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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Am I overreacting or is that outrageous?

178 replies

Terrysnotmine · 09/11/2022 11:36

In a shop near me

Am I overreacting or is that outrageous?
OP posts:
TrashyPanda · 09/11/2022 13:31

Why are Eastern Europeans (who suffered far more than the British under the Nazi regime, with invasion, occupation, ghettos, Holocaust transports) more likely to find the word “Nazi” for a general German WW2 soldier offensive?

we are more likely to get upset about what happened at Yalta and afterwards.

wastedofworld · 09/11/2022 13:31

PuppyMonkey · 09/11/2022 12:23

I think you are still allowed to call them Nazis if they are actually Nazis. Aren’t you?

This! I just can’t understand the outrage!

Should the sign have said, ‘please do not touch those-who-shalt-not-be-named’?

messybutfun · 09/11/2022 13:33

CloudybutMild · 09/11/2022 11:59

No, the Axis powers were fought and defeated by the Western Allies, of which “we” (as in the British Empire) were part.

Is teaching of history really this bad nowadays?

The Russians, who turfed my great grandparents and grandparents out of their home and then subsequently the Americans, who did the same one more time, wouldn’t have been able to this without you.

ElmoNeedsThePotty · 09/11/2022 13:33

Can’t we say Nazi now then?

What are you offended by OP?🤔

CloudybutMild · 09/11/2022 13:34

JustWork · 09/11/2022 13:26

It was a joint effort by the russian winter and the Soviet army.

The rest of the allies contributed too but i think we can agree that the battering they received on the eastern front was the decisive factor.

Which is massively different to the completely ignorant claims being made above that the other allies didn’t contribute.

mushroom3 · 09/11/2022 13:37

I think it is offensive and should have said "do not touch the display"

TrashyPanda · 09/11/2022 13:39

SleeplessinSouthwold · 09/11/2022 13:29

In Europe it's illegal to deal in ANY kind of nazi paraphernalia and has been so since the end of WW2: it's bit of a surprise to come to the UK and see that's it's absolutely fine, yep, fine, what's the problem? Just saying.

It is the sale of Nazi memorabilia that is banned in some European countries.

that is totally different from war gaming model figures, airfix panzer tanks etc

Paramummy3 · 09/11/2022 13:41

the apostrophe is outrageous

Testina · 09/11/2022 13:41

SleeplessinSouthwold · 09/11/2022 13:29

In Europe it's illegal to deal in ANY kind of nazi paraphernalia and has been so since the end of WW2: it's bit of a surprise to come to the UK and see that's it's absolutely fine, yep, fine, what's the problem? Just saying.

This isn’t “Nazi paraphernalia”, it’s figurines in historical accurate uniform.

Section 86 of the German Criminal Code (StGB) doesn’t forbid this in Germany, rather - “it is forbidden to distribute, produce, trade or make publicly available on data storage mediums propaganda materials of unconstitutional organizations in Germany”.

See photo of German model shop selling these in Germany. They aren’t propaganda materials.

The law does extend to, “propaganda materials are also banned "which, according to their content, are intended to perpetuate the aspirations of a former National Socialist organization."

So I suppose if they were sold specifically to re-enact WW2 battles with Germany the victor, to be followed by a march holding aloft the glorious victors before a reading of Mein Kampf, you might be on dodgy ground.

But historical military displays? Seems OK under German law.

Am I overreacting or is that outrageous?
Claudia84 · 09/11/2022 13:41

Like pps I don't understand at all what is offensive about this, and no one who has said it is offensive has said why.

VivX · 09/11/2022 13:42

But aren't they model nazi soldiers?

I'm presuming some sort of WW2 recreation model. Wouldn't it be more confusing to call them something else?

Presume they are referring directly to the soldier figurines because not many people would be interested stroking the model grass? (I'm prepared to be re-educated on this, though)

I imagine GCSE history would be almost impossible without being able to refer to nazis.

(Agree about the apostrophe)

Testina · 09/11/2022 13:42

mushroom3 · 09/11/2022 13:37

I think it is offensive and should have said "do not touch the display"

Could tell us why you find it offensive though?

SleeplessinSouthwold · 09/11/2022 13:44

TrashyPanda · 09/11/2022 13:39

It is the sale of Nazi memorabilia that is banned in some European countries.

that is totally different from war gaming model figures, airfix panzer tanks etc

That makes a huge difference! All good, carry on.

BitOutOfPractice · 09/11/2022 13:44

@HuggsBosom I think it is generally agreed that the fact that the Germans had to fight on two fronts (others too if you count North Africa etc) ultimately led to their downfall. But to say that the Soviets alone defeated the Axis powers is really not true.

BingandPandomoanium · 09/11/2022 13:49

Thanks OP this has given me a right good laugh just as I was having a zoom meltdown at work! I think the clue was in the thank you at the bottom of the note! Smile

Mirabai · 09/11/2022 13:52

It’s the scale of the eastern front losses that is key. 80% of the Wehrmacht were deployed there and 80% of German soldiers were lost there - which is approx 4 of the 5 million total who died.

WitchyOsmansXraySpectre · 09/11/2022 13:54

Well I’m a Nazi and I’m offended…

…oh no, I mean I’m not a Nazi and I’m not offended.

JustWork · 09/11/2022 13:59

BitOutOfPractice · 09/11/2022 13:44

@HuggsBosom I think it is generally agreed that the fact that the Germans had to fight on two fronts (others too if you count North Africa etc) ultimately led to their downfall. But to say that the Soviets alone defeated the Axis powers is really not true.

No, the Soviets alone didn't defeat Germany but neither can you gloss over their contribution as many in the UK and us tend to do. It wasn't an equal contribution. They won the deciding battle at Stalingrad, which had the bulk of the German army. (They were also the first to enter Berlin, I think). Let's not forget that nearly 25 million soviets died in ww2, much more than in any other country, including the allies. (Only China comes close in terms of fatalities with about 20mio).

Testina · 09/11/2022 14:01

TrashyPanda · 09/11/2022 13:31

Why are Eastern Europeans (who suffered far more than the British under the Nazi regime, with invasion, occupation, ghettos, Holocaust transports) more likely to find the word “Nazi” for a general German WW2 soldier offensive?

we are more likely to get upset about what happened at Yalta and afterwards.

Well indeed. I don’t think the poster talking about “Eastern Europeans” even thought about who they meant. Drawing their own personal Curzon line, perhaps?!

BagpussBagpussOldFatFurryCatpuss · 09/11/2022 14:04

If it was a display of fairies in a wooded fairy wonderland would you be upset if they put up a sign saying 'Please do not touch the fairies - Thank you' ?

Or a Teddy bear picnic? 'Please do not touch the bears - Thank you'?

It's obviously a model depicting Nazis at war so not inappropriate at all.

HangerLaneGyratorySystem · 09/11/2022 14:06

I think in general its sound advice; steer well clear of Nazis. Other than that, if you don't want your Nazis touched, esp small Nazis that might be damaged or stolen etc., I'd say keep them indoors and to yourself. Again, sound advice.

deydododatdodontdeydo · 09/11/2022 14:06

BitOutOfPractice · 09/11/2022 13:44

@HuggsBosom I think it is generally agreed that the fact that the Germans had to fight on two fronts (others too if you count North Africa etc) ultimately led to their downfall. But to say that the Soviets alone defeated the Axis powers is really not true.

It's massively simplistic to say that Russia beat the Nazis (or the British or the Americans).
Yes, the efforts of Russia in the east, coupled with the bad weather (Hitler almost took Moscow) had the effect of turning the tide, and the losses were huge, but it certainly wasn't a solo effort - there was fighting against Germany in north Africa, against Italy in the mediterranean, etc.
Simplification for simple people...

JustWork · 09/11/2022 14:07

JustWork · 09/11/2022 13:59

No, the Soviets alone didn't defeat Germany but neither can you gloss over their contribution as many in the UK and us tend to do. It wasn't an equal contribution. They won the deciding battle at Stalingrad, which had the bulk of the German army. (They were also the first to enter Berlin, I think). Let's not forget that nearly 25 million soviets died in ww2, much more than in any other country, including the allies. (Only China comes close in terms of fatalities with about 20mio).

Not that we should forget the role the Soviet Union played AFTER ww2 either...

(Lest anyone thinks I'm a Russian bot...).

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 09/11/2022 14:08

Don’t touch the Nazi’s what?
and why does only one have whatever it is, while all the others go without?
Scandalous

JustWork · 09/11/2022 14:11

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 09/11/2022 14:08

Don’t touch the Nazi’s what?
and why does only one have whatever it is, while all the others go without?
Scandalous

Maybe it's "the Nazi's thank you".

Maybe the display is a present from the Nazis to say thank you to the owner of the shop for something. That's the only way it would make (grammatical) sense.

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