Does the UK have a racism problem?

[JolllyBee]

In just the last 24 hours alone we've had in the news:

Prince William’s godmother quits palace over comments to black charity boss

Meghan Markle had several 'disgusting' and credible threats to her life, Met cop reveals

Various people's census rants going viral and getting a scary amount of support

James McAvoy shocked by hometown racism in Glasgow after castmates abused on street

and a few days prior:

London Fire Brigade houses a toxic culture of bullying, racism and misogyny, inquiry finds

@Tillow4ever Yes, totally agree with this. Absolutely no interest in actually listening and identifying where they might be getting it very wrong. There's also been a few threads recently where several posters actually define themselves as "anti racists", wearing it like a badge, then go onto display disgusting prejudice towards some groups. Often hiding behind the "i'm on the left so can't be racist' banner.

So what's your definition of racism? We've had people on here say they were called 'white slags', for instance. It just seems like any time a white person brings up how it might not all be plain sailing the reply is 'oh, that's not racism, that's just prejudice - that's different' or it's quite common for people to claim that insulting things said about white women are just people being ironic.

Yes, the linkage to "power", is part of the new definition, as defined by academics in various American universities a couple of decades ago which has trickled down into mainstream thinking. It is asserted constantly on here and other areas of SM, as proven fact, but is in fact only a theory and as such you do not have to believe it. You'll be called a racist by angry people who have much to gain from this definition becoming mainstream or who are just enjoying sticking it to, mostly well meaning white people (but also POC if they don't think The Right Way), for whatever reason, but you'll soon learn to ignore that. It's meaningless after all. Only you can know who or what you are. Not randoms on SM.

@Wiluli I think Glasgow is an interesting example actually - on the one hand as you say it has a very socially progressive outlook in terms of acceptance and positivity towards refugees, but that has to be balanced with the contradictory fact it's also a deeply bigoted - and racist - city.

The legal definition of racism is the only one which matters.

I don't understand why this thread isn't a resounding yes in answer to the original question.

Have a read. You might learn something.

Obviously the UK has a race issue, if you white and are not practicing self flagellation and ashamed of your ansestry your racist now days, but its not racist to abuse white people its a one way street.

Win win 🙄

I do think there's a subtle racism, like for instance the media , there's been a big hype for more diversity sadly it's just two ethnic groups. White and Black. I have not seen any east Asian heritage actors portrayed in the media or if they are they usually play a stereotype good at martial arts , sexy exotic or takeaway owners. It's sad there's no UK TV shows my DD can watch which have a person with her heritage. We watch a lot of stuff from abroad.

I think east Asians suffer from prejudice they are portrayed as "good" immigrants who don't complain , integrate but are completely invisible from media etc as a consequence. It would be nice for more east Asians to speak out about the lack of representation.

That's really quite frightening! What decade was this? Britain is such a diverse place, people can have an entirely different experience of it depending on their postcode.

HI Pops - we moved in the late seventies. But the extreme views were still happening when I finally left in the late eighties. They used to Zeil Heil at QPR matches too... my granddad couldn't believe his eyes when he saw them do it. He'd fought actual Nazis and here were white English men and women saluting as Nazis. They hated everyone who wasn't "born and bred English."

What makes it worse as this estate was down the road from Ladbroke Grove. The whole area was so multicultural - it could have been a fantastic place to live. And we were in this little enclave of hate.

The UK does not have a much worse problem with racism than any other countries. I lived in southern Europe for 16 years and the racism towards black people was open and quite shocking.

I think though that there is a certain element in the UK who like to emphasise the racism here and I have a feeling that the intention behind that is to create division. You can see that it is starting to work.

There obviously is racism in the UK as in any country but I do have a feeling that the narrative of the UK being the most awful racist country in the world is being manipulated to create division between black and white.

I was talking to my ten year mixed raced child about this and she said, but I would say I'm Scottish. Why would I say I'm Scottish, my parents are English, some of my grandparents come from England some from Jamaica. She can see I'm brown she doesn't need to know anything else about me.

Definitely it does, based on the Empire and a superiority complex. Not just skin colour racism either, there's the idea of those "Funny Irish people" and potatoes jokes which I heard in my family growing up.

1 million people starved to death in the mid 19th century and were scraping an existence based on eating potatoes, as a result of the legacy of the Penal Laws that forbade education and primogeniture, not innate ignorance. I couldn't believe it when I first read about the famine, it's definitely not taught in our schools. My eyes were opened by an Irish friend.

As does every single country I've ever lived in, it's not unique to the UK, people are so naive!

Is there a way that someone can say they're not racist without it being a signal that they're racist?

The UK is not the most racist country but it has racism. Enough to make me uncomfortable once in a while and enough to worry that my children will encounter it at some point.

Why should I accept any racism at all? Why should I agree that it's ok to be treated badly because of the colour of my skin once in a while? Why should I be grateful that there is just some racism and that it's not worse? That's not good enough.

I'll tell you something else. I have lived in a few countries. They all had racism and it's always unpleasant. However, in my experience other countries have more overt racism and the British are more subtle about it (like lady hussey).

Just don't be racist. Why do you need to make a statement about it at all? If you have to say that you aren't racist it's usually to excuse something racist.

Don’t think anyone is saying that. Often many Brits on here seem to think as long as they’re not as bad as the States, they’re doing well when actually that’s a ridiculous thought process and makes too many ok with the level of racism because it seemingly not that bad as other countries.

I’ve lived in both the US and the UK for over a decade and the covert racism and the casualness of it in the UK is worse than what I’ve experienced and seen on top of the deniability that there is an issue to begin with. Also, summing it up as an effor to create division between black and white is even more ridiculous considering the many reports of racism in many sectors against anyone who doesn’t “look” British which seemingly means anyone who is not white.

The UK is definitely still racist- but not just the UK. The world is racist

The UK is actually less racist than some countries ( looking at you Italy / Germany / USA etc)

I agree, that's why I side-eye anyone that makes pronouncements of being anti-racist.

I'm not saying that having less racism than in other countries makes it ok. Racism is never acceptable. I also wasn't saying that speaking up about it is trying to cause division. Simply that some people manipulate the issue of racism to create division.

My post was in reply to this one. For some reason the quote disappeared.

I sometimes wonder why the British Empire gets demonised so much more than the Spanish Empire, Persian Empire, and all the many other empires that were comparable but just less successful - I've no doubt they'd have been happy to do the same as the BE had they been able.

Same with slavery. There are now almost 4x the number of slaves in the world than were traded over the whole 400 years of the African slave slave trade. Not one country in the top ten is a western country and Russia is the only majority white country.

All slavery is abhorrent but not all slavery is called out. In fact, the bulk of it is ignored in favour of focusing on what happened hundreds of years ago. It's odd.

The British Empire gets demonised more than other empires by whom TruckerBarbie? Could it just be that you are in Britain so you notice?

In addition when you're talking about slavery that happened hundreds of years ago you are also being ruled over by an aristocratic class whose family money was earned by selling other people. Surely you can understand that might be a bit galling if you are a person whose family was sold and the profits are still being used by people who think they have a God-given right to it? It should be galling to everyone even if it doesn't apply to you.

If you're going to try and pretend that you've never heard people moaning about the BE then I'm not going to waste my time digging up examples. It's extremely common on here. Pretty sure there was mention in this very thread.