Young men who get stuck doing nothing...

[Bunny890]

My younger brother is living at home with my parents and I know several other young men who also get 'stuck' at home - endlessly online, alienate friends, not able to even look for employment or engage with healthcare. I realise that there is a mental health element to this, but I can't help but feel frustrated - Mu

Exactly this!
lots of excuses of MH and ND and all sorts of crap
the problem with modern society and this generation is excuses for every laziness and entitlement.

these men are just lazy plus a huge part is parenting fail.
if this child was never encouraged to be responsible and hardworking, he won’t suddenly have that skill after turning 18.

The brother in this case probably hasn't had hundreds of interviews.

When he is not withdrawn he is violent. There is no mention of any meaningful contribution to the running of the home.

The fact that the mother has felt it necessary to give up her job to take care of him is a strong indication that yes, he has been treated like a child by her for many years, with nothing expected of him and no consequences imposed for behaviour that frankly sounds completely unacceptable.

If a young man has had hundreds of interviews but no offers, has he learned why? Has he approached interview #87 with the same preparation and the same manner as Interview #3?

It is not true that young men have no value. We need cleaners, carers, shop workers and admin staff. These can be men too. Lots of men from non-British origin backgrounds work in these jobs, but a lot of people think they are too good for them. Women, young girls, tend to see these type of things as jobs they can do, even if they don't like them, and they offer social opportunities, camaraderie, some type of life. Lots of young men have the inexplicable view these jobs aren't for them or they are too good for them, and that's perpetuated by their parents who financially support them instead of encouraging them to go into some great areas of work (they may not be high paying but there are a lot of social benefits as well as satisfaction in working for money out of the home).

It must be very upsetting not to be at the top of the social tree all the time, and do less status oriented jobs, but by and large women have had to suck that up.

This is such an important issue. Is part of the answer in the wider problem description. Your mum has left her job to look after an adult son at home. Is there perhaps an issue with dependency?

Anecdotally, I noticed from my dating that men who weren’t raised as boys to be reasonably self sufficient were always the ones who had unreasonable expectations. Basically, they were looking for someone to continue mothering them - doing their washing and cooking - rather than a partner. I do wonder if young men would fare better transitioning through to adulthood if we invested more in developing their life skills during adolescence.

With his increasingly violent behaviour, social media has been devastating for the behaviour of young men.

I don’t know what to suggest other than it really matters who we surround ourselves with. If any relatable positive role models are available to him to show him a different path that might be a step forward. Perhaps there’s a local men’s group he could join? Lots of them are springing up although some are dodgy so it needs a bit of due diligence first.

Good luck with it. I’m rooting for him!

Thought there was nonstop pressure on.Japanese kids growing up. I was a bit like that at one time.

Sorry if I have missed the name but I can't seem to see the name for the channel on this thread?

This has happened to someone we know. Absolutely heartbreaking so placemarking also.

He wanted to get into a fairly selective and reputable occupation (think police) as various other family members had chosen that path. Tried and tried, and got in on about the third attempt. Did no other paid work as a young man however as he was 'holding out' for his 'destiny' (enabled by family). Majorly messed up though - several serious disciplinary issues later he was out.

He has spent the last 10+ years living with his mother on and off and basically terrorising her. He has picked up serious mental health issues and a serious drug habit along the way. He has worked for and lived with various other family members who have genuinely 'helped him out' and messed up every single time.

He is back living with his mother. She won't give him a timescale to move out as 'what would he do'? She should have done it years and years ago - and probably he can't function independently now anyway. Interestingly no gaming apparently involved.

BUT - and here's the but - she won't let him rent somewhere (dead money), flat share (ditto), move anywhere (how would he cope?), do any sort of menial work (he was in the Police! He wouldn't want to stack shelves or push trolleys! It'd hardly be worth his while by the time he's paid to travel to work!). He's actually very amenable to 'bumbling on' with a very low standard of living - doesn't care for new clothes, any nice things at all, hardly even personal hygiene - and has basically become (pathologically?) avoidant of life.

Complete 'failure to launch' and he is in the process of taking his mother down with him who is a nervous wreck - as he often comes in drunk / high / aggressive. I can't see him ever getting into a relationship as he has so much baggage. So sad.

I know a female like this. Worked for a short time in her early twenties, now in her 40s and totally financially enabled by her parents to have withdrawn from society. They have bought her a house, pay all bills etc. I don’t think she has been outside for more that 20 years other than doctors appointments. Seems to sleep a lot all day, no idea what else she does with her time.

He sounds to have a mental health issue. Somehow help need to be obtained, though I know its difficult.

Some interesting points from pp:

Older males in past times living with relative and having simple jobs - I know many as my father was an engineer and the club's/hobbies he went to attracted these types. They tended to remain single, living with relative or in council flats. Some were hoarders. Most were socially awkward. Had the internet and gaming existed I'm sure they would have been similar to modern day failure to launch. Many would have undiagnosed asd I imagine.

Comments about the much needed transition stage in the teens gradually taking on responsibilty- totally agree. My kids are younger but I work with teens and I can see this. I can see it in younger kids too. Some have unlimited access to screens with very little parental supervision. Adult free / risk taking play with other kids is limited. We seem to baby/spoonfeed teenagers and make the goal passing exams/ getting to university rather than growing intelligent/ critical/ motivated adults and wander why they struggle in the ever harsher/ more competitive world of work.

Girl/women can be like this too. Sometimes it takes an extremely bad situation for the person to realise they want better in life

exactly this. Certainly from what I’ve seen, the expectations for girls is very different in these families, the boy is often the golden child who gets away with much more compared to the other siblings. Also it’s more acceptable in society for a man to be a slob compared to a woman, she needs to be doing it all, and very well. Women also know the hard life ahead of them so work towards it accordingly and the men know it’s a man’s world and they can get away with what they like as long as someone else is paying the bills. Yes it happens to girls too but not at all common. So I’m afraid I can’t feel sorry for them knowing that their sisters have had to earn their keep in life and seem to manage doing far much more in often more toxic and abusive set ups, not to mention their masking of their mental health issues.

I have seen this happen many times and it’s not a new thing, my brother was similar, didn’t work for years, shut himself in his room most of the day then when he eventually went out he got involved in drugs, he lived at home for quite a while until he met his partner, he now has dc and is a totally different person. My mum was very soft on him, cooked, cleaned and drove him around, lent him large amounts of money which needed up losing her the roof over her head.

Im sure it does happen to girls too but it seems more common with boys and I do think a lot is down to parenting and parents doing too much for their sons.

Yep my 37 yo brother lives with my mum. I would say smoking pot is the biggest contributor to the can't-be-arsed-to-adultitis. Mixed in with no real need to work or live independently as there is always a home with Mummy.

My sister also doesn't work but has found a man to sponge off, luckily for Mum. Also pot.

..."some other solo hobby"... 😂

A lot of young men just don't see the point to anything, especially after lockdowns.

It's an existential crisis.

Hi Andrew.

Now fuck off.

We have a 37 year old in the family, too. Weed is definitely a huge problem. Dreading to think what will happen when his parents die.

From my group of old school friends (we're all now in our 30s), all of the women are successful professionals with good jobs, relationships etc. Most are now getting on the property ladder, are engaged/married, are becoming parents.

At least half of the 'men' (I typed boys first because honestly they are still boys) are at home with their parents working dead end jobs, some part time, smoking weed and gaming into the early hours. They're all single and make no attempt to meet anyone. Their lives are so depressing. They can't even be bothered to RSVP to events they're invited to.

It's a thing 😬 They all had pushy middle class parents, and were simultaneously babied and given no responsibility growing up.

I think part of it is that gaming all night means they don’t have the discipline to get up at 7am (or earlier!) everyday to go to work. Also, they only qualify for entry-level jobs but feel entitled to much higher wages, or ‘it’s not worth the effort’.

My TIM "SIL" is like this, early 20s dropped out of uni transitioned now has too much anxiety to get a job (tbh seems much worse since transition). Nocturnal, games a lot, lives with mum. Not sure what the long term plan is

We have had this with one of our sons. Lockdown completely exacerbated it. He spent all of this time gaming as there was nothing else to do, his room was disgusting and he was belligerent and rude to the rest of us. He dropped out of uni as It was all virtual so he didn't see the point in us spending the money (and it meant he couldn't stay up all night gaming with his "Friends"). He had endless political and social opinions that ultimately always seemed to be excuses why he couldn't do anything else.

In the end, we pulled the rug out from under him. It sounds brutal but I decided that I had to treat the suicide threats as just that, threats, because he refused treatment and refused to see a counselor as he "didn't see the point". We were lucky that we could financially take a hit so we found him a flat, paid the deposit and the first 4 months rent. Told him if he wanted to go back to Uni, we'd keep paying the full rent. If he didn't (and he didn't), he needed to find a job or alternative and we would only help financially if he was actively trying to stand on his own two feet.

He's now what I privately think of as a work in progress. He has a full time job and, although he doesn't earn enough to fully cover the rent, as long as he keeps at it, we happily make the difference. He stands taller, he laughs more, he's clean(!), he socializes outside of the gaming world again. He comes home for dinner once a week (that's all on him, I would not be offended in the slightest if he didn't). I am so incredibly proud of him and, although he still has a way to go before he's a fully independent adult, he is 10000% closer to it now than he was a year ago.

And yes, I blame myself for him ending up there in the first place and I cannot remember how many nights I lay awake terrified that one day, he'd prove his threats weren't just manipulation but true. I love that kid with all of my heart, even when he was an absolute arsehole. I do think the gaming community has a part to play as there is this huge global community of particularly young men who feel exactly the same as my son did and they, I dunno, egg each other on is the wrong phrase. Maybe just validate each other that their lives are not their faults and the whole world is against them improving them. And then that just becomes their truth.

Well, THAT was quite a ramble!