To think not everything is ‘misogyny’

[Cuppasoupmonster]

… and that the word is massively overused on here?

I’m getting quite tired of it if I’m honest, it feels like every other conversation the ‘misogyny’ card is whipped out and anyone who disagrees has ‘internalised misogyny’ (um no I just have a different opinion).

It’s becoming the ‘BeKind’ of feminism. Overused to the point it’s getting meaningless and irritating, and just used to ‘win’ any kind of nuanced topic without any proper discussion.

AIBU? 🤷🏼‍♀️

Why is "strong female role modela" MN code for "women who embrace my particular brand of feminism"?

And @SlickShady continually using the anti Semitism experienced by Jewish people in an effort to point score isn't the gotcha you think it is. It's really distasteful.

I disagree on the distasteful part. And I'm not going for the gotcha. All I'm saying is that if you instinctively reject a ridiculous statement because you understand how fallacious it is, you should likewise reject it when the argument is the same only with a different villain.

Nope. Still wrong. I'm pointing out that the arguments are exactly the same just with different villains, but both are equally ridiculous.

If you find it easy to understand that just because some top bankers might be Jewish it doesn't mean 'Jews control the world', you should have no trouble with understanding that just because some top CEOs are men that doesn't mean 'men control the world'.

Villains? Bloody hell.

Still banging the horrible Jewish comparison there.

Women discussing their oppression in a patriarchal society is NOTHING like antisemites seeking to present a marginalised religious and ethnic group the way you outline.

I get the point you're making. You're saying if you understand 0.1% of x doesn't equal y, you should understand 0.1% of z doesn't equal y either. People are getting distracted by the groups used but the logic is sound.

@SlickShady

How about this:

As a sex class, males have a hugely disproportionate percentage of power and influence globally in comparison to females.

Is that any better? It's factual in that the global population is roughly 50/50 and the very specific positions of power and influence are overwhelming held by males.

If you don't believe the patriarchy exists you're either unable or unwilling to listen to women.

Which women? All of them? At once or one by one?

I'm able and willing to listen to an argument irrespective of who presents it.

If you have daughters I hope they have strong female role models in their lives.

Overrated. My daughters are strong because I teach them how to be strong. They are assertive and take no shit from anyone because that's what their father taught them.
(My feeling, which I absolutely can't prove nor do I have evidence for, is that most strong women are that way because of their fathers.)

Listen to women makes me laugh, because they soon tell us to stfu if we date opinions they don't like..they mean listen to women who agree with me...

It might be a true statistic but it doesn't in any way tell you anything about men in general. Certainly not about the average man on the street.

Overrated. My daughters are strong because I teach them how to be strong. They are assertive and take no shit from anyone because that's what their father taught them. (My feeling, which I absolutely can't prove nor do I have evidence for, is that most strong women are that way because of their fathers.)

If their mum is in their lives then I hope she gets some credit for your daughters being strong too?

At least you acknowledge it's a feeling you have no evidence for I suppose so that's refreshing.

This is the problem, people take a statistical, divorce it from all context and nuance, and apply it to random individuals. People don't fit into boxes that way and idk why others don't get that.

It might be a true statistic but it doesn't in any way tell you anything about men in general. Certainly not about the average man on the street
And after all of that we're back at NAMALT.

@SlickShady

It might be a true statistic but it doesn't in any way tell you anything about men in general. Certainly not about the average man on the street.

I'm glad you can understand it's a true statistic.

Nobody has said it's about the average man in the street. Nobody has said Dave from down the road must be minted and powerful because he has a penis.

Do you really not accept the fact that because statistically men overwhelmingly hold the positions of power and influence globally, there is a systemic lack of representation of and support for the needs of women globally?

Mum's in their lives, but she's far more accommodating and a bit of a pushover (classic stereotypical female traits). They get many good traits from their mother, but their assertiveness is purely from dad.

Amazing, isn't it? Talking about disproportionate sex representation when it comes to world leaders, policy makers, FTSE 100 CEOs etc and still being told NAMALT... when nobody has said they are!

Irrelevant. I'm talking about the argument's used to prove a point. Anti-semites use a specific argument to claim they're being oppressed by the 'Jew-archy', and some women use the exact same argument to claim they're being oppressed by the patriarchy. If it's nonsensical in the first case why do you think it works in the latter?
You just happen to pick a marginalised ethnic and religious group who have had appalling atrocities committed against them to try and argue that women discussing patriarchy are unreasonable, whilst trying to place the dominant group (men) in the place of an oppressed group who are still enduring oppression?

To be honest the abortion rate is as it is due ti misogyny. If women were always allowed access to contraceptives, not coerced into abusive relationships, not forced by society/shame to make choices that are difficult, not abandoned by their partners

No we're not. But if you didn't get it till now there's no point in repeating it.

Posted too early burt you get my point. Ridiculous to suggest every part of every woman's life isn't affected by misogyny and yes that is hatred, not just prejudice.

@SlickShady

Mum's in their lives, but she's far more accommodating and a bit of a pushover (classic stereotypical female traits).

Oh you're on a wind up after all. Or you really do think so little of women. Or you're an incel. Or all of the above!

I'm assuming @AMorningstar this is something you don't agree with, surely...

Hey Slick at least on this thread you've met some of us nasty women who aren't accommodating or pushovers, eh?

If your daughter started seeing a boy and he said in front of you that he thinks most women are pushovers, wouldn't you think he was a twat?

Do you really not accept the fact that because statistically men overwhelmingly hold the positions of power and influence globally, there is a systemic lack of representation of and support for the needs of women globally?

No. Because those who hold the positions of power are such a tiny percentage of humanity in general, it's irrelevant what they have between their legs. You can't extrapolate from that tiny minority nor does the makeup of that group have any overarching influence on how the rest of society operates.

I think a lot of women are not assertive but I don't think it's all. Statistically though I'd say fewer women are assertive probably.

Oh you're on a wind up after all. Or you really do think so little of women. Or you're an incel. Or all of the above!

No wind up. I think highly of some women and very little of others - I judge them on their character and their gender is irrelevant. Thankfully I'm a full-fledged non-cel.

Hey Slick at least on this thread you've met some of us nasty women who aren't accommodating or pushovers, eh?

I'm not sure why you conflate nasty with assertive. Perhaps that's something you might wish to meditate upon.

If your daughter started seeing a boy and he said in front of you that he thinks most women are pushovers, wouldn't you think he was a twat?

No. He'd just be describing a general female trait. Just as you can say for example most men are aggressive. True for many, not for all.