I guess the judgement on whether it was right or wrong lies about 12 years away!

@DrCoconut

I can't tell you how much I love this paragraph. And the last bit especially:

Meanwhile in the real world some of us have to get to work. Everyone gets their supermarket school uniform on, has a bowl of frosties flung at them and gets in the bloody car now as it's already 8:20! If you get a detention for not doing your homework it's on you. I think my philosophy is basically gentle parenting with a big dose of realism thrown in. I've survived the last 24 years.

Perfect!

Honestly, a lot of people don’t understand gentle parenting on this thread.
It’s not about never saying no, that’s permissive parenting! It’s also not about following a script, that’s acting. It’s also not about being a stepford mum and hiding your own emotions.
Gentle parenting is about developing intrinsic motivation rather than extrinsic. So doing things because they are the right thing to do rather than being scared of being punished or doing it for a reward. It uses natural consequences which often can look like punishments. For example a teenager doesn’t follow the guidelines put in place to use their phone, so they don’t get to freely use it until they can be trusted to again. Or a toddler throws their food all over the floor, so instead of getting to go and play with the toys you ask them to help clean it up and discuss why they did it in the first place. Gentle patenting helps children to recognise their emotions so they can learn how to regulate them. It enforces that everyone feels angry at times, but you can’t deal with your anger by hitting someone or breaking something, you use a different tool to diffuse the anger. You give the child permission to feel the emotion and the tools to deal with it. I’m sure we all know adults who fly off the handle, or have ourselves said or done something in the heat of the moment that we’ve regretted later. Gentle parenting is about raising children who can deal with the emotions in a healthy way in the hopes they avoid those feelings of regret in the future.

What a strange analogy, of course I would want the parent to respect and empathise with the biter. What do you think respect and empathy are? They are the method of responding to the situation, not the consequence of the action. It's possible to discipline your child while respecting and empathising with them!

All the teachers I know think it's basically a good premise (and aim to be actual authoritative parents themselves if they have kids) but think that the way it's executed in reality has a lot to answer for in the problems they have at school regarding 1. Lack of authority. Because if they tell a student off and the parent disagrees, it totally undermines the teacher (this is especially prevalent in secondary schools).

1. School readiness. Massive issue in fancy schools with kids not being school ready. Some of this is missed neurodivergence, but a lot of the times it's just permissive, essentially neglectful parenting. One friend I know was in tears knowing that a child who was being neglected was going to be taken out and homeschooled, they have also experienced a lot of 'school hopping' where parents keep sending their kid to multiple different schools because they disagree with the school when they try to impose any sort of boundaries, or flag them to safeguarding.
2. Problems with lateness and attendance. This means kids get behind, get anxious, are always playing catch up.

The nurses I know are less forgiving (including a health visitor) They think it's a right mess and makes their jobs much harder. My GP also commented on a recent visit that it's really rare to see a parent who can get their child to cooperate for tests to be done, and that that didn't used to be a thing. Of course, on another day my child might have been playing silly buggars too, but it was still interesting the doctor felt it was noteworthy.

I wonder how much effect this kind of child centric approach has had on things like good citizenship, obesity, child dental extractions, respect for elders, just so many different areas of life. I think it creates an over inflated ego in the child, which makes them more sensitive and narcissistic, and it can be hard for them to get right sized in their thinking and accept their true place in the world and be humble and empathetic (usually while calling themselves empaths though!) Its very self deterministic and selfish

I agree with this approach though I’m not sure many people who claim to be ‘gentle parents’ are doing much more than actually being passive, negligent parents. Which is where the problem lies.

Having worked at a school I can tell you those children who struggle to follow instructions are at an immediate disadvantage. Those children who haven’t heard the word no are also much more fragile than those who can cope with disappointment. It all goes hand in hand with building resilience but that doesn’t give parents an excuse to become bullies. All of these things have a middle ground and it’s there where good parenting lies.

Having read some of these comments, it seems I did gentle parenting all wrong! My children are older now, but they were frequently told no. I was gentle, not perfect, and certainly raised my voice, snapped, and said unhelpful things over the years. What I also did though was owned the times that I did those things, and apologised for them in the same way I’d have expected an apology if they behaved in the same way.

What really boils my piss though is the whole “raising a generation of snowflakes” thing. I’m not perfect and neither are my children, but they’re pretty decent human beings most of the time and have never been in any trouble of note. In fact, I’d say they’re people I admire. I’m sure there were lots of factors at play in that, but I’m sure my snowflake parenting at least contributed 😆

Gentle parenting isn't permissive parenting.

Child: I want a cookie!

A permissive parent may give them the cookie to avoid a meltdown.

An old school parent may tell them no and put them in time out for having a tantrum about it.

A gentle parent may say something like
I know you want a cookie but they're not available right now. You can choose a banana or an orange/ you can have a cookie with your dinner at 5 o'clock (or whatever)
If they tantrum. They'd let them get their emotions out but still hold that boundary of no cookie

What you have just described is pretty much just normal parenting (if you remove the word Spagetti and the use of ‘gentle parenting’ to make it sound superior).

That all just sounds like normal parenting where children learn about the consequences for their actions. Most of my friends and I ‘parent’ in this way. We talk to our children and explain things, we talk about emotions, we use positive praise when we want to see good behaviour repeated and explain what we want them to do rather than not want them to do. (E.g. stay on the path, as opposed to ‘don’t run in the road). They all have boundaries and if they go beyond these, then there are consequences (like removal of a phone). Cal, that a consequence or a punishment - it amounts to the same thing.

Yes, we all get stressed with parenting and can shout at times, but children will go through life seeing a range of emotions from themselves and others and it’s about how we handle it. I have shouted at my son and then explained why and will apologise. You have to try your best to model the behaviour you want to see, but as a single parent, when I need him to get dressed, eat his breakfast and get out of the door on time for work and school (and he is kicking off about itchy socks or not liking the breakfast he has eaten for the last 12 months) you sometimes just have to resort to ‘I’m going to count to 3 and if you haven’t put your socks on, you will go to school without any’

Parenting is tricky, demanding and rewarding at the best of times, but all this labelling of ‘styles’ really doesn’t help. Some of it can come across as very superior. The only labels I attach to myself, is the good, bad and ugly and as a parent I am all of those at different times.

So all the 'that's bit gentle parenting' comments are leading me to think that gentle parenting is just...parenting. What the vast majority of us are doing anyway.

Probably, although I work with families and definitely see a lot of “naughty step” and punishment-based approaches. Smacking is illegal where I live, but I also know of a lot of people who vehemently object to not being allowed to hit their children

YES
I agree about the term gentle parenting but I believe I do follow that approach and would choose option 3.
I have in fact lived that exact scenario!

The example of ‘gentle parenting’ sounds very much like just normal parenting to me (without the superior label).

Say no, empathise and explain why you have said no (maybe offer an alternative) and then don’t back down regardless of the tantrum.

Oh I agree, I think it is just normal parenting and labels are for jam jars not people or parenting styles. I can empathise with the getting them out the door with no choices, my partner works offshore and I have a demanding job, and I’m doing a degree. I often resort to the ‘you have 10 seconds to do X or we’ll be late / mammy will have to do it / you’ll have to go to school in your pjs’ 😅I research when I’m anxious about something, and parenting to raise a good, happy person makes me anxious, so I read lots when I was pregnant. I just don’t like when people criticise something they don’t fully understand, because I think some of the child psychologists who advocate gentle parenting make some good points that parents would find helpful and I don’t like the thought of people being put off by something that could help them and their kids.

100% this. When my eldest was little I was in a gentle parenting group online and I had to leave as it was full of this crap. People who clearly have nothing better to do with their days than hanging around waiting for their children to do whatever they want rather than need to get to work, or school, or do activities they've committed to. I was fascinated by a post by a woman who was upset at getting in hot water with her DC's nursery for repeatedly dropping them off halfway through the session, because she believed they should be able to wake up and get ready at their own pace. I can't imagine how school is panning out if she has in fact sent her DCs 🤣

My whole thing with ANY prescribed way of parenting is at what point do you stop? At what point do you introduce your kids to the real you?
Alot of styles are nice to think about but if it's not natural don't force it or your kids will never know you. I fully prescribe to the try your best method 😅 DS is nearly 7 still alive, from what I can tell happy and has lots of very happy loving and healthy relationships

But this is surely permissive parenting rather than gentle parenting? I think too many people get the two mixed up. Gentle parenting does include boundaries and discipline.

Yes, this! It's so frustrating!