To think our economy infantilises young people

[HurryupwiththeteA]

I’ve got a DS who’s 18 and I’ve been thinking a lot about this. I love history and learning about different time periods and when I think what some of the 18-25 year olds used to have vs now it’s stunning. Henry VIII became king when he was 18. Slightly more realistically, up until not so many years ago young people were able to move out, get jobs that actually pay money you can live on, get married, have children, etc. I know some can especially closer to 25 but for many that’s simply not a reality.

Today minimum wage jobs (which are absolutely necessary and often quite skilled) are simply not enough to live on meaning that for many they feel their only option is university.

The student loan system requires you to be dependent on your parents (especially if they earn more) as the maintenance grant simply will not cover living expenses and (back to my last point) they’re only option is minimum wage will does not pay.

After graduating in most areas home ownership is not realistic given the exorbitant cost. This leaves them with the option of living at home for many years to try and save up (or rent and most likely never be able to afford a house deposit).

Because they don’t have their own place, relationships are often either causal hookups or quite short lived. This means that marriage or children if usually out of the question until they are much older.

Many other things such as being treated like they’re not really adults by older people, being marketed crap they don’t need keeping them in the rat race, calls to raise the age to smoke, so many other things.

Sadly I think the answers to these problems just aren’t going to happen. Major house building, distressing the importance of degrees for jobs that simply don’t need them, making the minimum wage enough to actually live on, controls on rent, stopping interest on student loans and raising the repayment threshold. None of these will ever happen, for political reasons, but frankly they should.

Aibu to think that young adults (18-25) are pretty infantilised today. It seems like 25 is the new 18 and until your mid 20s now society often still sees you as a child. Furthermore, Aibu to think this

YANBU. I worked in the higher education sector until recently and the babying of students is insane. I'm talking of 18,19, 20 year olds, ADULTS, who need sooo much hand holding and support. Equivalent to what my generation (elder millenials) would have outgrown at the age of 13/14. Parental involvement in their decisions seems to go on until people are well into their 20's and it has created a generation of overgrown babies who will have a big shock when they enter the real world!

YANBU, I was watching a really good documentary about Margaret Beaufort, who was the mother of Henry VII, she was 12/13 when she gave birth to the first Tudor king and was from all accounts very sharp, she managed to negotiate her own marriage contracts, politically shmooze to ensure the safety of her son, all before she was 15!

I know it’s not a good thing for teens to have children, but there has been a shift in terms of infantilising children to where they now ‘can’t’ do much, whereas even just a few hundred years ago 12/13 year olds would be running households, raising children, and in some circles playing political chess with grown adults and having to be strategic with their choices etc. boys would govern whole countries before many teens these days are allowed a phone!

Mums on here seem to infantilise their children too - and themselves.

A thread on here wants Minecraft banned because she CBA to set limits in her home.

Yes, I agree. And I’m not talking about parenting whinges- economically, you are correct.

Look at the age-based minimum wages & apprenticeships for example. I moved out when I was 18. My rent still cost the same, my electricity cost the same but I could legally not be paid the same as a ‘real’ adult. I had DD when I was 20- I was living independently with my child and her father, and neither of us could earn an adults wage! It was infuriating then and it still is now. It was no cheaper to be a mother than it would have been if I were 30!

A lot of people have a lot of vested interest in keeping people infantilised as long as possible.

Companies paying them less, bloating higher education systems selling them expensive courses and plenty else I'm sure.

I will add there is a reason the NMW is lower for young people, it’s to encourage employers to hire them. Long term it’s beneficial

Isn’t it in part due to extended life expectancy, though?

Becoming an adult is a process not a finished result, and I think acknowledging that process is a positive.

I was paid £3.60 an hour on my apprenticeship.
I did 3 of them. Because no one gives a shit about the qualification, they’re choosing to hire cheap labour. As soon as I finished my apprenticeship they’d boot me out and get another apprentice.
There need to be other incentives than exploitation.

Well then it’s on those doing the apprenticeship to research whether the qualification is worth it.

I agree many businesses are going down the apprentice route for cheap labour, but anyone with a few brain cells can see through it.

Of course I could see through it, I knew I was being treated unfairly, but couldn’t get hired for anything else! I had rent to pay, £3.60 was better than nothing. How ridiculous to blame the people being exploited rather than the societal structures that enable it.

We now know that the brain finishes maturation around 25 years old.

Maybe this is developmentally more appropriate given human lifespans in WEIRD countries like ours.

Also- life spans may have extended, fertile years haven’t.

Indeed, but are you suggesting that women have and complete their families before the age of 25?

And actually amongst women who haven’t accessed higher education there is more of a trend to have their first baby younger. I don’t see that as a bad thing: women should always do what suits them, but it does show that women with degrees tend to choose to postpone their families. Having your first baby at 32 rather than 22 is really not a societal or personal disaster.

I think that parents engage in it to be honest. Generally when it suits them (as has always been the way).

After graduating in most areas home ownership is not realistic given the exorbitant cost. This leaves them with the option of living at home for many years to try and save up (or rent and most likely never be able to afford a house deposit).
Because they don’t have their own place, relationships are often either causal hookups or quite short lived. This means that marriage or children if usually out of the question until they are much older.

I disagree with most of this.

In my generation (graduated in the 80s) I think it was pretty common for young people to house/flat-share. I really get the feeling that these days people seem to 'want their own space' and not be so willing to flat share including bathroom / kitchen share with others.

And I really don't see why not having your own place means you can't develop relationships. OK not have children, but no reason for making relationships short lived.

Well then you are the definition of why a lower NMW is needed for young people.

if an employer had to pay a 16 year old with no experience the same as a 21 year old with lots of experience, who would get the job? Who would struggle with no chances to gain experience?

employment is set up for young people to take the low paid jobs and work up, unfortunately not everyone is doing that and there are many older adults languishing on minimum wage

It’s so tiring to see this trotted out.

Some peoples brains don’t fully develop until 25, some don’t fully develop until 40, some have developed at 18. It’s simply false to say the brain doesn’t fully mature until 25. Studies in Australia have seen the full development delayed until 40 and that’s only because that was their oldest cohort, there is no evidence there aren’t people who don’t fully develop neurologically until after 40.

The final elements to develop are also minor and make no difference in day to day life either

Most of the young people I know who didn’t go to Uni are already on the housing ladder by 25 They aren’t on minimum wage either as they have been at college and working doing an apprenticeship and have a trade under their belt.
They are already married with children by 25

I think throughout history young people have lived at home with their parents. I think the idea that you can get your own house, car etc at say 20 is a very modern expectation.

Gosh I had no idea it could be into the 40s. I would love to read a few studies if you could link me to them. Thanks.

You know what I’d actually support?
Other forms of incentivising that don’t involve exploitation. As said above.

Such as, tax breaks or percentage grants for companies employing young people. It’s the same financial benefit to the company as the cheap labour would be, the employee can afford to survive, and they would have quicker progression due to being treated as the legal adult they are in work, while also paying more tax.

Well it's a lot harder now to find affordable housing and then lets factor in cost of living etc. Back in the 80's, early 90's, it was do-able to move into your own flat at 19 and the cost of everything was cheaper then it is now. It was much easier to make your own way then it is now.

Isn't the maturation age of 25 an average down to when life becomes repetitive.wake up go work come home sleep repeat. It's the monotony that stops the plasticity of the brain. Excuse the simple terminology that's probably not correct.Not being able to earn the same adult wage if you're a young mum is the governments way to persuade you to not become a young mum. (I was a young mum)

Agree with @Notcontent . Agree that young people now (in general) don’t have as many responsibilities as in the past. Perhaps prolonged full time education has a role to play in this? BUT in order to do some jobs we just need to know more than before (as total knowledge has increased). Perhaps we need to change the way we learn so more things are a prolonged apprenticeship where you go through lots of levels and earn a decent wage while this happens?

I feel the same. Someone could have been kicked out at 16, have 2 kids by 20 and have more years work experience and still gets paid less than a 25 year old who has less than 2 years work experience and lives at home with their parents. It doesn't help that benefits are also lower for younger people too.