To ask if school mum cliques upset you, or how do you deal with cliques?

[facefit]

I'm new to school, my child is in reception. I've noticed that there are cliques forming.

How do you deal with it? Or just completely ignore?

So, any contributions to make?

Stupidsmall fruit, no I was agreeing with you, I have no problems with school mums, and people in general

I agree. I suspect there’s a strong correlation between the groups of people who always imagine they are being excluded and the groups who are always on the look out for “cliquey school gate mums”.

Actively avoid all other parents 😂

I wasn't aware we were talking about racism? Did I miss something?

Why would people making friends, who may support each other through the challenges of raising children, upset me? Or upset anyone?

Such gaslighting on this thread. Obviously it's women being 'silly' about their own experiences.

OP, whether or not you believe in cliques (and I believe you if you are experiencing it) the best way to deal with it is to pretend not to care so hard you end up not caring. Obviously you're not going to repeat any advances you might have made that have been rebuffed/responded to rudely, but you can otherwise be friendly and open and just generally not bothered and then people tend to be drawn to your casual friendliness. I don't think you're mad or looking for school gate cliques for what it's worth. I think you've probably experienced a well known phenomenon of human bonding in groups - excluding perceived outsiders!

It's great most people have a positive experience of the school run. I don't do it every day but when I do; what surprises me is the fact that some mums (parents) can be so blatantly unpleasant. If I am stood right next to a fellow parent at the gates/queue etc. and we see each other regularly; and our DC happen to be in the same class; I would expect a smile/nod/"Good morning" etc. No I do not want to be your bestie. Yes I have a life and friends outside of the school run. But it doesn't cost to be pleasant. This is just politeness and common decency in my opinion.

Well you wouldn't if you snub all the other parents

You need to explain what you mean by cliques? How are they cliques rather than just friendship groups forming?

Apologies @Vulpine!

How are people ‘gaslighting’?

The OP is new to the school, and it’s a new school year. Yet, she thinks ‘cliques’ are forming?

And she won’t come back to actually engage with the thread.

How are people gaslighting?

A whole load of rushing in to declare that cliques don't exist and that anyone who describes experiencing them is anti-mum, over-sensitive, or just wrong.

Of course nobody knows what is happening in the OP's kids playground but interacting with groups of people who seem to be forming groups or sticking in established groups can be tricky. Throw in the happiness/friendships of your kid seeming to depend on your ability to navigate this and that can be a lot of quite unpleasant pressure. There are those who manage to avoid it and those who find it easy and those who simply like to pretend to themselves others intentions are always good/neutral (which works until some nefarious twat communicates that your face doesn't fit).

Funnily enough those people are not prepared to take it easy on the OP and assume she's having a tricky time and is asking for advice. admittedly she seems to have chosen a word that's inflamed debate but I'm not surprised she hasn't come back. Posters have variously suggested she's over sensitive, entitled, & pathetic. She doesn't owe you a fight.

I'll give you an example.. ..i once attended a class assembly. One of the clique members arrived and desperately cast her eyes around the hall to see if the other coven members were there. They weren't. She sat down next to another mum. The mum she sat next to is a lovely woman and started talking to her. Then the rest of the clique rocked up and took their seats. This woman practically tripped over the lovely mum she was talking to in order to go sit with her mates..she didn't even end the conversation properly, just stopped talking and clambered over this poor woman. I was literally open mouthed at the behaviour.

@Mardyface

I think the thing is that some of us know from previous experience that most of this is down to your mindset and the way you approach this. And that approaching it positively is absolutely crucial.

I'm sure there are isolated cases where some school mums gang up against others and if that's genuinely what's happening to OP I'm sure that's very upsetting. But in the vast vast majority of cases what's described as "clique" behaviour is actually just people having friendships which don't include others.

And the reasons this whole narrative bothers some of us are:

a) It reinforces a sense of paranoia and social isolation which is not remotely helpful to the OP (or people in general). What the OP has described is very obviously pretty bog standard social anxiety because her children have just started school. This is daunting but pretty normal and pathologising the way other people react as being "cliquey" makes things far worse for her. The way she acts on this at this point is critical. If she shrugs this off and carries on with as positive a mindset as she can the chances are she will be fine and develop some good relationships. If she retreats into paranoia about "cliques" she is going to make life immeasurably harder for herself and her children.

b) If you're a grown up you have to make peace with the fact that some people won't particularly like you. They don't have to have reasons for this. It just is what it is. If you go around expecting everyone to like you you will always be disappointed when some don't. That's a bad and damaging mindset to hand on to children.

c) There's a whiff of misogyny in the "cliques" narrative. It takes as a starting point the idea that women should all play nice just because they are women. If women form their own independent friendships it is seen as being antisocial. Some of us powerfully want to right to choose our own friends rather than having them foisted on us simply because society dictates that all women should be kind to each other. That's of course not an excuse for unkindness or bullying. But I don't want to go through life having to apologise for choosing like-minded friends or feeling that people will call me "cliquey" because I do so. My friendships are not your problem.

d) Children will ultimately make friends with whoever they like. There's a limit to what adults can do to engineer this.

I have not rtft but I have honestly never understood all this drama about school runs its not something Ive ever witnessed in RL.

Take your kids to school say goodbye, job done!

I think a lot of feelings come in for some people, and not good feelings. They want to make friends, they feel lonely. They want to feel included, they feel envious of those who can make friendships and it leads to a fuck ton of drama in the outsiders head, where as the people being watched are just cracking on and have no idea a small minority are watching on

yes isolated incidents occur but what most folks see as just a group,of folks being friendly some folks see it as something to attack

How nice for you that you could afford to have parties for 30plus children every year for each of your children. Has it occurred to you that most people can't?

I think the difference between friendship groups and cliques is social hierarchy.
All groups are not seen as equally valid, with some considered more desirable to be part of than others.
Often people who speak of being left out of the clique are actually referring to not being part of the social group at the top of the hierarchy, as oppose to total social exclusion.
I think that the 'in crowd' cliques absolutely exclude people whose face doesn't fit. But there are almost always other groups where friendships can be found and cultivated, so the answer really is to stop buying into the heirarchy, hanging on the fringes of the clique feeling upset and rejected, and find your own people.

My thoughts exactly. Just because people make friends and stand together to chat while waiting, doesn't mean they're a clique. I happily chat to anyone who happens to be waiting near me. But naturally I have connected with some Mums more than others and some of them have become real life friends outside of school. We are most definitely not a clique though.

Exactly this BagpussBagpussOldFatFurry Catpuss. And I have just finished reading a thread about how nasty some of the comments on MN have become, and this is a classic example. The OP is clearly not the most confident of people and at my age (I'm 67) I have seen some really nasty cliques at the school gates, along with some very helpful and welcoming groups (and yes, some are cliques and some are not) The OP needs a little kindness and helpfulness, which is why she posted on here. I don't have any words of wisdom for her other than just smile, be polite to the other mums and I am sure everything will be fine, but don't let something which is not a great issue to get you down.

I've always been a bit socially awkward so the mum cliques don't bother me. I smile and say hello to them but I don't try to be part of the clique.
Be friendly and open to a chat if it comes up, but don't worry about it.
You don't have to be best mates with all the mums.

Hear, hear!

And my goodness, I wish Mumsnet would deal with its ever increasing troll problem. There are some people on here who relish in coming on to gaslight, disagree with and upset people.

Exactly. Mumsnet used to be such a great, supportive platform. I've returned after a 5yr break and my goodness! So much hatred. Why can't people just be kind?

Beause being kind is a load of bollocks! #bekind, its just another way of saying be a doormat,make yourself small, don't stand out, don't assert yourself, put yourself out for anyone and everyone to the detriment of yourself.

#bekind is the mantra of the CF who is not kind but likes to take advantage of other peoples kindness. Its the mantra of the nasty person calling everyone else names like Queen Bitch and the like, while pretending to be the wronged party.