Are we morally obliged to work ?

[Justthisonce12]

630,000 economically inactive people in the UK not claiming benefits. Early retiree’s I guess.

Hunt plans to tackle this and encourage work force participation to allow businesses to grow. ie cheap labour I presume ? But also preventing a brain drain.

Will be interesting to see how he plans to address this.

And also bitching about being “ripped off” when being able to afford six figgies income tax.

Boo fucking hoo the poors can’t match them on funding society. It must be horrific for them.

A tax that remains payable even after retirement

People who retired early, students, young people who have not yet got a job after education. Also, many ill/disabled people who live with a well earning partner.
That was me for years. I was unable to work, but could not claim benefits as the household income was too much. I know many people in this position.

A lot of people want to work but cannot because the NHS is not giving them the healthcare they need to re-enter the workplace.

Exactly.

Then they can afford child care

Or to reduce their hours to provide it

I agree with you here. If a woman wants to work and her husband earns a lot, he should then pay either the bulk of, or towards, the childcare to enable her to do so.

The freedom to live our lives as we want to (within reasonable limits and without harming any one else) is one of our most precious freedoms. Having said that, the attitude to work on this thread surprises me. My mother was forced to give up a job she loved on becoming pregnant. Other women were forced out of the workforce on marriage. When the Equalities Act was passed in the 1970s, it revolutionised the economy as women entered the workforce in vast numbers. Work gives meaning and dignity to life. Money gives security. Not having security is extremely tough. I’ve been an employee for decades, self-employed and now I am an employer, building a business and employing a team of six -mainly under the age of 30. They are brilliant and amazing and ensuring their health and happiness is a key priority of the business. Our mothers and grandmothers fought for the right to work. Workplace practices and benefits have improved immeasurably in the last 40 years. Nobody should be miserable at work or forced to work if they don’t have to, but I think work can have a big part in living a fulfilling life.

@Zoomattheinn

👏👏

That’s me, other half pays more in tax than most people would earn in a year. Absolutely no point in me going out to work full time for £20 k a year when by the time I’ve taken off child care, fuel, unpaid leave due to kids being unwell etc we would be worse off.
I took a year off for maternity but it’s now turned into 7 years… really can’t see myself ever being back in employment until the kids are up and out the house. I’m 42.

Surely we all have to do some form of work in order to survive?
not all work is paid work, much of the work which contributes to the running of society is unpaid and done by women.... Is it not?

I know someone who was able to give up work mid forties as her husband is a very high earner. She now judges everyone else for not working enough. 😕 I would love to be in her position.
Work is definitely not everything and your job role does not define you as a person. If others are in a position not to work as are financially ok then good on them. I would as I say, give up working tomorrow if I could. I get no joy from it and it causes so much anxiety.

Work gives meaning and dignity to life.

Universalising your experience like this is not going to aid your understanding. There's nothing inherent about working that means it does either of those things. It just does for some people, that's all.

Also, I wouldn't say workplace practice has improved hugely in the last 40 years. There are some things that are undeniably better, yes, but a lot of jobs have undergone shittification in recent decades.

I honestly can't imagine a life where you have never worked.

Being unemployed has proven detrimental affects on mh.

60 to 80 years is a long time do to not much.

My sister has not worked (or claimed any benefits), since November 2020. She now wants to get back into work but, despite applying for jobs that she has 30 years of experience for and some she has no experience of but has transferable skills, she has yet to receive a single interview. At the age of 58 she has now resigned herself to the fact that she may never work again. It's all well and good saying "early retirees" should think about returning to the workforce, but if employers aren't even going to consider them then what's the point. If "older" people should be "morally obliged" to work then employers should be "morally obliged" to employ them.

I contributed for 45 years and I've yet to hear anyone say thank you.

Why do you assume not working equates to not doing much?

Well people are saying work is harmful, that's why they don't want to do it. Harmful to mh etc.

I can't imagine if thats the case they are doing much incase it harms their mh?

I count volunteering and caring for disabled kids or elderly parents as work.

People seem to be suggesting it's OK to never work or even that not ever working should be the ideal because of the harms (environmental, being taken advantage of etc)

But if that's the ideal, how does society function?

I know two women who gave up work when their first child was born and never went back. Both their first (of several) children are in their early thirties now. As someone who worked for 38 years full time without breaks for children, and retired at 58 I don’t think I’ve contributed any more or less than they did.

I watch a lot of off-grid lifestyle videos on YouTube and do ask this question when I see some people. There are a fair number of people who live outside the "system" and they grow their own food, make their own electricity and do whatever the minimum is for them to buy in the things they can't make themselves. And that's all roses up until you factor in old age, emergencies, publicly funded things (roads, libraries, street lights, street cleaning etc) and other such things that can only exist from other people paying into a larger system.

I think people are morally obligated to contribute to a system that they also benefit from. It's difficult to say how much that contribution should be - but it almost certainly doesn't amount to a 40 hour work week.

@TimBoothseyes
Completely agree

I count volunteering and caring for disabled kids or elderly parents as work.

You're coming at this from a different standpoint to the OP then, which is about paid work. I agree that caring labour is work, but it looks like most people are responding in the context of the thread being about paid jobs. This may explain the different conclusions.

@TimBoothseyes tell your sister to sign o for credits

If the channels you watch are a decent number of subscribers they will self employed as content creators and paying tax anyway.

There is no point in people generalising or extrapolating their own very personal and specific circumstances / perspectives / values on this issue into other people and expecting those other people to care. That way lies madness!

For instance, would the people who argue "work is the meaning to life" apply this rigid doctrine to their own children? What if their own daughters happen to meet a mega millionaire one day, who spends three moths in Switzerland, three months in the Bahamas and so on. He buys property and investment in her name (better for tax purposes) and her children grow up in this lifestyle, with a mum who doesn't work, but throws herself into life in other ways. Would you seriously be telling them to jack it all in to stay put in the U.K. doing the same job for ever more? Would their lives be meaningless? I don't think so. Maybe different to your life, but not by any means meaningless because life is what you make it. Think of all the experiences and time snd freedoms she would have that you wouldn't. This is why there is no point in rigid thinking. Everyone has to find their own path and their own optimal balance. Live and let live!