To ask if you'd be friends with me?

[3LeggedFlamingo]

Going out on a limb and putting myself up for a slating here, but in the effort to better understand people and how they react to me I've decided to ask here...

I have recently been diagnosed with ADHD. All my life I have struggled with not fitting in, feeling out of place in the world and battling depression due to underachieving in life. On the surface to other people I think I seemed to have my shit together, and I could cope alright except for keeping on top of my post, bills, emails, and things at work. Not things my friends would see though. Although I was always a hit socially awkward for fear of saying the wrong thing and looking stupid.

After I had my second child I think my brain just kind of fried itself. My ADHD symptoms got worse and I couldn't cope anymore. I had made a few parent friends from my first child's class, and a few of us were quite close. But I can tell for the past couple of years (seemed to align with the arrival of my second child and my ADHD symptoms worsening) that a couple of my closest friends are distancing themselves from me without any real understanding as to why from myself. I do understand that I can appear quite scatty and flakey and at times it might look like I don't care or I'm not listening, so....

AIBU by wondering if the below would a) put you off being friends with me and / or b) if I took the plunge and told you that I did hade ADHD would you be a little more understanding and accepting of why I am the way I am. Or have I already burnt those bridges?

Some of my ADHD traits / symptoms:

Forgetting to read / reply to texts for days / weeks. But when I finally do I always apologise for taking so long.

Forgetting names, faces, details of conversations. After 6 years, I still don't know the names of some of the children in my child's class or their parents even though I see them everyday. This can make conversations with friends difficult because I have to pretend I know who they're talking about

Constantly seeming a bit disorganised & forgetful

Being late more often than not

Forgetting birthdays / important dates like when they're off on holiday and where

I can't do small talk. I have no idea how to do this. Most friendships are superficial because I don't know how to take the friendship to the next level by talking about spouses, family details, life, etc. I just tend to talk about the same stuff like the weather, what are they did or are doing on the weekend. Inevitably I'll forget and ask the same thing the next time I see them.

Slow to talk / think during a conversation because I'm thinking about 1000 different things at the same time and over analysing what I'm saying. I can seem bored, tired and uninterested

My house is always a mess so I don't invite people over. It also never occurs to me to invite other children over for play dates.

Would this piss you off? Would you be a bit more understanding if you knew I had ADHD and couldn't really help by doing the above stuff?

I can't really change my brain and who I am. But I'd like to try and understand what annoys people and if there's something (anything I can do) to help make myself a little more relatable and better friends with my "friends" (all fairly superficial).

As someone recently diagnosed asd I've realised the only people who are genuine friends to me are also not NT. I don't think NT people like me at all. I see the way my non NT child is treated by teachers and other students and I can see my own experiences of being cut out, sidelined and directly bullied. I guess its the abelist fear that it's somehow catching or a primal response that they're just not registering because I'm not ticking the 'normal' box in their head on some level. (I've been told by gp etc my masking skills are very good, but I've now stopped all that effort, exhausting to constantly maintain an effort).

Agree with a PP in that you've listed a lot of negatives but what do you offer to the friendship? I have a wide circle of friends but we all offer something to each other, whether it is a shared hobby, joint interest etc. I meet a lot of 'pleasant' people - fine for meeting for a quick coffee - but they don't necessarily become friends unless you have something in common. It doesn't mean there's anything wrong with them, I fully appreciate that not everyone wants to be friends with me if they don't share my interests.

OP I also say to people if they have not heard back from me in x days that means I have gotten distracted due to my adhd so please feel free to remind me.
its very important you understand that you don’t need everyone to like you and be your friend. And that’s the same for neurotypical people. People with adhd do have some tricky traits but we also have some great friendship traits too - we understand how life can be tricky so we can be very empathetic and kind as friends
what you need is to attract people who like you for you and the only way you can do that is to be yourself. Tell people you have adhd and struggle with time keeping and remembering things. You will attract friends who can relate to you or have family with adhd and together you can all support each other.

OP, telling people about your ADHD will help them understand, but won't automatically make friendship easier. Think about what they get out of the friendship. What are your positive qualities? You haven't listed them, but I expect you have them. For example, what if you consider that your friends have deep issues of their own that they are at various stages of working through and masking to a greater or lesser extent? Would they feel comfortable talking to you, and would it make you like them more and want to spend more time with them, or less?

I think neuro "divergence" is a lot more common than many people realise, and only a small proportion of people ever get a diagnosis.
Many people are now putting names to things they've lived with for years. But its unrealistic to expect every potential friend to have professional-standard counselling skills and the patience of a saint. The "diagnosed" are wise to be cautious about what they share, and be alert to compassion fatigue in the people they share with.

I probably would assume you weren’t interested in building a friendship because you didn’t text back or remember anything about my life or invite me over. It sounds like you need some effective strategies in place to manage your condition better

This

As I said, it’s not a magic solution for most people with adhd. Of course it helps and it’s worth a try but if adhd could simply be overcome by setting a few phone reminders then there would be zero reasons to struggle with so many things.

If it works so well for you then I assume you no longer have any of the difficulties that people with adhd typically struggle with. I’m part of a local community of neurodiverse adults and I don’t know a single one whose issues are resolved simply by whacking a few reminders on a phone. I’m glad for you but for most people with adhd, it’s not a magic cure-all.

The reason is dopamine and the lack of focus. And also object permanence and difficulties with perception of time. Reminders can’t overcome those issues.

Tbh, the idea that adhd can be overcome by just setting a few reminders really trivialises it and perpetuates the idea that most people have that we’re lazy or just don’t try hard enough. That’s why it’s so important to explain that reminders aren’t sufficient for the vast majority of people with adhd to function efficiently. As I said though, if you’re the exception and it’s a cure all for you, then great.

No one is saying ADHD can just simply be overcome by setting few reminders Literally no one said that. It was said as one of the coping techniques to try to mitigate.

It's always like this with all these threads "have you tried x to mitigate a bit?"
"Omg you just cuuured me idiot"

The fact that i, and many others, have worked out how to set alarms on a smart phone doesn't mean I don't have any other issues like incredible procrastination, panic because the deadline is close, so go clean a house instead of course. That I can control my mouth and don't have addictive personality at all.

I've got ADD and I'm like you but my friends are also very similar. I also know I can come across self centred with those behaviours so I make a conscious effort to remember things to ask my friends who aren't like me and my main group of friends.

There's a podcast called ADHD AF (as females). Have a listen to it and see if it strikes a bell with you.

I have not been diagnosed with ADHD but I have scored very high in all online tests.

I am forgetful, very… but the trick is to find a way to issue yourself reminders of what you need to do every day. You need to try to reign over the chaos rather than asume there’s no way around it.

My house is full of lists, so is my phone and my online diary. Something that I have found very helpful is to deal with things that take minutes as they come, like replying to texts, tidying up my room, etc.

I deal with emails only 3 times a day, if I had the email beeping every time I get a message I would be sooo distracted I couldn’t do any work.

Talking of that… back to work

But that’s exactly my point.

On threads like this, people who don’t have adhd always suggest reminders and lists as if it’s a revolutionary idea that we’ve never tried.

The point I was making is that while it might mitigate somewhat, for the majority it’s not particularly effective.

Reminders can work if you’re able to drop everything and act on the reminder that very second. But if you’re in the middle of something else then the reminder will just get forgotten because adhd brain/lack of focus. Distraction/lack of focus/inability to act on it due to dopamine deficiency are all also reasons why reminders can be ineffective. And then there’s the skewed perception of time. I can set a reminder, then be on my way to do the task, get distracted and then completely forget about it. Example - I set the timer to beep on my oven and on my way to get the food out, I think I’ll just have a wee first. Then while I’m upstairs in the bathroom I notice my makeup bag and think it needs a sort out. An hour later I smell the food burning 😂🤦🏻‍♀️

I can get ready to go out, be actually ready and then take another hour to reach the front door because…..I don’t know. It’s not deliberate.

As I said originally, there are lots of reasons why reminders aren’t this cure-all that people think. Of course we use them. Of course. But they aren’t especially helpful in resolving most of the adhd dysfunction - it’s not a case of just setting reminders and solving all the issues as is ALWAYS suggested on these threads. That was my point. And suggesting that reminders solve lateness, forgetfulness or difficulties with replying/texting doesnt give others an accurate picture of what it’s really like.

Definitely not

All of those issues listed are what makes most friendships fail or not take off to begin with

Friendship is a two way street and it sounds like it wouldn’t be equal for those friends with you

You keep using the words "solve" and "cure". No one is suggesting the cure or solve the issues.
They help to mitigate and possibly improve to a point.
That's all people, including me, are saying.

Imho what also doesn't help is telling people there is no point using even slightly effective mitigation methods because they don't solve the issue.

I wouldn't be bothered by the being late or taking a while to reply (although if it was weeks rather than days I'd assume you weren't interested in a friendship). I can be forgetful and late myself so these things wouldn't bother me, nor would forgetting when I'm going on holiday or my birthday (unless I'd invited you somewhere for my birthday and then didn't show up, that would piss me off). I also wouldn't care about the state of your house as long as it was hygienic - clutter, things not put away, dust or a few dishes in the sink, fine. Manky toilet, dirt and stains etc, not fine.

The biggest thing that would prevent a friendship developing though would be the repetitive, surface level conversations. It wouldn't make me dislike you, but I would find our interactions boring if I'm being completely honest. If I knew you had ADHD and found this difficult, though, then I'd probably make more of an effort to move the conversation along to something else and try and gently encourage you to open up more. So no, in summary it wouldn't necessarily put me off if things could be worked around.

Honestly, I probably would not "be friends" with you. That's not to say I wouldnt be friendly with you though. Someone who doesnt respond for weeks, is late when they do get together, doesnt chat very much, forgets important details about me and my life. What would be the point. Maybe its just because you only listed the "negative" aspects about friendship with you though. What are the positives? I suppose if they outweighed the negatives then MAYBE I would. Again, just being honest here. Not trying to be mean, and would never treat you meanly, but would not really think of you as a friend based solely on what you have posted.

Hello! I would be friends with you - you sound quite similar to me (I’m autistic). I have similar worries about how others might perceive me but I’ve been lucky to find a handful of good, quirky, funny, non-judgemental people in life who understand and value things about me beyond housekeeping and prompt communication. Those are your people!! Be honest and kind, express genuine interest in others and be open about who you really are and what you’re really interested in - that’s a pretty good way to find the keepers!

Also: I’m pretty sure a lot of my “keeper” friends are neurodivergent in some way, diagnosed or not. We tend to find each other in the world 😁

I wouldn't care about the messy house or being generally a bit disorganized/forgetful.

But if you often didn't reply to me or didn't remember anything about me and my life from one conversation to the next, then I would tend to assume you didn't like me very much or want me as a friend. It would make a difference if you explained about the ADHD and its effects, but what would really make a difference is if you were able at the same time to say explicitly: I really like you, I'd really like to be friends, my forgetfulness doesn't mean I don't care, I'm like that with even the people I care about the most.

Otherwise, even with the ADHD information I wouldn't know what to think of you and your intentions. If I enjoyed your company I'd be more than happy to spend time with you if I bumped into you, or if you or someone else arranged a meet-up, but there would be a limit to how far I'd put myself out without some encouragement from your side. I'm afraid I need a bit of reassurance in order for me to keep on working on a friendship without feeling like a twit!

Are you on medication for ADHD? And have you had any CBT? I was diagnosed this year, and the medication combined with therapy really helps. There are ways to manage the condition, set reminders in your phone etc

Honestly if I didn't know you had adhd I wouldn't want to be friends with you . People being constantly late is one of my massive bug bears , it's like they feel that my time js so less valuable that's it's fine to keep me waiting for them in particular with kids . The rest of the stuff wouldn't bother me particularly but to be honest I'd assume based on what you said that you didn't want to be friends with me ie not replying to texts , not asking me for coffee back not remembering my kids name . I d probably assume you weren't interested enough.

Having said all that one of my closest friends has adhd and she arrives first to every meet up as she has so many knacks jn place to make sure she does . Notes everywhere . A policy of leaving 15 minutes earlier than she needs to. She definitely doesn't say this is who I am, suck it up.
I think you will struggle with friendships if you don't make any effort on your side . Ie jot down kids names jn a note book after meeting people etc.

It’s really hard OP. Two of my friends that I’ve known from school have lost parents in the last year. I was at their funerals but I just know that at some point, I’ll have a “and how’s your mother?” moment. It’s truly shit having so little working memory.

I zone out of conversations because sometimes the noise in my head is just louder. I mask in public, and I don’t really want to make new friends these days because it’s just exhausting to have to pretend to be normal, knowing at some point I’ll slip up and then have to deal with rejection.

What people don’t realise is that often we are already using all the hacks and tips and reminders. I had a reminder for a weekly standing appointment go off on my phone yesterday and I absent mindedly switched it off because I wasn’t present in the moment and just instinctively quenched an irritating noise.

I get on best with people who are also neurodivergent. So maybe you just haven’t found your tribe?

This for me as well.
I love routine, following rules and doing things the correct way. I couldn't be friends with someone who forgets everything, takes ages to reply and is late for things. The friendship would be too much hard work for little (?) gain.
Do you use your phone for reminders etc? I don't know much about ADHD so not sure if this works or not.

If I knew why you did these things it wouldn't put me off as such but I probably wouldn't bother much with you as I'd know I wouldn't get a quick reply so no point trying to organise to meet up.

I probably also wouldn't talk to you much beyond small talk because I'd know that you wouldn't remember details I'd told you before.

So we'd be friendly I guess but not 'friends' as such because the main parts of being a friend would be very one sided and its hard work being a good friend to someone when you get nothing back.

Of course I'd be friends with you. I've already got a few friends like this, I can be a bit like this! Also a SEN parent myself. I think being a kind person is the most important thing. You have a good understanding of where you might fall down at times ie : not answering texts etc. I'm a great believer in calendars and lists, specifically writing things down seems to be much more effective than setting reminders on my phone. I love a good notebook. That really helps concentrate my mind and reduces chaos. So little steps would be my advice, being mindful. I'm sure you're absolutely lovely and deserve good friends!

You could be me Op! Apart from the not replying to messages all of what you have said is absolutely me!