Kids still feeling the effects of lockdowns…

[sloanedanger]

I just got caught reading a really interesting thread on Twitter started by a teacher:

“Is anyone else thinking we are starting to see the impact of 2 years of disruption and time at home, due to COVID 19, in schools? Extreme behaviours? Some pupils very emotional and struggling to regulate? Low attendance compared to normal? Winter bugs hitting hard?”

A lot of the comments say Y3 is the worst, others saying Years 7 and 8.

My DS is in Year 2 and often struggles with emotions and self regulation at school. It’s made me think, perhaps there’s a reason why linked to the pandemic. Lockdown was hard, DP and I were home with very young DC, trying to work, poor mental health, emotions high. Very little patience.

It’s not just about schools so schools shouldn’t be mentioned?

The only posts allowed are ones which cover every single child in any given scenario? Don’t be daft, and that clearly hasn’t applied to any other post.

Seeing various contortions to try to pick fault with the content or topic of my posts instead of admitting that it’s just me that people don’t like is quite funny.

No, Giraffe. I’m not being ‘daft’

We had a lot of threads about safety or lack thereof in schools, and most of them were started by you. That’s fine; of course you should do so if you wish.

But while schools are a factor, there a myriad of other things people want to discuss.

Schools closing ✅ OK, relevant.

Extra curricular activities ❌ Not relevant to schools
Playgrounds being shut ❌
Nurseries and childminders being shut ❌
Toddler and baby groups closing ❌
Swimming ❌
Visits to relatives and friends ❌
Libraries ❌
Farms / zoos / aquariums ❌
Churches and other places of worship ❌

Not all the above are relevant and not all the above will be experienced by every single child. But taking them all away - and also the trips to the supermarket or cafe or pet shop - contribute to problems. They can’t not. They mean a child’s world is limited - you naturally use new words in new contexts - they mean they miss out on opportunities to exercise, to learn social norms, to work out their place in the world and how they fit into it.

And a lot of the above either haven’t started again following covid or have started in a very limited fashion. Take swimming, for example - you just cannot get in for love nor money (ha!) at my local leisure centre. So I pay (a lot) for swimming lessons for my own toddler, but not everyone is going to be able to do that, so that gap that already existed between a child from - hate to say it - a reasonably affluent background and a child from a poorer background becomes a chasm and a gaping canyon by the time we’re approaching school age.

I am not saying the damage is irreversible. But the things listed above with a red ❌ closing did have an impact - on physical and mental health, on speech development, on parents’ wellbeing and on all the aspects of the early years right through to teens. I know a teenager isn’t going to be disadvantaged by not going to the farm to see the lambs, by the way!

So it isn’t just about schools. It’s part of a big picture that needs to be carefully considered, and I’m certainly not ‘blaming’ anyone for things closing or for reacting to an unknown virus as they did, but it doesn’t mean the actions were without consequence and I would like to discuss some of those consequences without the thread constantly coming back to schools!

It is daft. You didn’t follow-up a poster talking about swimming pools with “It’s not just about swimming pools”

I don’t believe I ever said it was only about schools.

The consequences for all people have been far reaching. People’s lives were diminished and I think a lot of people are finding it hard to recover any sense of optimism as more bad news piles on pre-existing bad news. It didn’t even start with the pandemic, really - the rise of serious discontent and people just being angry with each other and cynical about everyone else’s motives started long before that.

As for the pandemic and lockdowns, it wasn’t even my children missing out on it, as they were already teenagers so had a different set of important life experiences to miss out on, but I still feel immensely sad at the thought of all the families who missed out on so many early childhood rites of passage and who lost the sense of security that comes from knowing and understanding what is expected and what is considered acceptable behaviour. At least my children were old enough to develop some of their own, independent thoughts on it all and were lucky enough to have had a background of solid, happy family, school and societal experiences to fall back on. They already had a strong sense of self, I guess.

I do agree with noblegiraffe though, that as schools are having the consequences dumped on them and appear to be expected to paper over the chasms of barely functioning professional mental health support, physical health support, social services support, provision of food, and a stable environment during the school day, on top of being expected to pretend children have not fallen academically and socially behind generally, that this is an inevitable part of any discussion on the consequences of the pandemic.

But most of your posts are (understandably) but this thread wasn’t.

Your analogy is more like someone insisting on talking about swimming in swimming pools when a thread has been started about swimming generally.

Same. Thankfully she’s mostly better now, but some effects linger. We were chatting today about why she used to cry when she went to gymnastics after lockdown. She could remember crying but not why. I said it was because she was so used to just being at home with mummy and daddy. Separation anxiety was something we didn’t cause, the circumstances did. We worked through it, but lots of people told me I shouldn’t be putting her through it. If I’d listened? No gymnastics, swimming, Rainbows, play dates at other kids’ houses, parties. How small their worlds became. And for some that narrowing has persisted.

Dp, on the other hand, did not follow the home education given, they spent, months and months and months living in a 30 yr 30x10 ft caravan after our house buying was postponed playing out and generally messing about.

Both children have NO problems at all. Educational attainment is better.

But most of your posts are (understandably) but this thread wasn’t.

It’s 800-odd posts about various things. I’m not sure why you seem to have appointed yourself the thread police.

If you want to report my posts for talking about the situation in schools and its impact on children’s recovery from the pandemic on a thread that has the title “children still feeling the effects of lockdowns” then go ahead. But that would be daft.

It really isn’t. Nobody on this thread is commenting on every effect that every young person experienced from lockdowns, they are commenting on their experiences of the impact on children. It’s really controlling to try to shut down a teacher talking about their perspective on a thread specifically expressed to be about kids feeling the effects of lockdowns, as a teacher has experience of the effect on far more children than the average parent does. I think you are wanting to limit the thread to the effect on individual families and their specific children - but that is not in accordance with the thread title, it’s just what you want to get out of it.

I haven’t appointed myself the thread police at all I have said that there is more to the effects of lockdown than schools. You think that’s ‘daft.’

Why would I report your posts? Genuine question. I have been bewildered by a few things in this thread but that one has totally lost me.

I have said that there is more to the effects of lockdown than schools

Which no one has disagreed with or suggested otherwise so god knows why you keep saying it.

and I would like to discuss some of those consequences without the thread constantly coming back to schools!

You can post what you like, as can I. If you’re not happy with the thread coming back to schools, then …. ? Am I supposed to not post what I want to post because you don’t like it?

Telling me you don’t like my posts or style or whatever…. So what?

@Blackcatinanalley - I presume you are addressing noblegiraffe. I don’t think you are being daft, just extremely partisan about posts you do and don’t want to read on this thread and this is colouring the way you choose to interpret the comments of people you don’t want to listen to.

You’ve been known to make the same post more than once yourself.

The reason that you get a hard time on here, BTW, is not because of the messages you are delivering but because of the way you deliver them.

It is that which silences people, because I can’t tell you how unpleasant it is to sit here replying perfectly politely and being spoken to as if I am not only thick, but thick and covered in dog shit. I really don’t care for it, Giraffe. And I’m not engaging further so consider you’ve won if you wish or I’ve been silenced or whatever. I’m far from an idiot and I have better things to do than to be spoken to as if I am. I daresay this is the conclusion a sizeable portion of MN have also reached, which has led you to believe that the breathy ‘oh thank you NG’ posts are representative of general thought on here.

And there you have it. Inventing problems with my posts when your real issue is you just don’t like me.

@Blackcatinanalley - but you have never spoken to noblegiraffe in real life, so your interpretation of tone is affected not so much by what is actually written as by your pre-existing opinion of what you expect to be told and whether you want to hear it. To me, your posts do not come across as quite as polite as you obviously feel they do (although from my perspective they are considerably more polite and infinitely less unpleasant, counterproductive and aggressive than PerfectlyPreserved’s, and considerably less condescending than MarshaBradyo’s). And to me, noblegiraffe’s posts come across as exasperated, worn out and desperate not to be misunderstood, not treating people as thick and covered in dog shit. We all have automatic emotional reactions to other people’s posts from time to time - nobody’s writing style is perfectly bland and free from the risk of misinterpretation. Insisting that you know what people meant and what they were “trying to do” rather than engaging in good faith with what they are actually saying is not particularly nice, open minded or helpful, though - it’s just trying to cancel them and not letting them defend themselves.

although from my perspective they are considerably more polite and infinitely less unpleasant, counterproductive and aggressive than PerfectlyPreserved’s

Gosh, it's really surprising that a person who reckons other people's views on what they find helpful for themselves are arrogant cod psychology found it unpleasant to be challenged. Whatever next!

I have no problem with you, because I don’t know you.

I do have a problem with you speaking to me as if I am both stupid and reprehensible in some way. I am neither. Do not make yourself out to be the victim.

I have no problem with you, because I don’t know you.

Your little diatribe says otherwise.

Your problem with me isn't my problem, I truly don't give a shit how you think I speak or post or whatever. Your continued efforts to give me feedback are entirely a waste of your time.

@PerfectlyPreservedQuagaarWarrior

You made specific reference to you and I having had previous discussions, which as we hadn't at that point spoken on this thread, could only refer to arguments elsewhere. This means what you've just written here is demonstrably false.

I said I had discussions with you on other threads, but I didn't specify what they were. There is nothing wrong with that. What I wrote is absolutely not false, thanks.

Isn't it a shame that a thread which started off as a place to share the impact of the various lockdowns on our children and young people has been so totally derailed. Again.

It’s people getting angry again. I’d tell you it’s not healthy, but I’ll get shot down for it! I guess it’s all evidence of the harms of pandemics and lockdowns, and also of why children might be having a hard time recovering from it if adults are still so traumatised that they are unable to regulate their emotions themselves. There are certainly a lot of young children in primary schools and older children in secondary schools who seem to have trouble regulating their emotions and being respectful of each other, so not dissimilar to this thread, really.

True. With insults - see below. Such a shame.

Anyway I guess it helps them in some way but tbh who knows.

@MarshaBradyo

True. With insults - see below. Such a shame.

It is healthy to gain views from different perspectives. This way you're not living in an echo chamber. I do like reading how others feel even if I don't always agree with them, and I wouldn't insult them on that basis and tell them they should feel differently. I haven't lived their experience.

The derailing has occurred because some on this thread don't want to hear some people's thoughts and experiences, and actively hound them off the thread. That's the shame.

I’ve skipped a few posts and mostly read those that interested me. I did object to self pitying etc as I think it stops people sharing.

I don’t think I’ve commented on much than that, except earlier to say that sounds hard and sympathising when the thread started and it was more about impact on children.

What actually stops people sharing is focusing obsessively on posts you object to and turning them into the subject for page after page. If you do not want those posts to become the subject, you ignore them and continue to respond only to the posts you wish to remain the theme of the thread. There have been countless opportunities to turn back to the original theme, but you seem strangely reticent to do so, despite vociferously wondering how this has happened.