The state of the NHS right now is terrifying

[Faciadipasta]

I am feeling genuinely scared for us as a country health care wise. I was reading today about a chap who died of internal bleeding while his family were kept on hold to 999 for 10 minutes as nobody even answered the phone.
Then there are all the people who die while waiting for an ambulance to arrive, because they are all lined up.outside the hospitals unable to offload their patients.
People can't see a GP at all, so there are bound to be loads who are dying of things that could have been prevented if they'd been seen. Waits at A and E are enormous and they don't even have enough chairs so people with serious injuries or illnesses are having to just sit on the floors in the corridors.
We're actually starting to feel like one of those warzone countries that you see on the news and it is scaring me shitless.
I mean even in the US you wouldn't just be left to die because there was nobody to answer the phone although admittedly you'd probably end up bankrupt for paying back the care, but at least you wouldn't be dead!
I personally feel like we have no care, no safety net. And it's scary.
Will it get better? What can be done?

We have a system which was set up in the days when if you were diagnosed with some conditions eg cancer, heart attack, kidney failure, diabetes it was basically curtains for the vast majority. Scientists have developed treatments for these conditions where many people have nearly normal life expectancy which is a wonderful thing but require treatment and monitoring which is both labour intensive and expensive - we have not increased taxes to cover this or trained staff in time.

That’s a good assessment @fiftiesmum
The answer is more doctor, nurses and staff.
But berating the doctors (GPs) who are still here and not quite won’t help train them. For those saying Gps should work 100 hours a week, if police or teachers or Tesco staff were made to do that, then of course most would refuse quit or make mistakes. The reason you can’t see a GP is they are already working 12 hour days and more than most people full time and need more funding to have more staff. Same with hospitals where are minimal staff on weekends and nights. You can’t just make all staff work 100 weeks to cover, in its current state you would lose staff 9-5 Monday to Friday to cover nights and weekends. The answer is just more funding and more staff and better management. NHS management is top heavy and totally shit.
But don’t blame the staff working hard still here, there the ones here!

It’s difficult to match the burden with this model though. So the strain will increase unless it changes. But politically it’s not easy, understandably in many ways.

sorrynotathome has it. It’s not perfect no. But over a decade of a shitty govt who are ideologically opposed to the nhs and subsequently underfunding it will do that for a health service.

I mean even in the US you wouldn't just be left to die because there was nobody to answer the phone although admittedly you'd probably end up bankrupt for paying back the care, but at least you wouldn't be dead!

Do you know how many people avoid using healthcare in the US because of how much it costs? How many won’t even call an ambulance because the price tag runs into the thousands? Do you have any clue how many Americans die purely because they can’t afford to be seen by a dr, or have life saving treatment precisely because they will go bankrupt? Yes, actually, many Americans die because of the way the health system is run. Are you aware that the single biggest cause of bankruptcy in the US is healthcare bills?

The nhs is not perfect, but it’s fucking brilliant. Us brits don’t have a clue how good we have it here. Your criticisms of the nhs are so privileged it’s unreal. Yours sincerely, dual citizen of the U.K. and the states.

Sorry @LordNelsonsPigStatues but in my area at least, your wrong. The NHS as a concept is brilliant, certainly, but if you can't access help when you really need it then that is a serious problem. And you can piss off calling me 'privileged' for wanting to be able to get healthcare for my family.
Honestly I could real off at least 6 times when we as a family (and im talking nuclear family of me, DH and 2 dc here not wider family) have been seriously let down, that would have led to VERY serious consequences. I also know 2 young people (30s) who died of very treatable cancers because they were not able to.see GPs for a long time, and then were repeatedly fobbed off when they did manange to get seen, which meant their cancer was diagnosed too late.
I was absolutely not suggesting we adopt a US style system though if that's what got your back up?

Noticed a lot of adverts for Bupa . I'm scared this is where we're heading if we want any decent health care .

Having used Bupa this year, I can assure you that isn't a very good option either. I actually got NHS physio appointment before an appointment was made privately. And I literally had to justify every small bit of treatment and tests. At a time of serious illness it was very frustrating. And my Bupa insurance doesn't allow for a second opinion so I'm waiting on NHS now anyway because the BUPA doctor was shit.

A really simple solution to the poor communication would be to have our own copy of records/ reports etc from each of the departments to take wherever we are going next in case we have to move across heath regions for treatment.
I would have thought the expense of this would be saved by helping to streamline time between appointments ie they can’t say they haven’t seen test results or a report from the previous consultant.

I'm job hunting now and started to value private health insurance above public pension which I may or may not be able to use in 25 years' time. I already pay private for dental and MH treatment for my child, and would not go back.

This is what happens in America is it not ?

For some resaon the NHS are not too keen on you having access to your own private mediacal records.

I wonder why that is ?
Less law suits ?

Agreed. I'd never switch jobs now without private health care and dental care (that covers my children also) matching what I have now. Still have to pay for it through tax obviously! But it us now essential because every treatment they or I have needed for the past two years has had to be done privately or it would still not have happened. And yet a huge chunk of my salary is still deducted for the NHS which has effectively ceased to exist. My father would also he dead by now (twice!!) if not for private healthcare. It's sick how many people are suffering. This system has collapsed.

Same thing happened to my lovely, very physically fit friend. She died aged 33. NHS entirely culpable, completely preventable. She should still be here.

You can see your own GP medical records online
www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/about-the-nhs/how-to-get-your-medical-records/
You can ask the hospital to see your records.

People would lose their paper health records so not reliable.

I’m in Scotland and we have no access to medical records as far as I know.

There is legislation that requires all healthcare providers to maintain comprehensive records of care and treatment provided. The red book scheme quickly showed lots of people lose personal records. What would happen for records of people with dementia or learning disabilities where there was no LPA?

Records have become more complex with more NHS services being handed to independent sector. There isn’t a single record system and patients need to consent to information sharing between providers.

Completely open records aren’t workable either - would you want your local pharmacist, an ambulance technician or a podiatrist knowing about your incontinence, an assault or an STD, for example?

You can access and get copies of your medical records but it is expensive and time consuming for healthcare providers. It’s not about being sued, it’s about not wasting money when they’re resources are so stretched.

Yes you do - seems you have to fill in a form , might have to pay if you make several requests -
www.nhslothian.scot/YourRights/DataProtection/Pages/Subject-Access-Requests.aspx

Private health insurance does not cover emergency care. In many cases it doesn’t even cover investigations. Not to mention pre-existing conditions.

'The NHS as a concept is brilliant, certainly, but if you can't access help when you really need it then that is a serious problem'

It may be the case of 'if you keep repeating something often enough, people will believe it'. I never understood the reverence around the NHS - yes it may be a brilliant concept - in theory, or 50 years ago. It is certainly not the best healthcare in the world now, regardless of how much people don't want to admit it. It used to be much better in dealing with emergencies rather than routine treatments, and now it is struggling with both. We need a two tier system.

To the poster suggesting that GP's should work more - I suggest you try this and see how quickly they will leave to work elsewhere.

www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/nhs-staff-crisis-20000-doctors-28417859?fbclid=IwAR242dYq64WqBSJzK6eB_c_HbtITqufaob5o-rTmY96vLezFZ4KP79NEXhQ Pertinent to this thread - huge numbers of vacancies.

Yes this exactly. If they are trying to run the NHS into the ground to replace with some kind of private healthcare model, they have zero idea of the impact that will have in the meantime. Anyone who has complications in childbirth, breaks a leg or has a degenerative condition will have to rely on the NHS, there isn’t a private system in place to deal with that kind of emergency/non-routine/massively expensive conditions. Lack of staff will in time impact everyone. It’s crucially important to have a working health care system and the current government just don’t seem to grasp it.

Completely agree. It's being run to the ground by continuing poor decisions in government and poor pay. Beds across the country and a&e's have been closed despite the population continuing to increase. Social care has also been affected which has also impacted on the NHS. No one wants to work for the NHS anymore!

It's really hard to train for say, nursing when you are older as well. The government really does need to offer opportunities that would work for more people. How do you make it work around childcare commitments for example? Surely recruiting more staff would still help, even if they are just working set hours rather than being added to existing complicated rotas (for less pay than those who are committed to the rota system or nobody would want to do that obviously)

Maybe they ought to start chasing the health tourists for the millions they owe.

Chase where exactly?

You do know we have reciprocal agreements with EU countries?

Need an ID card system, if you only want to treat UK citizens, then again if a tourist with no insurance is seriously injured/ill. would you leave them to die?