To think it's not normal for over 35% of teachers to have cried at work this term?

[Postapocalypticcowgirl]

Whenever we talk about teacher working conditions, teacher strikes etc on here people always point out that lots of others have really stressful jobs. But this can't be normal in any job, surely? It's not even people who've cried about work- just people who've cried at work.

I think this is really indicative of the stress a lot of teachers are under, and the real reason a strike is on the cards. But it's hard to strike about workload/stress/behaviour/parental and SLT expectations- whereas striking over pay is legally straightforward.

I am not surprised that they do. Not only the pressure of performing and having lack of resources or time, but the teenager are often hideous to teachers. I've seen teachers run out of the room crying because they were mercilessly bullied by the students.

Should it be happening? No. Not regularly. We can all have a cry at work sometimes but if its a common occurrence then that is a problem. The NHS is also rife with criers (that isn't an insult btw, I do it a fair amount myself!) I think alot of it has to do with moral injury - not being able to do what you need to for your student, patient, client etc.

I take it you don't work in education? No there is no evidence because it is more of a stereotype of the horrific working practices of big chain academics. I used to work for a Harris.

Yes that's an alarming figure.

However, I agree with others that teachers seem to talk a lot about their industry alone and a lot of teachers have gone straight into that profession without working in any other job so don't have a grasp of reality of what other jobs entail.

I work in construction. The industry with one of the highest suicide rates. I've had to witness somebody commit suicide AT MY WORK. I've also had to witness somebody die at my work. I am under enormous pressure to hit deadlines, I work from 7am-6pm most days. I have been called every name under the sun at work, the air is turned blue during heated debates, I've been in meetings where people have had things thrown at them across desks.

On a daily basis I not only have to deal with my directors and employees, but third parties who are condescending and obnoxious and think they are superior. I also have to deal with clients - people buying properties, some of whom are millionaires, some even royalty. They expect the best. They send their staff over to the country to inspect the properties. They expect the impossible and highest of standards.

During covid we had to continue to work at projects, didn't get the luxury of working from home. The government insisted we carried on working as we contribute the biggest % to GDP. However we weren't given the honour of being labelled "priority workers" so didn't have the benefits that everybody else who was was entitled to.

So please don't patronise with the "teachers have it worst" agenda. No, we might not all have to deal with children and family struggles but we have a hell of a lot of other pressures and struggles that you won't have to deal with in your job.

Before working in construction I worked in admin roles, I worked in restaurants and shops and also customer service roles and they were all equally horrific. From staying an hour behind at the shop to pick up Xmas sales items that customers had left purposely on the floor that had created a 4ft heap left for me to tidy. To customers throwing food and clicking their fingers at me in the restaurant. Every job has its shit.

Be thankful you've never had to see loss of life at your workplace, I wouldn't wish that on anybody.

I must have missed the memo, what's the perception of teacher unions during COVID?

that would be the teaching unions that tried desperately to support their members when every other job out there had some mitigations installed to try and help avoid staff contracting covid. That teachers and school staff were given precisely sod all in mitigations apparently made us lazy good for nothings who didn't care about the vulnerable children.

Urgh. It doesn't matter how many times we told people what was happening, we were ignored, laughed at, professionally villified by people who were working at home in front of zoom for many months - in some cases years - after we went back into our work place.

This is a thread about this specific career though? Why not start a thread about the statistics of your own workplace, no one is saying they have it the worst. Strange thing to get competitive about.

I can assure you that I have extensive experience of academies.

Please back up what you say with evidence- rather than I used to work in 1 Harris academy

@Perfect28

My perception of teachers unions during covid was that they completely misunderstood the risk, (thats being generous) and created an us v them adversarial situation that viewed children and parents as the enemy.

They did not care about children's welfare at all and were happy to sacrifice children's wellbeing in favour of making sure their members didn't have to go to work.

@Navigatingnewwaters

Its not a thread about specific careers

The op compares teaching to other careers

Implying teaching has it worse. People are obviously going to respond saying that's not the case

It's not about being competitive @Navigatingnewwaters. The OP said has said in her following comments that people don't understand how hard teachers have. So a lot of us have commented that we do understand it but that a lot of other industries are not understood, that was me trying to highlight what issues my industry has. Another poster highlighted the issues they have as a lawyer.

Do teachers ever consider the struggles that other industries have? One poster wrote that in their customer service role they had teachers were often rude. It works both ways that we all empathise with the struggles of other people's jobs and respect works both ways!

Sorry but inference and actual statements are different, if someone has stated ‘Teachers have it worse’ then I apologise.

I’m not a teacher and although I work in a school now I have had several other jobs so am aware, I don’t agree that teaching is the hardest job but do agree it can be totally miserable. I didn’t realise that people had said it was the hardest so I apologise if that is the case.

What customer service role?

@Navigatingnewwaters

I'm not sure there is a different way to infer it, although teachers obviously think there is.

If multiple people are inferring the same thing, maybe there's something in it?

This is it, many refused to teach when the pandemic was ongoing or offered very poor provision. They then expect lots of sympathy for poor working conditions I don't see any other profession moaning on MN as much as teachers. I had to keep going to work looking after poorly COVID patients with no PPE at the beginning then poor PPE. I saw a lot of death, I kept going because it's my job. I was bitten last week a full on human bite.

I'm sorry teachers have a shit time but so do many other professions.

Well you seem to be very keen on that being the narrative so have at it I guess 😚

What are your employers doing about your assault?

Look at all the teachers on here that are vehemently in favour of "inclusion" in schools, and then (possible different) teachers complaining about being bullied by pupils in lessons. It doesn't add up. Kick the bad kids that don't want to learn out of schools and the soonest possible opportunity and leave teachers with classes of polite, well-mannered children that actually WANT to learn. This would be the best solution for absolutely everyone involved, yet for some reason "inclusion" is touted as being absolutely essential and cannot be criticised.

There is no evidence. Its a stereotype. Not literal.

But it's a stereotype that resonates with most teachers because they have seen it first hand.

If you go back to my original post I was referencing why the posters friend in her mid 40s was still happy in teaching. And I suggested it could be because the friend has found one of the few schools left that isn't micromanaged and values its staff and has a good work life balance. These schools are now a rarity. Big chain academies are not known for this.

Small MATs are very different from the big chains.

@Navigatingnewwaters

Not really

I'm just not sure what teachers expect tbh.

4 primary heads told me they were leaving in the summer yesterday.

non are at retirement age , unlikely to be able to replace them

something has got to give in the system

No capacity so no further action. I might go into a different role for a quieter life. Anyway I'm pointing out that many jobs have shit times but don't make thread after thread about their working conditions.

In terms of what?

Ah I see, I hope you find something that makes you happy. Not making threads about it is your choice though, you are obviously welcome to and it sounds like it’d be an important read.

@Navigatingnewwaters

In terms of perception

They (yes. I'm generalising, it can't be helped) complain that people think they're always saying they have it worse whilst denying no teacher ever says or implies that.

That perception comes from some where.

So I guess they need to try to figure out why or just ignore it if they don't really care

Telling people they are 100% wrong in their perception is unlikely to work.

People obviously read things differently.

Ime assault and violence in health care is rarely acted upon.

Its just something staff put up with.