Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To this this is NOT the worst time ever to bring a child into the world

240 replies

Celebrityskint · 07/10/2022 23:44

Quite often I see posts going on about today’s world being a terrible world to bring children into... but honestly... in the UK... we’re probably having a very good life compared to most people in most of history.... it’s not a terrible time to bring children into the world

OP posts:
NotJustAnybody · 07/10/2022 23:49

Well, compared to when I had my DS over 10 yrs ago, I'd say it's a pretty awful time for many reasons.

Boxin · 07/10/2022 23:56

Well the effects of climate change are going to make every child born todays life difficult in some ways.

For a great many reasons things are going to be hard but that’s not to say things haven’t been, or aren’t, immensely difficult for many anyway and they still have children.

Cw112 · 07/10/2022 23:56

NotJustAnybody · 07/10/2022 23:49

Well, compared to when I had my DS over 10 yrs ago, I'd say it's a pretty awful time for many reasons.

It is however better than when we had the bubonic plague? So I guess it's all dependent on what your reference point is? I think each era has had its challenges and people have had to parent through those challenges.

NotVeryHopefulBeenHereB4 · 07/10/2022 23:57

I remember a thread like this during the pandemic. It mainly consisted of people who had already had their children years before calling people who were ttc and/or having fertility issues selfish and irresponsible for trying to have babies in this cruel, dystopian modern world that didn't exist when they had their child.

Catonamountain · 07/10/2022 23:58

Climate change is going to affect any children born now in a very direct way so yes and no in answer to the question

Original poster
Celebrityskint · 07/10/2022 23:59

NotVeryHopefulBeenHereB4 · 07/10/2022 23:57

I remember a thread like this during the pandemic. It mainly consisted of people who had already had their children years before calling people who were ttc and/or having fertility issues selfish and irresponsible for trying to have babies in this cruel, dystopian modern world that didn't exist when they had their child.

It’s just nuts. Honestly, the world is no worse than it was in the past: there has always been unpleasantness and illness and death... child mortality rate is tiny in the Uk compared to 100 years ago. It’s rare for women to die in childbirth.

OP posts:
bigbeautifulmonster · 08/10/2022 00:07

I find comments about it being a bad time to bring in kids quite offensive. Mum of two young ones here. I'm not ashamed to say that I'm glad to have given them life. Yeah things at the moment are shit and the future is bleak in many ways but it obviously didn't stop me. Is that selfish?

figtrees · 08/10/2022 00:12

I think the difference compared to years ago is that back then women literally had no choice. Contraceptives weren't available so no matter how bad it got there were people having babies.

Now it's harder to justify as it can be easily prevented, or held off until things are better or personal situations improve etc. Having a baby is a selfish act, no matter how it's framed a baby only exists because the mother wanted one. Nobody else in the world minds if she does or doesnt have choldren (bar pressure from husband or immediate family who have their own equally selfish wants). The resulting baby, gets no say in the matter and there's no promise of what the world will be like when they start to understand it.

I can certainly see why lots of people are thinking very very carefully before they decide what's best for their situation.

NotVeryHopefulBeenHereB4 · 08/10/2022 00:13

bigbeautifulmonster · 08/10/2022 00:07

I find comments about it being a bad time to bring in kids quite offensive. Mum of two young ones here. I'm not ashamed to say that I'm glad to have given them life. Yeah things at the moment are shit and the future is bleak in many ways but it obviously didn't stop me. Is that selfish?

No, it's not selfish. People who have older children or adult children that complain about this are utter hypocrites and, quite frankly, bellends.

The world was not some wonderful paradise free from war, disease, or climate change issues 10 or even 20 years ago.

NotVeryHopefulBeenHereB4 · 08/10/2022 00:16

figtrees · 08/10/2022 00:12

I think the difference compared to years ago is that back then women literally had no choice. Contraceptives weren't available so no matter how bad it got there were people having babies.

Now it's harder to justify as it can be easily prevented, or held off until things are better or personal situations improve etc. Having a baby is a selfish act, no matter how it's framed a baby only exists because the mother wanted one. Nobody else in the world minds if she does or doesnt have choldren (bar pressure from husband or immediate family who have their own equally selfish wants). The resulting baby, gets no say in the matter and there's no promise of what the world will be like when they start to understand it.

I can certainly see why lots of people are thinking very very carefully before they decide what's best for their situation.

I get what you are saying and of course people should think carefully before deciding, but if everyone held off having kids until things got better there would simply be no kids.

Luredbyapomegranate · 08/10/2022 00:22

There are plenty of times that would have been worse in so many ways.

Climate change though..

Chloefairydust · 08/10/2022 00:24

I agree OP, things seem to worsen with every generation and with climate change, living costs rising, wages not meeting inflation etc the future does look a bit doom and gloom. I think though people will continue to reproduce and bring more children in the world without much thought about what they are actually bringing them into.

Life is hard, and children don’t consent to being born. I don’t know if it’s morally right or not to bring more children into such a shit world… It’s definitely food for thought isn’t it … 😕

QuitWhileAhead · 08/10/2022 00:27

I don't think my adult kids are planning on having kids and Im secretly quite relieved.

Having kids to worry about can be stressful at the best of times so how people who are facing financial ruin from energy and mortgage rises at the moment are going to cope is beyond me.

HighlandPony · 08/10/2022 00:28

I’ve only ever heard this crap from Americans who think world = US. Everyone I know just gets on with life. There were babies born during world wars for the love of Christ.

wreckame · 08/10/2022 00:33

Celebrityskint · 07/10/2022 23:59

It’s just nuts. Honestly, the world is no worse than it was in the past: there has always been unpleasantness and illness and death... child mortality rate is tiny in the Uk compared to 100 years ago. It’s rare for women to die in childbirth.

Show quote history

The difference to me is not about the present, it's about the future.

Plenty of things made living difficult at various times in the past, but at no time before now was humanity as a whole engaged in doggedly sticking to ways of living that science had clearly shown were going to render the Earth itself gradually more and more uninhabitable.

A child born today will probably have a better infancy than many of previous generations. But they're much more likely than previous generations to grow old in an inhumane climate-induced dystopia. If they get to grow old at all.

Asparagoose · 08/10/2022 00:37

We are facing nuclear war and possibly the extinction of humanity. So no it isn’t a good time to have kids. If I didn’t have them already I would choose not to have any. When I had my kids there was peace, food, energy, no disease, medical and dental care were easily accessible, schools were reliably open… how the world has deteriorated in just a few years! Now we’re looking at either freezing to death, being blown up or dying of radiation sickness.

Original poster
Celebrityskint · 08/10/2022 00:39

I think the chance of many people freezing to death, dying of radiation sickness or being blown up is actually pretty small.

OP posts:
MrsHughesPinny · 08/10/2022 00:40

If I was having mine now I wouldn’t have them. The future looks pretty bleak for the planet and for future generations. I wouldn’t encourage my DC to have children.

Hilarymantelspencilsharpener · 08/10/2022 00:42

I'd probably wait until the Ukraine situation is sorted. Maybe.

Asparagoose · 08/10/2022 00:43

Celebrityskint · 08/10/2022 00:39

I think the chance of many people freezing to death, dying of radiation sickness or being blown up is actually pretty small.

Thousands will freeze to death over the next couple of winters. And according to the news we’re just waiting for Putin to nuke us.

Original poster
Celebrityskint · 08/10/2022 00:43

Are people really, genuinely thinking that Putin will nuke us?

OP posts:
findingsomeone · 08/10/2022 00:47

bigbeautifulmonster · 08/10/2022 00:07

I find comments about it being a bad time to bring in kids quite offensive. Mum of two young ones here. I'm not ashamed to say that I'm glad to have given them life. Yeah things at the moment are shit and the future is bleak in many ways but it obviously didn't stop me. Is that selfish?

People like to be smug arseholes on here and piss on other people's chips. Men doing so to women is covered a lot, but I think women actually treat other women pretty terribly too.

If someone is having a fifth child at a cost of their other four ie. Is struggling to meet the first four's needs in various ways I can understand claims of selfishness. But not for people who can at least look after their own children's basic needs for the foreseeable. I think that's about all you can do. If those with children really care about the planet and economy hopefully they'll pop off to Dignatas long before their time so as to relieve the burden on all of our children working hard to lay off government debt and support the triple lock that never seems to budge.

Lovethatforyou · 08/10/2022 00:49

Stressful thread for those of us with small children :(

findingsomeone · 08/10/2022 00:51

Lovethatforyou · 08/10/2022 00:49

Stressful thread for those of us with small children :(

I think some of the posts are quite nasty tbh. As if raising small children isn't hard enough. And from fellow women too who obviously are infallible and did everything just right. Plus a darn lot of us with small children conceived them before war on Ukraine and covid, but no, let's making all parents of smalls feel like utter selfish bastards.

FTLOG9 · 08/10/2022 00:57

Historically there are worse times and places to bring a child into the world, I think one thing that makes it different now is that conception is a choice, and not an inevitability of sex (if fertile) and secondly we know so much more than we used to. Our worlds used to be so much smaller. We used to live in much more challenging practical conditions but much less challenging social ones (in my opinion). I think people who say that they wouldn't bring kids into the world are speaking from a place of fear and that they are forgetting how strong many peoples urge to procreate. I think the fear is understandable but also no one should make decisions like this based on fear. We all know where that leads us.