Why do you think the highest suicide rate of all is of men approaching 50?

[RR64]

Why do you think the highest suicide rate of all is of nen approaching 50?

Surely this needs to be addressed?

Well, women too! We’re all like demented caged animals that don’t see enough green and get enough fresh air.

Fine then, blatantly I am wrong and bringing men up with the expectations that they were raised with in the 70s is completely unrelated 🙄

what do you mean? You sound very defeatist and touchy given this is a debate.

I think that might be that they've (dentists) more access to the means?
Though, looking here:

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/articles/suicidebyoccupation/england2011to2015#suicide-by-occupation-among-males

the common factor seems less well paid?

Interesting @NoMoreLifts

Definitely seems to be skilled trades and elementary occupations but it's difficult to say whether the jobs bear any relationship or if it's coincidental.

If you bring boys up with the inherent belief that they are better, stronger, cleverer and more deserving of recognition and success then surely they are more likely to crash spectacularly if these things go wrong

in other words: Toxic Masculinity

PP mentioned that women in their 50s start to become more confident etc. Well, for a lot of them it's the time when they have finished with the children stuff, and have realised that actually they DGAF what people think of them etc etc. And if seeing newly confident women sends men into such a spiral of despair and depression that suicide seems the better option? is that for women to fix?

all the lazy "this is mn they hate men they always blame the patriarchy" - first bollocks. but if it were: they're not wrong, are they?

Which sex and age group would you prefer to have the highest rate instead, OP?

But men in their late 40s don’t really care about women in their 50s. Their girlfriends/wives are likely to still be stuck in that childcare/housework cycle.

How else do you explain the fact male suicide rates were much higher when men were ‘king of the castle’ and sunk pints at the pub every night because ‘kids are women’s stuff’?

Well, maybe people above 90? To answer your flippant question with an equally flippant answer. At least there would be fewer years ‘lost’.

Was coming on to say this. More women are also diagnosed with depression. It's not like men are living lives of quiet desperation while women are skipping through an utopian dreamworld.

Just if you jump off a bridge or shoot yourself in the face you're more likely to die than if you take an overdose of pills.

Dp is a tradie, substance abuse like alcohol and cocaine is high, gambling, relationship breakdown. He has 2 friends who confess to hidden debt and a daily cocaine habit. They're on it all day every day, their wives are oblivious.
Depression rates are high unsurprisingly.

I read some bizarre stuff on here and this definitely has a place up there.

This ^

What's with the widespread assumption that it's men who are predominately suffering from depression and suicidal tendencies, when it's clear from the statistics that it's the opposite?

Debt. Divorce. A sense of failure. A sense of having let children down.

Shooting isn't particularly the issue in UK though.

Not being diagnosed doesn't mean they don't have. It can mean that they are less likely to seek treatment.

The OP asked for an opinion not a debate. I gave my opinion. Honestly I have way better things to spend my time and energy debating than this subject. You appear to want to be right, so go to it

Not much talk about friendship here. Or lack of.

It's very difficult as a man to make friends on your 40s. For the last 6 years I've played cricket with a bunch of other men. In that time I've learned next to nothing about them. The only allowed topics are cricket and small talk.

Almost all my good friends (ie people I can open up to) are female, which creates issues if you're male and married.

So a man who hasn't been able to carry forward friendships from his younger years can very easily get isolated.

From a BBC article:

Men may also choose these methods because they’re more intent on completing the act. One study of more than 4,000 hospital patients who had engaged in self-harm found, for example, that the men had higher levels of suicidal intent than the women.

You don't need data, after all with a bit of searching you can probably find stats to support whatever you want to believe. Just remember that here on mumsnet all men are violent rapists/abusers/paedophile or potentially so.

A very silly suggestion.

The ‘depressed, emotional, openly down’ types tend not to commit suicide in my experience. It’s men who ‘never mentioned a thing’ before doing it. Usually with a catalyst event rather than just ‘life being chronically shit’.

About the 'boys don't cry' thing, ie, men bottle up their emotions until they get too much:

I'm not sure this is really true any more. Not in the way it used to be. Men do cry - but my observation is that it's dangerous to do so and doesn't necessarily result in any support.

I would agree with that. My DH's mental health has significantly improved since finding a mens group where the men get together and talk about their feelings, the world and the way changes impact them, their relationships, their mental health etc.

Before that I would say he was bordering on depression. Now, he is in a much better place and honestly I would say it has saved our marriage.

If you feel in the need of a group Tom, please PM me and I would be happy to point you in the direction for this group, its all on zoom so location isnt an issue

hmmm... MN just destroyed my msg. Anyway ...

Men have long had higher suicide rates. They don't attempt suicide more than women, but they do succeed at suicide more than women. This is mostly down to methods: blokes choose more effective methods. More likely to choose sudden blunt trauma and women are more likely to choose something that is slow-acting and has higher chance they might be saved. Suicide is being addressed, along with a lot of other things to worry about.

Thank you so much for this programme. I’m going to use it in my lessons.