Nativity disappointment why do teachers do it

[Bucketheadbucketbum]

Want to key stage 2 nativity today. It was 1 hour long! Approx 40 kids in it. Some children had multiple lines throughout the hour, on the stage for the bulk of the time, solo songs the works. Others had just one line and spent the rest of the time sitting to the side apart from group songs where they all stood up. I understand all parts cant be equal and it must be a nightmare to try and be fair but this was shockingly poorly distrubuted. Why would you do this as a teacher? So disappointing for the children and parents unless you happen to be one of the "stars" of the show.

Everyone is good at something. Nobody is good at everything. That’s my mantra 😉

Your DS sounds like the kid everyone loves 🥰

I wouldn’t say everyone loves him 😂 he’s witty and charming and gentle and kind but he’s ‘such a character!’ Which is teacher code for ‘pain in the arse ‘.
he’s going places though, you can just tell 😀

What would you suggest they do while others are on stage?where would they go if not at the side of the stage?
I'm not sure what the school could do!

Pumperthepumper, I said no such thing! For a teacher your comprehension skills don't appear to be very good. Why would I be repelled by 'quiet' children, I literally posted about my shy daughter at 4 being given a main part as an Angel and crying throughout all of it! In year 6 Juniors she was given a main part and loved it, proving that children can change and shouldn't be pigeon holed at a young age. The weary cynicism from some teachers on this thread is depressing, particularly as we are discussing young children. The cynicism is enslaving after a while and stops attempts to help the children to step out their comfort zone as they are written off as quiet and correspondingly unreliable.

How bizarre to think a nativity is the only time for a child to step out of their comfort zone. Still, at least you’ve changed your tune from ‘teachers should do it to make the parents happy’.

This thread has reminded me of how batshit parents are. Insisting that their shy child gets a part, when said child doesn't even want a part. Beggars belief.

My 5 year old is an innkeeper. 😁 Last year she was an angel. Not sure that is very true though. 🤣

MostTacticalNameChange · Yesterday 22:41

I'm still bitter from my primary school experiences - i was always picked to be an (out of site) narrator - i could be relied upon to learn lines but was too fat, tall and un-blond to be onstage

This is crazy

I question that, based on all the threads by parents asking strangers what to get their own kids for Xmas 😂🙄

Don't worry OP. I had a reticent one. Always shrunk into the background or was elbowed aside. She now lectures post grads at a prestigious institution and gives presentations to big cheeses. She's only 24.
When I think of her at infant school I'm frankly amazed at what she does now!

I had a child at our local primary school for 18 consecutive years so have seen a huge number of nativity/Christmas concert, summer shows etc. whilst I do think our school made a big effort to ensure that every child got to take part, it was always the same children that got the staring roles and it was always the ones whose parents were volunteers/PTA.

I initially thought that these were the more confident parents, prepared to put themselves forward and so their offspring were similarly confident and best suited to these parts. Circumstances meant I wasn’t able to help out at school when ds1 and 2 were there and neither ever had a lead role. In fact ds2 sang a solo at his leaving party and everyone was stunned. They had no idea he could sing!

When ds3 started school I joined the PTA and started volunteering there (big time) and yes, ds3 was chosen for everything. He is quietly confident, academic and extremely musical (hopeless at sport), very similar to his brothers who were chosen for nothing. The difference is that he is so much more confident in his ability now as he has been given the chance to shine so often. Whilst I don’t think the shy, quiet child should ever be forced into performing, I do think it’s important that they are all given every chance to shine at whatever they are good at.

@Threeboysandadog I agree with your summary. Certain children get chosen, so they are seen as the capable ones. And for the girls it was a small group if very pretty girls that were always chosen.
Some teachers do not seem to realise how much these things mean to children and the difference it makes to them.
And the lectures about learning to deal with disappointment piss me off. My quiet DD had plenty of practice with that.

Yes but parents are stakeholders and consumers.

Teachers should be aware

I'm amazed that anyone working in primary school is even prepared to involve themselves in a nativity play on top of their normal job now given how much some parents complain
.

I think it's incredible how much effort and thought parents seem to think teachers put into being deliberately cruel to their children, constantly plotting against them.

Don't be ridiculous, nobody thinks teachers are being cruel on purpose. But teachers have their own prejudices. Some are great and ask which child wants to do what.; Others just choose the loud pretty kids.

I remember the same type of responses when parents used to complain about teachers getting kids to choose teams.
Teachers are not always right. They need to know how they can unthinkingly make their pupils lives worse.

I honestly never chose a child on whether they were pretty or not.
Loud yes, as many schools don't have the budget for decent microphones.

Generally you ask, but get the answers you expected anyway. Shy kids don't want main parts etc.

When I was an nqt I do remember trying to get a child to do one line because I didn't want him to feel left out. No matter how much encouragement he was given he hated it and I had to accept that it wasn't in his interest to be forced to do it. He kept a mimed part in rehearsals that we could do without if he got stage fright and refused to go on. Which he did.

What I have seen sadly is kids with arsehole complainy parents, who demand their child has a starring role, despite no drive, interest etc being given a role they don't bother learning the lines for and taking away from a child more keen but with nicer parents.

Every time I did a play some parent always tried to use it as an excuse to bully me or suggest I lose my job. Along with every other single thing I did in teaching that benefited their children. Clubs, parents evening, reports, concerts.

It's not the number one reason I left teaching but all these things add up and I will never go back and that's the loss of yet another trained teacher.

I'm sure the dregs they replace us with will pander to your whims though. Bravo.

I love to read this! My DD is many wonderful things but performing is not one of them! So I always like to read about others who were similar who have gone on to be confident well adjusted women and shine in their own way.

Pumperthepumper, my goodness, again, why are you misusing quotation marks when I didn't say any such thing. Neither did I say the Nativity was the only time to step out of the comfort zone, you are a great writer of fiction- the stuff you are coming out with, perhaps you are, after all very skilled at writing the school Nativity! So defensive when there really is no need.

YouScumbagYouMaggotHeresKevinTheCarrot

I'm not sure why a bit of feedback is such an afront to teachers, most jobs have people telling you how you can change things, try a different approach, ask you too be flexible. I work in education but I'm not a teacher and I'm always being told by teachers how to do my job, they don't havve the first clue but I still take on board what they are saying to see if I can make life easier for them.

To not 'too'.

Well firstly feedback is always wrong. Parents saying I'm nearing for not teaching Eyfs children column addition. That their child can read or comprehend better than is evidenced. That their child didn't do xyz because they are 'good' and for a bizarre reason I must have planted evidence to catch them red handed. Parents that called the police because their child lost their pencil case was a good one.

I left quite frankly because I was basically abused and bullied and no amount trying to be flexible makes that ok.

Teachers are leaving in droves, it can't be because they're all not as fabulously flexible as you.

But good luck when your unqualified arse is asked to find cover or fill the gaps. Hope it's not too challenging.

Op. I agree with you. I think they should try to pick a play that has a few lines for most kids even if there are bigger and smaller roles. They do exist.

In DD's class they do ask for preferences but also take the kids' ability into account. Apparently they also take.into account who has played what in previous years.

What I like is that apart from the main roles (which is about 4-5 kids) most other kids have roughly the same number of lines, ie everyone has at least two lines except for two kids but dd said they explicitly asked for non speaking roles. In fact in the play I saw that one of them did have a line after all (which was added just for her. It wasn't in the script). I'm not sure if the parents intervened or the teacher insisted. More importantly, I could see from the script that the teacher had actually reassigned some of the lines to make it a bit fairer and also.some individual lines were spoken by several people to ensure that everyone speaks at least two lines.

I disagree with people that most kids wouldn't want a speaking or significant role. I suspect even the shy ones might like one but are too shy to ask for it. And even if they don't I think trying to overcome your fears is a great learning experience and almost more.important than anything else they learn. A school play is a great opportunity to teach kids public speaking skills.

And yes, it's good for kids to learn about disappointment and how to deal with it but I don't necessarily agree that it's good to treat children unfairly or to favour some kids just so the others learn how to deal with nepotism. Do you want to teach them that nepotism is how the world works? Or that those who shout the loudest only get what they want and everyone else has to suck it up?

I also think it's vital that kids who aren't that confident get a chance to learn how to speak in front of others. Being able to speak in front of others is a skill that will help them immensely in all walks of life and at all ages. Who cares if some of the kids don't speak that clearly, can't sing or fluff their lines? It's a school play not a west end production. The parents will be happy just seeing their kids perform.

If you have two or more classes I think.itw fine to give the older class more screen time as the you get class will get their chance in the next year but within a class it's a terrible idea to give the larger roles always to the older ones. What kind of.message does that send? (DD is born end of August so by that logic she'd always end up being a brick or tree or something.for the rest of her school.career).

I understand it's hard for teachers and lot of work goes into this but I think if the end result is a very unfair ajd divisive production it might be better to not do.anything at all as an overtly unfair play does more harm than good and teaches the kids only bad things.

Absolutely agree with PPs who say that
not everyone wants to be star of the show. I loved playing the Angel Gabriel, and even had a solo, but DS only ever wanted to be in the chorus. He was an elephant once weirdly

YouScumbagYouMaggotHeresKevinTheCarrot

'Unqualified arse', what are you on about I very much doubt I'll be asked to cover lessons in a school considering I don't work for the school, I think my 'actual' employer may have something to say about that! I'm a consultant in data protection and cyber security, I work 'with' schools in the Education sector and believe me when I say with a Masters degree and professional qualifications that you need to work in this area I'm far from 'unqualified'- however I am told on a daily basis how to do my job by the highly knowledgeable school staff, that 'are' unqualified in my field of work and have a worryingly bad grasp of concepts and the law. In all honesty, with my knowledge and experience, I really don't need to take the shit either but I do for now as I appreciate they are often under pressure and are time poor - there you go that's how you do 'flexibility'!

From friends/family that work an array of jobs, everyone has challenges and suggestions given to them. My DH works as an Architect and has to do public consultations where all manor of feedback is launched at him, deals with very unhappy clients sometimes, this is the world of work it isn't just teaching!