Feeling guilt at costing my parents £00000k

[Tead]

About 12 years my parents came into some money and were all set to buy a buy to let house until I talked them out of it. The are immigrants and so look to me to explain things - I know that sounds odd.
i thought it would be too much of a hassle for them as they were in their early 60s but I knew nothing of property.
they changed their minds and just left the money in the bank.
the house sold 3 months ago and I am racked with guilt over what I did. They would have made hundreds thousands on their purchase. It’s been 3 months and I keep waking up at night thinking about my stupidity. I haven’t told anyone about this not even my wife. I have felt close to tears many times. I know I cannot make it us to them. This just makes me feel like an even bigger loser. I haven’t spoken to them about this. I feel ashamed of myself just looking at them. They are financially ok but I feel like I’ve failed them

All the more reason for them not to have to listen.

Over time, property is likely to be a good investment. Leaving money sitting in the bank isn't. So your advice wasn't great, and yes, if you hadn't talked them out of it, they would likely have far more valuable assets now.

But no one's died. And in one sense, they haven't exactly lost anything although of course the money sitting in the bank won't be worth as much as it was 12 years ago, which underlines how important it is to seek proper financial advice. They could have invested their money securely and increased their funds in other ways even if they decided against property.

But as pp have said, they sound far less upset and bothered than you! And you're the one who's impacted more long term because presumably this is your inheritance

Op - I know someone who got an interest only mortgage for his house (did not speak good English and struggled to earn money). Now things are tough for the business and interest rates have risen, so is having to sell the house. He is lucky because the house has gone up in value - so it is possible for him to use the money to buy another house in a cheaper area outright.

but things could easily have gone wrong. If the value had not gone up so much, legal fees, cost of moving house and difficulty getting a mortgage now he is older may have caused problems. Also - the interest only mortgage meant that he had to repay the capital at the end of the term (but he hadn’t planned for this and would be stuck - he would probably have been better off on a repayment mortgage). I’m just saying that it’s a risk - you can make money, but also lose money.

Lots of people have thought for a long time that the housing market surely has to fall as housing costing 9 x average wage is not sustainable but it hasn't. People (e g. banks) are predicting falls of up to 30% now but who knows if it will come to pass. Someone might buy and experience negative equity or someone might wait and watch prices continue to rise. You never know which until after the event.

We bought in Sept 2007 just before prices did crash and it was over a decade for our house to get back to being worth it's purchase price (Cornwall).

I agree that you don't know if your parents would have had a run of terrible tenants trashing the place and not paying rent and sold up years ago. You don't know that it would have worked out for them.

I don't think you could gave in good conscience simply recommended your parents to buy. Prices might have fallen. Tenants might have been terrible. Legislation might have been punishing (it has been for some higher rate tax payers with mortgages).

I think the best you can do in similar circumstances (big decisions) is draw up a list of pros and cons of the potential risks and benefits and let the person decide what to do based on their appetite for risk.

Re investing in the stock market - my sons child trust fund has been invested and added to since he was born in 2009 and is barely worth any more than the cash value invested. There have been times in the last couple of years it was worth less than the cash invested. There have been good and bad years and not helped by a fee that is higher than some at 1.5%. You live and learn but the fact still doesn't tell me whether stocks will outperform cash in the next 10 years or not. No one has a crystal ball.

Be kind to yourself. You tried to protect your parents from potential risks when the benefits were unknown.

Someone else could read your thread and encourage their parents to invest in buy to let that loses money over the next decade. Hindsight is 20:20.

DH family did and they ended up with the most godawful tenants who caused ten of thousands of damage and they lost money overall. Your parents could have equally ended up in a legal battle or dealing with a host of issues all the time (washing machine clapped out, boiler not working properly, damp).

Don’t feel bad, you gave advice on the basis of the information and judgement you had then. I’m sure you gave them advice with their best interests at heart. They didn’t have to listen to you. As a parent I wouldn’t hold it against DD.

I can see why you'd feel this way, but your intensions were well meaning at the time. Life is one big lesson, as long as you learn and grow from perceived mistakes, they're not wasted. To put it in perspective, although I know the idea of losing money makes you feel bad, your parents won't look back on their lives and focus on what money they did or didn't make. It sounds like you're a caring and loving towards them, that's what they'll really treasure.

Not everyone is cut out to be a landlord. It’s not easy money unless you’re really sleazy, house people in terrible conditions , don’t do repairs, cut corners on safety. I take it that’s not your parents.
The flip side is landlords who are gullible, not on the ball can lose £0000s. Tenants can stop paying rent, trash the house, sublet it. You only have to watch Channel 5 to see landlords who’ve paid out £0000s to get their property back, then more to repair it.
Fair landlords = Fair tenants but it takes work, responsibilities have to be taken seriously.
Maybe you saved your DP hard work and heart break.

Unless you had a crystal ball then no need to feel guilty.

they are in their late 60s now.
they aren’t as bothered as I am I guess. I just feel it was the wrong decision that I made. I should have kept my beak out.

If a family member that you trusted and who purported to know more than you insisted that you were making a bad decision in a situation where that family member is supposed to be informed, would you really just ignore them? OP clearly didn't have a single clue about the unsolicited advice they were giving and were clearly giving bad advice (with or without hindsight).

The parents weren't forced to listen but it was reasonable for them to trust OP given the circumstances. The advice OP gave was unreasonably stupid and giving unsolicited advice when you have no idea what you're talking about is unreasonable too. OP was unreasonable on two counts.

I agree they could’ve hand nightmare tenants.
About that time there were change to the landlords - keeping properties I better conditions (which is fair) the expectation of immediate repairs, etc There were also a lot or TV programs about tenants rights as the government hadn’t forward planned the increase in demand for council properties. Tenants waiting to be evicted, as it was their only hope of getting council accommodation and refusing to pay rent, landlords having to pay thousands in legal fees court costs and bailiff costs. It taking over a year to get tenants out. It’s hasn’t always been plain sailing.

Then there’s clearing fees repairs etc on top of that

Look it up - every bad tenants could’ve cost them a lot of time energy and stress.

Being a landlord is hard and getting harder.

I think you gave them decent advice and have avoided a lot of stress for them.

There are other investments to be made.

When I ask family or friends for advice I know I am getting the opinion of a well-intentioned amateur and not an expert. I am sure they value your advice but they do also know that you are not an investment expert. You gave them your honest opinion and they do have to shoulder some responsibility too. As pp have said, renting a house is not plain sailing and they may well have struggled with aspects of it.

We are landlords and people tried to talk us out of it when we were thinking of starting saying it would be too much hassle etc. We went ahead anyway just like your parents could have done.
Ywnbu to give your opinion at all.
It is a business and not that passive sometimes. One of our tenants have just left and left it dirty and a bit of rubbish behind but 99% of tenants are lovely. Our next two weekends will be spent cleaning, gardening, decorating, having carpets cleaned etc.
And lesson learned that a lot of money left in a savings account is not the greatest investment. What happens with that money is it gets lent out to buy to let investors who make money on property. Perhaps you could do it one day?

I’m having CBT for this sort of thinking. It’s unhelpful rumination.

Advice is not an instruction.

Your parents could have chosen to take legal advice and even asked for an internet or if English isn't their first language to understand better what the choices were.

They decided the,selves to listen to you. That was their choice.

Nobody has a crystal ball. Investing in property is highly speculative. They could equally have lost a lot of money.

Don't forget it's not pure profit. There would have been renovation/upkeep costs, possible agency fees, unpaid rent if there were any tenancy gaps and capital gains to pay. And that's if it all goes smoothly.

Whats done is done

I didn't know how to vote. You're unreasonable to feel guilty. In other words, what you did was fine.

As pps have said, being a landlord is expensive, stressful and time-consuming. Then there's CGT when you sell. You may have helped them dodge a bullet!

That's what a letting agency is for, your parents could have used one to manage the property.

Also, YABU to decide that because your parents are immigrants they wouldn't understand the property market. That's not your decision to make.

You're probably feeling bad because the extra £££ might have been part of your future inheritance. You're now feeling sorry for yourself in missing out on your dps making extra ££.

They’re adults, ultimately it’s they’re responsibility.

You did let them down though by putting yourself in an “expert” position when you say you don’t know about property. You should have put your own ego aside and said: I don’t know. Learn from that.

As a pp said, nobody has a crystal ball.

In 2011 my then 8yo wanted to put his total savings of £500 in to Bitcoin.
Who lets an 8yo put all their money into an imaginary currency???
It would have been worth millions!

Honestly OP you did what you thought was in their best interests and as many have said you could well have been right and it could have been an absolute nightmare. Especially with potential cultural misunderstandings or language barrier if they’re immigrants. One of my good friends is the eldest son of Indian migrants and he feels such responsibility for them. You sound like a good man, trying to look after his parents. Maybe your guilt is that you feel like you used your influence too strongly. Maybe another time you can help them make a decision for themselves, with a bit of external advice too

Slightly different view here, about 8 yrs ago and a few times before prices hiked, I asked my Dad if we consider buying a property and I permanently rent from him ( I had to leave my home after divorce with nothing from it, at time, there wasnt much to be gained from it, Ex Dh still owns it and its worth an extra 110k now!) my father has always said he would never buy another property.
He wouldve easily made 150k now, had he bought all those years ago , However I would've felt guilt knowing he couldnt sell as I would've been in it.

Also, a relative of mine went through 18months of stress and cost due to bad tenants- court fees to evict and then 10k on work in house- the whole flooring, inc new beams had to be replaced as the dirty twats were peeing on the floor in each of the 3x bedrooms, new kitchen needed ect too!

I wouldnt feel guilt ,ultimately it was your parents choice not to invest in property

You couldn't have possibly predicted the property market. They would've also had to be landlords and believe me it's very stressful and sometimes not even worth it. The responsibility of being the one they turn to for advice can be really heavy and this is part of it.

I can tell, you love them very much and I'm sure they do too but when it comes to money sometimes you win sometimes you lose.