to be p****d off that having another child would throw us into poverty

[chocolatemummy]

My dd is 4 now and I was never sure about having another one, found the whole experience fluctuated me from madness to untopia and very stressful.
Now, I realize that I actually think I could quite like to have another one in a couple of years sors so before I'm too old. For me, for my dd who would love it I know and my dh who loves children.
I just know that having one child has thrown us into debt and put massive strain on our relationship because of money worries and we are so looking forward to her starting school and no more nursery fees!
To have another would surely push us over the edge and I resent that

Yes, sounds like you need to think about it some more.

Do you have enough space to accomodate another child? Presumably you'd need another bedroom as your dd would be getting to old to share a room comfortably.

Could you downsize, if you both want a baby that much? Flog the car (if you can do without one, or if you have 2, one of them?)

Do without a holiday (or opt for a cheaper one each year?)

Can one of you afford to not work so no nursery fees?

Difficult choices! Good luck

yes we have enough room but we wouldnt if we downsized. We couldn't afford not to work either.
I know people manage but I never wanted just to 'scrape by' thats why I planned on just having one, but to be honest todays its expensive enough without children never mind with children! I supose this thread is partly about thinking of having another child and partly about how bloody expensive EVERYTHING seems to be getting, its ridiculous and puts so much pressure on normal working young families

chocolatemummy you are in the position I was in until very recently and I resented it like crazy.

No real advice, just empathy. Is there any way your dh could earn more money so that you could stay at home? Only having one worker in the family loses income obviously but you can lose a lot of expense too.

A 2nd isn't that expensive at first, as you have all the 'stuff' already. I agree with notnowbernard that you could maybe downsize. I now do a bit of work in the evenings to earn extra money, but it does mean i dont see DH much.

I understand why you resent the choice of another child or not coming down to money as it is something that shouldn't be linked to money at all. Unfortunately, it is.

Things are expensive chocolatemummy and it does restrict you, which is really frustrating. I want to go back to work for my sanity (only 2 dys, is that too much to ask?) but it seems so expensive to get childcare for 2 children. My fear is that it doesn't get much easier once they are at school either. You still need the wraparound care and where I live there doesn't seem to be anything for that.

Tigerfeet...why aren't you in that position now (or an I being too nosey )? Could your decisions/solutions help chocolatemummey with her choice?

"Stuff" isn't really a problem; it's childcare that's the killer imo. We have four and scrape isn't the word!! Dh isn't well enough to work, and I can only work p/t as ds2 is only 6 months and b/fed. But childcare for the kids would cost about double what I earned if dh couldn't look after them.

Unfortunately, that's the way it is these days for most people - you either have money or children, not both.

Modern life is expensive, yes.

I have been thinking about this lately, too (on an enforced budget, dp setting up new business). Have had to really think about what's important.

Would you be able to list an inventory of what's really important to you and your family?

Or more simply, a list of what you need, rather than what you want

And then work out how that fits with the Baby Plan?

TBH I don't feel like we have spent much on DC2 at all. Hs has books, toys, cot and clothes from older sibling and friends, we already had a buggy etc. I am a sahm amd it means another few years until surviving on one wage.
I understand this is different from your situation. Good luck whatever you decide

If you feel that having a second would make you resentful then you prob shouldn't do it...

Well, logically, your daughter will be starting school soon, so you would only have one set of nursery fees to pay. If you have managed thus far, it's "only" another 4 years of managing, during which time both you and your husband may get promotions and better salaries.

chocolatemummy I really sympathise with your dilemma and with the more general resentment - it does sometimes feel as though having children is a madly expensive luxury for everyone except City types.

I think if you do have another one, it probably will be hard in the beginning. But how will you feel in 10/15/20 years time? There's a good chance that however difficult the first 5 years are you'll get through them, and you won't regret it later.

Scraping by needn't be that bad - and it won't be forever. You'll have the rest of your lives to be "comfortable" once the early years are finished and you're both properly back to work.

I think thats just it, it seem like a LUXURY these days where as it isnt, its a biological, natural thing.
Sleepycat I am sorry to use the term poverty so flipantly and probably deserved that.
I just mean that we have struggled and moved house and my dh doesnt have a very good job and earns several thousand a year less than me. We pay almmost as much as our mortgage on nursery fees and I got made redundnat in 2006 and we fell into trouble fast and got a few thousand into debt just to keep afloat.
I am thinking that when she starts school we will still pay wrap around up to about £200 per month but at the moment we pay over £500.
Plan is to really blast the debts over next couple of years and get rid of them and then if we have another child we'll have nursery fees AND wrap around to pay for!
Chiuldren themselves dont cost that mush its the childcare but we just couldn't afford only one of us to work

Karen999 no it wouldnt make me resentful I am just worried that in tis economic climate we would not be able to cope,

Tbh I always wondered about having number 2 for the 'resentment' issue....it was not do to with money but time!! DD1 is 8 and was really enjoying getting some sort of a life back....however I am with a new partner (well have been for 3 years) and I really did think long and hard before having another....am happy to say that it was the best thing I ever did! DD1 adores her sister and I feel like I am enjoying this baby far more....prob because I am less stressed and more laid back....x

Are you claiming all your tax credits?? Including those for childcare?

well thats exactly my thinking, I wanted my dd to be at that age where she will be as excited as me and not gealous, she can be my little helper etc and I will only have one at home during the day so I can have focus time on both individually-thoughout years maternity leave anyway.
I am am lot better now, at first I found the lack of money, time, energy, freedom a nightmare but now I just get fed up being skint but figure I have already lost my freedom so what difference is another going to make, and I wouldnt have to keep borrowing other peoples children to keep my dd company

Sounds like you find motherhood quite hard. Starting from a point of seeing it as a loss of freedom doesn't bode well for starting over again with a newborn imo. Why do you want another child?

I've only read a bit but i think that you need to get yourself in a 'good place' before you think about having another DC - if money issues have put a strain on your relationship in the past then having another child may (and probably will) bring that up again which may have a negative effect of all of you

Do you have a mortgage? if so could you look at the term of it or find a cheaper mortgage company? may save you a bit

Or have a look at another nursery if there is a cheaper one?

We have 4 DC and i gave up work because we couldn't keep paying the fees, my wage only covered the fees and i didn't see the point when it was bringing nothing at all home! Thankfully for us DP's wage is sufficiant to cover everything but we are by no means 'well off' as some people expect larger families to be - we just about manage thats all!

If it seems expensive now, don't think it gets much easier when they're older.

My two are 15 and 11 and we're lucky enough to have a very good joint income (helped by my promotions which I don't think I would have had if I hadn't kept working without much of a break for maternity).

But, the kids have got used to a high standard of living as a result and there's not much left over after we've paid for out-of-school activities like sport and music plus clothes, trips etc.

Expenses like having a cleaner seem a necessity because we work and resent spending free time doing housework.

We had thought it would get easier once we didn't need paid childcare...but the money's swallowed up.

Two are definitely more expensive than one, and a lot more work...I wouldn't have made any different decisions though.

All of this makes my blood boil, you are all great people trying your best for your famillies and having to count every penny.
Someone down my road is having her 7th child, she is only 31yrs old, has NEVER had a job.
Changes her hair colour every few weeks, has 4 great big ridgeback dogs that she NEVER takes for walks, has 2 4X4's and the biggest house on the estate.
But she owns the house, was born in it and i've been in it once and its all cream carpet and white leather sofa's.
WTF! how does she do it? She claims not to live on benefits, her husband is a builder but she must be raking it in on child benefits.
Sometimes i think, the average man and woman on the street who pays their taxes and do not claim are the stupid ones.

AB

yes we have a Mortgage, reasonable one I think compared to some of our friends who are mortgaged to the hilt!
I am thinking of having another child, in a couple of years, because I want to? why esle do we have children unless its because we want them? I am a proifessional,responsible, working mother and wife and take these decisions very seriously and thats why I am discussing it on here and currently have permanent contraception placed in my tummy so I dont have any accidents.
Yes we get tax crdits which are a real help, I didnt see my dd as a lack of freedom, I just was very sociable and had a large network of friends who I saw often and who mostly dropped off within a year of having dd as none of them were in same situation which I found quite hard and don't apologise for that.
I am just saying that having a child is expensive, mainly due to child care costs and a year of maternity pay at £100 per week instead of £300 per plus and that I feel a bit compromised that I even have to consider all of this when actually I would juts like to have another child and whats wrong with that.......