To think that something has to be done about the immigration crisis?

[JudesBiggestFan]

But I don't know what? More than 900 people landed in Dover today, as I discovered when reading about the terrible petrol bomb attack on a detention centre. Detention centres overcrowded, more than 7 million pounds a day being spent on hotel rooms for illegal immigrants, horrendously slow processing of applications...people drowning in the channel and local people feeling angry and frustrated because of the strain on services. Not to mention the mental health toll on people living their lives in limbo! So what is the answer? Because I just don't know anymore but it feels like the system has completely broken down.

This. Go down to dover. See for yourself. Drive along the A20. It’s young men 90% of the time.

@Museya15 Theres nothing racist about stating facts, you’re right, but what you’re stating isn’t facts. I understand this is an emotive topic, but saying they’re “all” economic migrants is not only untrue, it shuts down any possibility of discussion and solutions. You don’t want solutions?

Over 75% of asylum claims are accepted, so either the home office is a somehow packed full of virtue signalling do-gooders somehow existing under a very right wing Home Secretary, or they’re all incompetent beyond belief, or they’re doing this on purpose.

Any one of those is a good reason to get rid of the current government, as they’re failing to deal with it. Why is your anger directed at asylum seekers who can’t decide government policy, and not at the government who’ve caused this mess?

@IneedanewTV Why is it young men though? You’re not wrong, I’m just asking if you understand the reasons.

Do you expect women and children to make the journey across countries, facing the risk of sexual exploitation and trafficking that is widespread along that route? Sleeping outside overnight in freezing conditions? Risking hypothermia, petrol burns and death on a boat crossing? That’s what you’re expecting when you complain that it’s “all men”. None of that is meant to be emotive by the way, it’s just the cold hard facts of the journeys people are making.

@Discovereads - this has very different figures. worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/refugees-by-country
And I understand population density.

According to social media today in Kent.

“The number of migrants who have crossed the Channel so far this year in small boats has almost reached 40,000. A further 468 people made the journey yesterday in eight boats. It brings the total for 2022 to 39,898 people.”

this could be true it could be false. But that is what we are reading here.

It's ok, once we Get Brexit Done we can sort out immigration.

Right?

Right??

I’m not complaining. But I wouldn’t leave my mother, sisters daughters if i was fleeing from a very dangerous situation. I would find alternatives routes with them or I would stay with them. That is my question. Why all young men?

Some insults being thrown around!

I think the real bigots are the people who always try to close these discussions down. OP's concerns are reasonable - and as a pp has said, try walking in the shoes of those on the front line in this difficult situation.

We need to be able to discuss it calmly and rationally - but will it be allowed?

Braverman will soon be fired, be curious to see how a new Home Secretary squares low immigration with the government's otherwise 'high economic growth' strategy.

Many requests for safe legal routes but no takers on these direct questions?

In terms of the op I’m not sure people have a solution

@IneedanewTV A mix of cultural differences and what’s causing people to leave makes a difference here. In some cases, young men are targeted/persecuted whereas women are “safer”, so the family will use all their money to “save” the person they most feel is at risk. They can often not afford to save more than one person.

Young men may not have families (children and wives) as they are still young. The older generation are much less likely to leave their homeland.

Many (80-something% of all refugees) do stay with their families, in refugee camps close to their home country.

Can I ask though, for those who think they’re all economic migrants, why they would risk a boat crossing with a non-zero chance of death or imprisonment, just for a bit of extra cash? Legal routes for seasonal work and immigration exist.

Well housing's easy: build more houses. Something they should be doing to calm the housing crisis anyway. But they won't, because of course for many voters having a lot of wealth tied up in property is the opposite of a crisis.

@MarshaBradyo What do you want to hear? I know I’ve answered a similar question for you a previous thread and can see people have answered you here. Do you want absolute, exact numbers, and do you understand why that’s not possible?

I’ve told you before that legal routes/resettlement schemes allow the govt to cap numbers,
meaning lower numbers than we currently have. But that doesn’t seem good enough for you either. Short of taking over the government, no one can provide you with exact numbers. So what do you want to hear?

SleeplessInEngland Have you not been out and about recently? New houses are being built on almost every piece of spare land, certainly around here anyway.

There are a few of us asking. And no I haven’t seen many posts answering people just go on about ‘brown’ people, building houses and racism. It’s all nonsense unconnected to the realities of the scale.

So there is a cap then.. actually only one person has said that on this thread, that anyone is so sure of themselves they answer a question once somewhere else and everyone remembers their numerous posts and there’s no more discussion takes real confidence, but anyway.

So finally the answer is there will be a cap.

Fine. I’m sure the public would work better with say we choose x amount per day from applications. You’d have to have some criteria to select the few from the many though.

You will never convince me otherwise, I worked in immigration, you have no idea what the reality is.

New houses are being built on almost every piece of spare land

I'm sure you don't need me to tell you that's absolute bollocks, but I suppose it depends on what your definition of 'spare' is. Even tory ministers now admit planning laws are needlessly strict - though funnily enough they never seem to find the time to relax them.

To flesh out some answers to @MarshaBradyo ’s actually very sensible questions now that I’ve got over the heartbreak of being so forgettable 😁

Q - what are the numbers?
This would depend on levels of legal immigration, and the economic state of the country as to what support it could afford. Absolutely no one can answer this question right now, except to restate that legal, safe routes allows for offshore vetting (safer), for families to travel together and a cap on numbers - as long as the govt also worked against illegal trafficking groups. The cap would work on set criteria, and would account for the fact that some people will have no choice but to enter by irregular means.

Q - how will we house them?
resettlement schemes allow groups to be spread across the country so the burden of housing isn’t concentrated on one area. Housing reform so housing is actually affordable (to rent and to buy) which reduces the burden on social housing, and makes sure that British people are housed as a priority. 3 housing estates have been built in my town in the last two years. 500 houses, 20 of them social housing. Not a single house priced below £350,00. Avg 3 bed family house £1100 pcm. How will they afford housing? See below.

Q - how will they initially be supported?
Asylum claims should be resolved within 16 weeks. So 16 weeks of £40 a week, (as opposed to the 2 yr+ that’s happening now). That would free up millions in hotel costs alone. Then if the claim is accepted, the person is free to work and pay their own way, renting some of the affordable (currently non-existent) housing. If you wanted a more hardcore system, reduce the amount of benefits they could claim. Legal non-eu immigrants have no recourse to public funds, for eg.

Some people might think my ideas are a pie in the sky load of crap. But at least I’m trying. Because the current solution of “shove everyone in one corner of England pushing communities to the brink, while spreading diphtheria and scabies in processing centres” doesn’t seem to be working, does it? Please don’t expect me to produce a fully costed plan while the govt gets away with wasting billions of taxpayers money.

SleeplessInEngland I live in a fairly rural area and there is house building going on all around here, pokey little boxes with hardly any garden so they can fit in as many as possible. Maybe you will think there are enough houses when we have no fields left for food growth, no parks or open spaces?

@Museya15 and I work directly with asylum seekers, and pre-kids, worked with an NGO in a refugee camp abroad. I see that reality. You will never convince me otherwise.

The border control need to control the borders properly.stop the illegal immigrants getting into the boats in the first place because they know they won't be allowed in :save lives.
The local hotels have been given over to illegals,they have stripped them and sold everything.Staff lost their jobs.
Crime and intimidation has increased but nobody will dare say anything because they are afraid of being called racist.
Nobody wants anyone to sink in the sea fleeing desperate wars .
Those willing to work and contribute are welcome,but criminals,system abusers,are coming in by the thousands and nobody will stop them.adults pretending to be children,major criminals using identity papers of unknowns,when will it stop?probably when there is an uprising against it which none of us want.
We should welcome those in real need of asylum and encourage education leading to jobs,careers and happy settled lives and reject those coming in for purposes of crime,free healthcare and housing .
Yes I will get flamed but how many of those doing the flaming would want it right on their own doorsteps?

what are the numbers?
how will we house them?
how will they initially be supported?

I don't have the answers @MarshaBradyo , but would love to know what has changed that means 300 people crossed by boat in 2018 and another poster has mentioned 40,000 crossing in 2022 ?
Have all the passport counterfieters died, been inprisoned or turned over a new leaf, if thats how everyone was entering the UK prior to that time ?

@KarmaStar ’s post here is a perfect example of what happens when the govt lets boats crossing rise out of control, and shoves the majority of the burden of dealing with that on the south east.

My instinct is to counter some of the more extreme points but I won’t, because this is how people are feeling and it’s the lie that the govt have sold them. And in some cases there are criminals/system abusers, which is why the govt’s system of shutting down legal routes and increasing boat crossings doesn’t work. Look what it’s doing to people (in terms of affecting their communities/causing stress, and increasing the risk of radicalisation.)

I only hope that if there’s an uprising, it’s against the government and their policies that are causing this, not against asylum seekers where innocent people could be hurt and killed.

True the number is going up - what’s going on? Is it the outcome of an increasingly unstable global situation - and all countries are going to need solutions to. Those that can anyway.

Aus had similar increases but their solution was huge deterrent more than anything. Other countries are becoming more hard line with votes swinging in that direction

My niece and her partner moved in with BIL and SIL when she fell pregnant. They are still there and her little girl started school this year. The last 6 available housing association houses have gone to immigrants/asylum seekers/Ukranians. It doesn't matter what colour they are it's the resentment that people who are new to the country get priority over those born here. They are all squashed into a 2 bedroom bungalow but still get no priority.

Meanwhile where I live in the South West you can't move for building sites full of flats and tiny houses. Driving into town used to take 20 minutes. I had to go in for a medical appointment last Friday and it took 45 minutes, and no there is no bus service.