Am I unreasonable for feeling a bit miffed off?

[PopGoesTheProsecco]

My mum is always pleading poverty. I do numerous errands for her because she says she can’t afford the delivery fees so can’t do online shopping.

When she was in a care home for a few weeks after a fall I spent about £300 on things that she wanted and got them delivered to her. We also visited once a week (2 hour round journey).

She offered to pay me back for the things I bought for her (but in the same sentence mentioned financial hardship, pension credit etc) so I said she didn’t need to pay me back.

Today I ran a few errands for her including to get her some perfume and to get £250 out of her account. She gave me a gift card to buy the perfume with (it cost £40 more than was on the gift card). So I paid the extra with her bank card - but checked with her first to make sure it was okay, (because she’s short of cash and I didn’t want to leave her short).

Next I got the cash for her. I took the option to get a receipt for the transaction so she’d know how much she had left (I was worried she could be struggling).

The receipt after the £250 withdrawal showed nearly £15k in her current account.

My partner and I have no savings and quite often have to ‘rob Peter to pay Paul’ at the end of the month.

I’ve paid out quite a bit of money looking after my mum, she knows we struggle (despite us both working full time) and to find she’s got £15k in her current account has made me feel a bit hurt. Am I being unreasonable?

i completely understand your hurt that she had £15k in savings but I wouldn't do anything. It's probably more complex than it seems.

I've lost my mum (I'm in my 30's and she was in her 70's). My mum was worried about money but after probate had more that i realised. My mum was so careful with money.

Your mum might be worried about needing to fund care. Also a lot of older people save for their own funeral. She's probably only spending her pension and trying to keep her saving for emergency.

if you have a good relationship have a chat about it but when you aren't angry.

But she asked for perfume that cost £40 more than on her gift card. Even if it was a xmas present for someone, that's still a lot of money for someone pleading poverty.
I think, going forward, stop paying for her. Don't let on you know about her £15k and next time she mentions money being tight, ask her if she has any savings for a rainy day. If she say's no, then you know she's playing you. You could also mention you haven't any as she may assume you have loads!

Agree with this tbh.

Perhaps she sees the £15k as a ‘float’ and lives within her means week on week. Perhaps she’s worried about shopping on line but didn’t want to tell you that.

the reason she has £15k is probably because she is careful with money.

This.

Somewhere over £40 for perfume is to me a massive amount, especially for someone who is pleading poverty. And before people come on and start arguing that surely she deserves some luxury in her life, there's "some" luxury and buying very expensive perfume which isn't exactly an essential.

YANBU. Yes it maybe her savings fund, who knows, but you can’t afford things now, never mind in the future

i would now be asking for money upfront for most things, I can’t afford to subsidise family members, and nor it seems can you

Children shouldn’t have to pay for parents is often spouted on here

I'd be miffed. I think 15k is not a lot if that's what you've got to live on for the rest of your life plus state pension.

However she seems to be taking the piss, someone who is pleading poverty and can't afford a £3.99 delivery charge shouldn't be regularly splashing out on things like perfume that's £40 more than a gift card. And no one should be 'offering' to pay back shopping that someone else has got for them, they should be insisting. So given the 15k pot and the spending habits I'd say she shouldn't be pleading poverty and saying she can't pay for essentials. I'd certainly not be going without to pay for someone else who had that money. If money is tight for you I'd be refusing to do her deliveries without petrol money, and insisting on full payment for all orders. If she does regular online orders she has a number of options to avoid delivery charges including saving orders up and doing all at once, purchasing a premium delivery service (such as amazon prime) so it's cheaper if you get a lot of deliveries, looking out for free delivery voucher codes, getting supermarket deliveries at awkward times and doing click and collect to somewhere near her or you and doing a few at once so it's worth popping into town.

Well if nothing else she's nuts to have 15k in her current account.
She could get 4% plus in a savings account now which would give her £500 a year to buy this stuff with.

I can see why you are hurt though

Maybe she thinks "down to your last 15k" is struggling though?

My parents always have these issues with me and my sister. They help her out when she asks as she's struggling, but they're scrupulously fair and give the same to me.

Then if I say "it's a tight month" they offer help - but I mean I've had to dip into rainy day savings, not that I need help.

What were the £300 of things she wanted when she was in a care home?seems a lot to me.Stop buying anything for her unless she gives you the money.Tell her you are struggling as well and have no savings.How old is she and does she own her own home?There s a huge difference in being a home owner or renting.She will not be payingcouncil tax on pension credit also receive COL payments at the higher level.

Why do your siblings want nothing to do with her? And for how long has this been the case?

My late DD was the same. Although always paid me back for shopping etc to the penny. But he lived like someone in utter poverty, spent nothing on his house, wore clothes that had holes in, refused to out the boiler on etc. he had substantially more than the OP in his bank account. He rarelt bought presents for people, never offered to buy lunch when we went out (unless it was just me and I was doing him a huge favour that day). He just saved and saved. His legacy does mean I’m going to be more financially stable now. My DM is similar but she does spend on family, lunches, over pays me when I do errands, likes to keep her house looking nice. She has been using her savings and does worry they will run out as she doesn’t have enough to keep saving now the cost of everything has risen. But does have a good chunk in the back.

Interestingly I had a friend at uni who pleaded poverty and also have about £15k in her bank. She said she wasn’t able to let it go below that.

I suspect the difference is she’s no longer earning. So this may be the entire savings she has and she will think of it for things like a washing machine replacement or a bathroom leak, whatever.and try to live off her pension. So 15 grand won’t seem a lot.

however it’s wrong to the sponge off of you.

I'm the daughter of a recently retired mum who has a chunk of savings equal to that of OP's mum who is only receiving state pension which doesn't even cover her rent. Her savings have got to last her 20 years - that equates to a measly £62 per month.

Care in families goes in all directions. if my mum needs my financial help I'll do what I can to provide that. I'm not selfish or entitled.

Which UK savings account pays + 4%, I would be interested to know this. I would need one where the money isn't 'locked away' though.

Our parents come from a very different financial world though. Credit was not available for much of her adult life, and having that financial padding was all that stood between you and destitution, whereas our generation is definitely more blase about it.

I know my Dad would be distraught to have less than 10k available to him, which in itself is highly privileged, but it comes from a keen memory of having absolutely nothing growing up. I'm sure most of my family members of his age have something similar squirrelled away.

You have now learned you don't need to worry about her finances, and in future it's okay to ask her to give you money up front for things or not to feel remotely guilty about making her pay you back, even if she moans about it.

She HAS been taking advantage, but perhaps without realising how you are quite genuinely strugggling (after all, she is exaggerating her poverty, so maybe assumes you are too).

I know my Dad would be distraught to have less than 10k available to him

Most people over retirement age know funerals don’t pay for themselves.

If she’s on pension credit, she is in poverty.

That £15k would be everything she has, if she had significantly more she would get no pension credit.

And means she would be living on £182.60- £10 (for the £5k savings over the £10k limit) which is £172.60 per week.

This is an income of only £8,975.20 per annum.

It's not a huge amount of money (appreciate it might not feel that way to you), but she's daft for leaving it sat in a current account, which is presumably paying zero/negligible interest. Or maybe that's just her cash float, and most of her money is in other savings/investment accounts?

Yes if it was my mum I would be really pissed off to be quite honest. But when you look at it logically if she does not have a huge pension investments shares etc that is the only money she has to live on for the rest of her life so perhaps another 10 to 30 years that is not alot over that amount of time and if she only had a small or worse still state pension then yes she will be very careful with money as living off of 1 tiny pension is a huge struggle when gas electric council tax water etc is so high and rising so actually I think she would be struggling if this is the case.

No YANBU. If she knows you and DH struggle, she should realise that you can't afford to subsidise her. I suspect that, although she knows it cognitively, she doesn't actually understand what it's like for you emotionally to be financially insecure. When she pleads poverty you will have to tell her you're in the same boat and she will need to dip into her savings or go without.

If she is on Guaranteed Pension Credit (rather than Savings Pension Credit which has now been abolished for new pensioners, but is still paid to those who claimed it before it ended), she is entitled to full Council Tax Benefit. If she is claiming it, she is already at least a grand a year better off than you.

Don't pay for anything else for her. I had similar with my own mother, doing a weekly shop for her during lockdown, paying for it all, adding in little treats along the way, and subsequently found out she has more than several thousand tucked away, some of which she has gifted to a very distant cousin to buy a car. However, it's not my money, it's hers to do with as she wishes, but she never once offered to pay for her own shopping during the pandemic.

OP; I understand why you do feel miffed. Intergenerational issues are complex; and some people strongly view it as the responsibility of children to look after their older relatives (even if they have jobs and childcare responsibilities). Others view older people's care as being the responsibility of the older person themselves (using their assets) or the state. Or have a mix of these views.

I can imagine that it was surprising to find out that she had significant cash assets as you were concerned that she had very little income. My view is that it's unfair of her to want you to pay for items if she has the means.

I think the key question is about whether her needs are being met; and if she is receiving benefits such as attendance allowance; then really she should be using these funds to help meet her needs, even through low level care such as a cleaner coming in; or prepacked foods being delivered. If she has capacity to be making decisions on her life; then she should be making responsible decisions that don't negatively impact on others

I think a lot of older people see their money as separate entities.
In your DM eyes her income is low, she considers it barely enough to live on.
The 15k is her cushion, her rainy day money, to pay for her funeral etc and can’t be used. BTW it’s a bad place to leave a large sum of money, it should be in a separate savings account, small amount of interest and more secure.
Do you have Power of Attorney? Might be away to go.
And just be more businesslike in money matters with your DM now you know she’s not on the breadline. I don’t think your DM is out yo get money from you, I think she just sees money differently.

Quite frankly you sound like a jealous martyr. Mentioning that you did a once per week round trip of 2 hrs to see her does not make you daughter of the century. In fact, it is the bare minimum. I hope you have kinder siblings your poor mum can look to.

What a nasty, spiteful comment to make!

It was a statement of facts, not a complaint.

You have no idea what other demands on her time and energy (as well as on her finances) the OP has.