to think the census data on religion should mean some changes to how we view the Church of England in this country

[cakeorwine]

ONS data on religion released today

For the first time in a census of England and Wales, less than half of the population (46.2%, 27.5 million people) described themselves as “Christian”, a 13.1 percentage point decrease from 59.3% (33.3 million) in 2011; despite this decrease, “Christian” remained the most common response to the religion question.

“No religion” was the second most common response, increasing by 12.0 percentage points to 37.2% (22.2 million) from 25.2% (14.1 million) in 2011.

You can find out about your area here

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/culturalidentity/religion/bulletins/religionenglandandwales/census2021

An interesting map is available - you can zoom in to local areas
The number of Christians is falling. Still a high percentage but less than half the population of England and Wales say they are Christian.

Christianity could mean Catholicism, C of E and other Christian faiths.

So should this mean we look at 'the State Religion', having Bishops in the House of Lords and the link between the Monarch being the Head of the Church of England. Basically - look at distestablishing the Church of England from the State.

So people who don't follow organised religion are either anarchists or tyrants? Well that's fucking insulting.

Yes, how society will crumbles without religious institutions to persecute women and gay people and members of other religions.

But it’s what the people want…

Some people, who want to convince others that they are the majority. They are not.

They also seem to take pride in being 'atheist', as if it was a personal achievement that made them intellectually superior. It isn't.

But typical of religion

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

the problem is if you leave that territory vacant it does become filled with the most authoritarian and corrupt- because it’s a power grab.

We have it so easy here because of the C of E ‘s gentle presence - so much so we don’t realise where it is at work.

In our society it really will become survival of the ( international) fittest.

No we live in a democracy. Who’s going to power grab?

Its a bit far fetched. In fact it’s ridiculous. We can’t even get people to demo about rising prices! Never mind occupy the vacant bit left by religion.

Its to do with the easy going benign nature of nation and it’s people. Not the C of E!😂

The fabric of our society 🤣🤣🤣🤣

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

Rightio🙂

😂

Utter nonsense.

@Frabbits

well, let’s hope you’re right

@Frabbits who’d have thought that a decaying religion was keeping all those nutters at bay? I think they’re already here!

Q Anon
Anti climate conspirators
Incels
etc etc.

Please learn some history. How foolish to think a power grab can’t happen in a democracy.

Germany 1933: From democracy to dictatorship

@Notwavingbutsignalling has a fair point worth considering. The most obvious group to power grab is anyone or organisation who prioritise money and profit over ethics and peoples’ well-being.

the problem is if you leave that territory vacant it does become filled with the most authoritarian and corrupt- because it’s a power grab.
We have it so easy here because of the C of E ‘s gentle presence - so much so we don’t realise where it is at work.
In our society it really will become survival of the ( international) fittest.

Spot on. This is already happening

No. Is that the one by Robert Stannard?

Is it peer reviewed or some guy who wants to prove God doesn’t exist? What criteria did he apply for proving something so huge?

Humans trying to prove God’s existence is like a byte code trying to prove a programmer’s existence. Bizarre to even think we know where to begin.

Please learn some history. How foolish to think a power grab can’t happen in a democracy.

The example you give was, of course, in an overwhelmingly Christian country, so I'm not sure it helps your own case much.

The most obvious group to power grab is anyone or organisation who prioritise money and profit over ethics and peoples’ well-being.

There's a few religious orgs which fit that description, though tbf not the current version of the CofE

If it was a necessity then why do you think it’s still not a necessity?

Human nature doesn’t change.

Or do you think because we have computers now that we don’t need faith in something bigger than our machines?

Or have the computers become the new gods convincing you that cyber is the new god now and you don’t need the spiritual one anymore?

There’s an inherent human need for something more.

eating shellfish was an abomination

Eating shellfish may have come with serious health risks. And they were trying to prevent people from being poisoned. Not heard of shellfish poisoning?

Why do people always think these rules were given with bad intentions rather than with good intentions? What did religion have to gain from people not eating shellfish?! Prevention of shellfish poisoning is not a bad thing to control.

I wouldn't agree organised religion was a 'necessity' - a theistic one certainly wasn't, think of Buddhism and Confucianism.

I have two concerns. One is the enormous amount of space the idea would occupy in debate in Parliament, the press, the media and public discourse. A lot of energy would be taken up talking about it and then potential unravelling the legal, governmental and social implications which I think would be better spent
discussing and acting on other problems, . It would be a massive distraction. (Maybe Britain prefers that?)

The other is to do with a loss of identity. Britain left the EU, and is no longer a Global power as it once was. If we then deliberately sever ourselves from religion, which is a big piece of humanity and an enormous chunk of British history, tradition, law and culture, there is then a question of who or what are we?

I do not think that now is the right moment.

I know plenty of history thanks.

How foolish to think religion is over important and necessary to everyday life😂

The point I made was about democracies being vulnerable to power grabs in whatever name it may be. The other poster suggested power grabs can’t happen because of democracy… and that’s foolish because history shows it has happened before.

After speaking with a Christian friend about this it sounds like separation of church and state is actually a good thing. Christ spoke truth to power… it’s harder for the CofE to speak truth to power and be Christ-like if they’re in the pockets of power. Explains why it seems the State wanted the church to be in the House of Lords, rather than the church wanting to be part of the state. Maybe the church thought they could do more good if they were in power… but it still means they can’t speak truth to power like Christ.

Jesus was not part of the power structure. He was the one speaking truth to the power structure. And that’s why they crucified him.

I know plenty of history thanks.

“I know words. I have the best words.” ― Donald Trump.

😂

Hitler’s rise to power wasn’t due to the middle ground of Christian’s disappearing though,,, 🤔
l thought it was more about the Treaty of Versailles. I must have missed the Christian bit.

The point was about democracy and power grabs… you suggested a power grab wasn’t possible because we live in a democracy. I was pointing out that democracies are vulnerable to power grabs.

Most likely that power grab will come from anyone or organisation interested in money and profit over ethics and peoples’ wellbeing.

Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. That goes for anything including religions.

That’s why democracy needs checks and balances.

Donald Trump is supportrd by right wing Christian’s.

amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/nov/06/trump-reawaken-america-republicans-midterms-branson-missouri