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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

School residential, school have said they have to go

456 replies

Y4GoingAway · 04/01/2023 12:39

School Year 4, but it’s a first school so the final year at the school.

Apparently it’s compulsory and there is no provision in school for those who don’t go as the class teachers plus several other staff go.

I don’t want DD to go. She has a genetic condition that affects her muscles and joints. She also has an EHCP due to SN (not ASD)

The trip is canoeing and rock climbing and zip lining and orienteering. Which all sound great but schools only adjustment for DDs condition is she can sit out if she wants to, which she won’t because she never does for Forest School or PE or anything else physical, school say they cannot force DD to sit out. They have PE, Forest School and the morning mile in one day at school and DDs generally screaming in pain by 2pm, I’ve asked for her to sit out of Forest School and the mile but been told that it’s up to DD to decide and she wants to be like her friends so will push herself until she can’t cope anymore – she’s missed school the next day because of the pain and school just shrug and say she needs to tell them when she wants to sit out, while in the next breath saying she seems to refuse to acknowledge her condition as she won’t talk about it!

This isn’t about DD being away overnight, she stays away from me with ExH EOWend for 1 night and he usually takes her away for 3-4 days in the summer holidays plus she’s just done a 3 day pack holiday with Brownies. Also it’s not a cost thing, the trip itself is free, we’re being asked to donate to transport there and back either by paying school for the bus or getting our DC there ourselves.
Brownies where brilliant, they let her choose one active activity per day and then put her in the group that wasn’t doing that activity after she’d done it, so she did crafts or similar, all the girls where given the same opportunity to sit out so no-one knew why DD only did 1 per day – and we’ve agreed that next time she goes she’ll do different activities so she’s tried different things which is a great compromise. Brownies also kept her topped up on her pain medication which school refuse to give her.

They’ve told me they have no provision for giving pain relief on the trip which is the same in school. They’ve also said if children sit out of an activity they will just have to watch everyone else do it, there’s no staffing for them to have a group at the centre they’re staying in doing something else – I even said DD would be happy to do worksheets or similar.

And before anyone says “But there’s more going with school” there’s the same number at Brownies and Brownies had a bigger age range as school only take the 90 year 4s, whereas Brownies had 60 Brownies (7-10 year olds), 30 guides (10-14 year olds), and a couple of Rainbows (7 year olds) who’re ready to move to Brownies soon.

School have said if she doesn’t go they will not be providing alternative work, she will be the only one in her entire year not going and she will be supervised by “whichever member off staff is free”. She does have 1-1 TA for parts of the day and one of her two 1-1s won’t be going and I’ve offered to get her tutor she has outside of school to provide work (tutor has already offered) and I’ve been told again the trip is compulsory. Apparently they've never had anyone not go ever.

So AIBU and just have to suck it up? The trip is after half term.

OP posts:
70sShmeventies · 04/01/2023 14:54

That’s absolutely appalling. The school
sounds almost cruelly nonchalant?! I’d keep her home, they can’t actually force her to go. Either write an email clearly explaining why you believe they have failed in their provision for her or say she is ill.

ChristmasTensions · 04/01/2023 14:55

YANBU. They CANNOT force her to go. Legally they cannot do that. Write to the governors and the head and state clearly she will not be going.

Y4GoingAway · 04/01/2023 14:55

ApiratesaysYarrr · 04/01/2023 14:53

Do you have any official medical documentation that exertion worsens DD's symptoms/condition? If so, I would be suggesting that it was potentially a safeguarding issue to take a child with a condition exacerbated by activity on a trip full of activity, while not permitting pain medication to be given. While I suppose it could be argued that they will not give pain meds in school hours, if she has analgesia before and after school, how will this be managed while she is away. You would be on strong grounds if she is on prescribed analgesia.

However, I am also conscious of the fact that for many conditions that affect joints and muscles, a degree of activity is good for them as it helps to keep joints from stiffening up. Does your daughter have a paediatric physio that could make suggestions about activities?

@ApiratesaysYarrr It does help, some of the activities offered will actually be good. She has physio, everyday done before school then regular appointments. I can speak to physio actually that'll help, she's always been very good with liasing with school in the past.

OP posts:
Moveoverdarlin · 04/01/2023 14:58

It’s not compulsory per say, but it’s not an option to keep her in school whilst the rest go on the trip. You can’t expect one teacher to solely teach your DD for a week. If you don’t want her to go that’s fair enough, but you’ll have to take the week off or ask for help.

Catswhisky · 04/01/2023 14:59

The school are completely ignoring their duty to your daughter. I’m very pleased she moves at the end of this summer.
She wants to go, keeping her at home shouldn’t be the only option. Please take the good advice from pp and fight this all the way so she can go.
I’m really surprised the school won’t give medication, what if a child is on heart meds or diabetes meds? Can they not go on the trip either?
DS was at school with a boy with quadruple amputation after meningitis. That boy went on their outward bound trip and adaptations were available or made for him to join in the majority of activities. The centre will be used to making disability adjustments. Talking to them may help.

BungleandGeorge · 04/01/2023 15:00

Can you get the painkiller prescribed regularly? From a school perspective because she’s only 8 they may not feel confident to make the judgement of whether she needs painkillers or not. Or you need to give them written instructions signed by the GP of when to give them?

Zonder · 04/01/2023 15:03

I would ask for an emergency ehcp review and for her county caseworker to be there. There needs to be a risk assessment done and documentation on how they are going to meet her needs / keep her safe. I would also contact the caseworker anyway and ask for advice.

The school have to make reasonable adjustment and they're clearly not. Ask for the risk assessment.

Twiglets1 · 04/01/2023 15:04

I would be surprised if this is actually compulsory but if it is, I would think a tactical "sickie" is on the cards.

ClaudiaWankleman · 04/01/2023 15:05

Moveoverdarlin · 04/01/2023 14:58

It’s not compulsory per say, but it’s not an option to keep her in school whilst the rest go on the trip. You can’t expect one teacher to solely teach your DD for a week. If you don’t want her to go that’s fair enough, but you’ll have to take the week off or ask for help.

Actually if your child is unable to attend a school trip you can still expect them to receive an education - it's the school's duty to.

SliceOfCakeCupOfTea · 04/01/2023 15:06

diddl · 04/01/2023 13:27

They have PE, Forest School and the morning mile in one day at school

Whatever type of school is she at?

Presumably this won't continue when she moves school?

DSs school has all these too. It's not unusual

Sherbetdib · 04/01/2023 15:07

Some communication needed between yourself and school. Your child is not old enough to make these decisions. If you, as her parent decide you do not want her to do an activity due to disability related factors then they should not simply say 'it is up to her'. They have a responsibility of care towards her and need to show they are able to exercise it.
Go and speak to the Teachers and the Head. Your daughter may well try to keep up etc and join in, but they should not put her in a position where she feels the odd one out. The whole exercise sounds as though they have not factored in equality related issues.

Catswhisky · 04/01/2023 15:09

Zonder · 04/01/2023 15:03

I would ask for an emergency ehcp review and for her county caseworker to be there. There needs to be a risk assessment done and documentation on how they are going to meet her needs / keep her safe. I would also contact the caseworker anyway and ask for advice.

The school have to make reasonable adjustment and they're clearly not. Ask for the risk assessment.

Just quoting this to check you see it OP

Scottishskifun · 04/01/2023 15:11

Get the physio to speak to school but also to your DD if she wont listen to you about not overdoing it and also ask the physio what activities they think would be best. Get your DD to pick 2 and stick to 2 rock climbing can be sat out as she can support from the bottom or do a supported belay. Speak to the centre as well.

Spendonsend · 04/01/2023 15:12

I know a lot of people have said this, but the law is really clear, when a school organises a trip they have to consider the disabilities of their cohort at the planning stage and plan accordingly. They cant just plan a trip thats inaccesible.

Backtoreality1 · 04/01/2023 15:16

Have you been in touch with the centre they are going to, to question what provisions would be in place for her condition? If the school have not made them aware that there are children with health issues then the insurance would not cover them and this would be a major issue. Would be worth dropping them a line.

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 04/01/2023 15:25

2bazookas · 04/01/2023 14:25

You need to accept that if DD doesn't go, the class teachers wont be in school and that's why no special provision will be made for her at school. She'll probably join in some junior class.

Biut that's what you want , right? DD not to be overwhelmed or over stretched.

It beats me why you're comparing school with arrangements at Brownies or expecting any equivalence.

The OP is ‘expecting equivalence’ because by law the school is obliged to make ‘reasonable adjustment’ for her condition under the disability equality act. And they’re not. Plain and simple. They are trying to sidestep their obligation to the point where they are expecting a young child to take full responsibility for a condition she isn’t yet able to fully understand. They leave her to make her own decisions about how much she does and then refuse to engage with the pain medication she needs when she inevitably misjudges and ends up in pain. Disabled people are the last consideration in situations like this, and you seem eager to support that. Why ?

Zonder · 04/01/2023 15:25

Catswhisky · 04/01/2023 15:09

Just quoting this to check you see it OP

Thank you.

Runaway1 · 04/01/2023 15:28

Contacting the activity centre and getting the physio’s input sound great ideas for coming up with a plan for reasonable adjustment for her. I would then ask for a meeting with the Head and Senco to agree what will be put in place. You sound like a brilliant Mum for being so supportive of your dd and helping ensure she doesn’t miss out. I really hope they sort it out for her!

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 04/01/2023 15:32

Backtoreality1 · 04/01/2023 15:16

Have you been in touch with the centre they are going to, to question what provisions would be in place for her condition? If the school have not made them aware that there are children with health issues then the insurance would not cover them and this would be a major issue. Would be worth dropping them a line.

This is a good point. But would the centre not also be in breach of the equality act by not providing for children with health conditions ?

Backtoreality1 · 04/01/2023 15:34

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 04/01/2023 15:32

This is a good point. But would the centre not also be in breach of the equality act by not providing for children with health conditions ?

But they can't provide it if they don't know, and insurance would only apply if they are aware.

Elastigurl · 04/01/2023 15:34

Pumperthepumper · 04/01/2023 14:14

It’s because education services have been cut to the absolute bone, to the detriment of SEN kids more than any other.

A lot of it can be put down to funding but unfortunately not all of it, some of it is still down to shitty, discriminatory attitudes. Blaming it all on lack of funding is a huge cop out IMO, and this is me speaking as a former teacher.

HomeAGnome · 04/01/2023 15:35

@Y4GoingAway is making the point that it is do-able @2bazookars

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 04/01/2023 15:37

fajitaaaa · 04/01/2023 14:34

Ask to see their equal opportunities/disability policy.

If this was a work place they'd be expected to make reasonable adjustments.

Schools have the same obligation to make reasonable adjustments under the equality act.

fajitaaaa · 04/01/2023 15:39

Lovelysausagedogscrumpy · 04/01/2023 15:37

Schools have the same obligation to make reasonable adjustments under the equality act.

Excellent. Then pull them up on it OP.

Pumperthepumper · 04/01/2023 15:44

Elastigurl · 04/01/2023 15:34

A lot of it can be put down to funding but unfortunately not all of it, some of it is still down to shitty, discriminatory attitudes. Blaming it all on lack of funding is a huge cop out IMO, and this is me speaking as a former teacher.

So you think they just hate disabled people and want to make their lives a bit more shit?

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