To be upset about the treatment of disabled people after this?

[Livingtothefull]

DH, DS & I headed off this afternoon for a planned evening out. DS is in a wheelchair. We got to the bus stop closest to us and waited for a bus. And waited and waited.

It was very cold & DS was complaining of being cold. DS can get cold more easily than us as he is not walking or moving around. Eventually left the bus stop and walked into town where there were likely to be more buses. Waited some more and eventually a bus actually came, nearly an hour by now after we had started waiting for the next bus although they should normally come every 10 mins or so.

I waited to get on the bus at the front while the driver tried to get the wheelchair ramp down. Overheard a few complaints from some other passengers 'why can't they let us on first before the ramp?'. Eventually though the driver said that the ramp wasn't working so he couldn't let us on.

I told the driver we could manage without the ramp but he refused as he said he couldn't be responsible for that. I just lost it then said we needed to get my DS on, he was cold and we couldn't wait longer for a bus. The driver said no though tried to call to find out when the next bus was coming & couldn't get any information. Some passengers gave up and left the bus to walk while this was going on, a few of them with dirty looks in our direction.

The driver said that he couldn't locate the next bus although one should arrive 'soon'. I did apologise to the driver for losing my temper, appreciated it was not his fault and he had tried to help us. We gave up then.

Finally.....a bus arrived that we could get on, although there was an empty buggy in the wheelchair space that we needed to fit around. No small children nearby so probably the buggy owner had taken the child upstairs in the double decker and left the buggy to be in the way of wheelchair users. Happens a lot.

I know this sounds like a long rant so let me know if IABU. But I just want us to have nice days and evenings out like everyone else without hassles, frustrations and upsets.

So, AIBU to complain about:

A public transport infrastructure that is unreliable despite many vulnerable people needing to rely on it. If a bus's doors were not working and people couldn't access, it would be called out of service. So why is it acceptable to have a bus in service when the ramp doesn't work?

The attitudes and behaviours of a significant minority of people. Why is it acceptable to openly complain when prioritising the disabled mildly affects them? Why is it acceptable to dump buggies (or trollies etc) in the wheelchair space?

The Association of British Commuters has been campaigning about accessibility issues on trains. They have run a few bus campaigns too so it might be worth talking to them.
abcommuters.com/

It’s atrocious but people get really angry when called on it, particularly mums with buggies who in my experience often see themselves as akin to being disabled. I travelled on buses twice daily for work for 15 years and saw so many arguments from mums about moving -usually empty - buggies out of the wheelchair space. It drives me mad.

The suggestion that you should start your own bus company rather than, y’know, the existing bus company comply with the law and entitled people get out of spaces that aren’t for them… 🤯

Mmmm I'm heavily pregnant with a two year old so usually have a buggy but would always move for a wheelchair. It's pretty awful to not do so or to argue. Even if it's a PITA - it's not the fault of the person using a wheelchair!

Please make a complaint to the bus company regarding the ramp.
I work for one and our safety team would have been furious at this. All buses have to be in full working order before setting off for the day.
The accessibility team would be made aware too and ensure full training is reiterated to drivers in regards to the ramps.

with the pushchair in the wheelchair space I would have moved it.
I regularly prompt people to move if I see a wheelchair is getting on. To those that grumble, can you imagine having to wait for multiple buses because someone doesn’t want to fold their pushchair?

Thankfully I rarely have to use public transport with ds but I still love the bus driver who refused to move until a mum moved the pram out of the wheelchair space so Ds wheelchair could go in there.

Thanks so much for this. It makes such a positive change from the reports re other bus companies that seem to think it is OK to run faulty buses which disabled people can't access, as long as everyone else can get on. BTW that is not aimed at the people who have posted here, just at the bus companies who are responsible for this. Or the local authorities/Government who supply inadequate funds to ensure an acceptable service.

I just don't think it is acceptable to run a substandard service and assume it is OK because only the disabled are inconvenienced. It really is not too much to ask that my DS has the same provision as anyone else

Someone upthread has suggested I shouldn't complain because the driver will be held responsible for this. I was very clear that the driver was not to blame and will make this clear in my complaint. I can't not complain though - how else will things change?

@Livingtothefull if you don’t make a complaint, management won’t be aware of the issues and then there won’t be any change.
Your son was the victim this time. Next time it may be someone in a wheelchair who likes to travel alone/ is independent but can’t because the bus ramp is broken, then the next one and then the next one.

if you don’t make a complaint, management won’t be aware of the issues and then there won’t be any change.

True story:

I found myself watching the newly installed revolving doors at Good Hope Hospital 10 years ago. No provision for wheelchair uses, naturally. A poor old chap - in his 80s - was trying to wheel his wife through and was clearly terrified. I jammed the door to allow him through, and then complained to the person manning the reception who told me it was an award winning design and I was an idiot. The proof being "they'd never had any complaints". Which was true, since when the local MP investigated, they were told the same thing. Despite my recording of myself making a complaint

Remember we celebrate "I see no ships"

Just for reference there are rooms and corridors in the new QEII hospital that can't accommodate a wheelchair.

Are disabled folk a nuisance eh?

If most places can't get a fucking website to be accessible, what effort do you think goes into ramps and accesses ?

I had to take DH, a wheelchair user, for an appt at our local hospital last week. We had to get through 7 sets of double doors, not one of which had a button to open and all of which I had to pull, hold open with my foot whilst pushing dh through. In a hospital.

Our major hospital has 10 disabled spaces within 500m of the building. 10. And only 5 of those can be used if the wheelchair user is in the passenger seat.

@Spaghetti201 youre the problem

it’s not only people with current disability - it’s everyone - we could
all potentially become disabled. And it’s how we would all want to be treated in that case.

Lots of taxi companies have wheelchair friendly vehicles. Obviously it would be expensive daily but we use the mobility element of PIP for exactly this purpose for a special event.

Yes buses should have working ramps, yes people should be patient and tolerant but sadly ime it isn't often the case so we use other transport to ensure it is stress free.

I experienced something quite similar to you OP. We had just come back from holiday and were waiting for the airport transport bus to pick us up and take us back to our car. We were heading to the bus stop as a bus pulled in, and indicated to the driver that we intended to board, but he took one look directly at me in the wheelchair, hastily shut the doors, and drove away! We waited for the next bus, but the driver got off and told us that the ramp wasn't working, and all of this at gone midnight on a cold and frosty evening. My disability is very badly affected by getting cold, and I was in a lot of pain, but we had no choice other than to wait for yet another bus. All in all, we waited about 45 minutes, before we were finally able to access a bus and get warm again. The following day, I was so cross, about the driver who deliberately drove away, rather than have to put in the effort to get out the ramp and let me board, that I wrote to the company, detailing everything that had happened. I didn't really even expect an acknowledgement, but to my surprise, not only were they extremely apologetic, but also offered me completely free parking for my next trip away. Although this was very decent of them, nothing could really make up for being made to feel like a second class citizen, on that cold and miserable night.

We had just come back from holiday and were waiting for the airport transport bus to pick us up and take us back to our car.

I take it no one read the story about the poor little boy with no legs (amputated due to abuse) that had to wait over 4 hours at Gatwick Airport for their wheelchair back ?

I have jammed the doorway so the bus can't move, until the ramp is deployed.

I was recently refused boarding on the bus again but because I now know the law I jammed the door open and told him that I won't move until he let me on. I quoted the law below and he gave up and made the wheelchair space available for me.

"S24 of the Public Passenger Vehicle Act 1981 states

Bus drivers refusing to allow wheelchair users onto buses where the wheelchair space is either unoccupied or occupied by people who can readily and reasonably move are committing a crime. They can be prosecuted, given a £500 fine and 3 penalty points."

Yanbu op, public services and infastructure are shot to shit in this country and it's hitting disabled and vulnerable people worse. I'm so sorry x

I have once been on the bus when there was a driver change. The driver taking over tested the ramp, blue buttons etc before driving off. I took the bus number, driver's name and the time, then contacted the bus company and commended him for his considerate actions.

The bus driver is supposed to check the ramp and blue bells before leaving the depot. A broken ramp is also an out of service condition.