Why do you think the highest suicide rate of all is of men approaching 50?

[RR64]

Why do you think the highest suicide rate of all is of nen approaching 50?

Surely this needs to be addressed?

I agree with @NOTANUM . In my experience of observing the men around me of that age bracket, one thing they all seem to have in common is that they realise they are no longer young, virile and 'top of the social pecking order' as it were, and struggle to adjust. Several of the ones I know are very angry and feel threatened by men 20 or so years younger than them and struggle to understand or elaborate on why that is.

I agree with this.

Such good points. If only men would confide in each other they'd realise it's a normal progression

Financial woes, lack of support/friends, an unwillingness to seek help which escalated into poorer MH. Women struggle with menopause but in general they do talk to each other and there’s more information in general etc.

@RR64 really?if you can find the statistic did you not google the rationale/thats prob not what the word id in this sense
why do you think?

Testosterone dropping and creating an imbalance.

I wonder how much it corellates with things like unrmployment.
I remember a programme years ago from deprived communities and the men were mentioning things like feeling absolutely useless and at some points suicidal because they couldn't take care of their families like they were supposed to etc.

Everyone has some societal pressures which they battle.

I think as others have said, there is often seperation and divorce, not being able to afford to take on another mortgage after divorce, maybe having to move back with ageing parents, not being able to have their kids to stay, financial problems, mid life crisis. All kinds of reasons I guess. And as other have highlighted men often don't have the same close support networks.

If you google it, a really well put together briefing from the samaritans comes up 'samaritans suicide research briefing'
Where it states that women attempt suicide more, men just choose more lethal methods.
There is of course suspicion that men are less likely to report an attempt, women's attempts are seen more as attention seeking so wont be categorised as a 'serious' attempt, but i find it really interesting that the prevailing narrative in this country is that male suicide is a crisis.
Personally i think this 'more lethal methods' is the key - as noted by a PP, women are more likely to have caring responsibilities - be a single parent, be caring for elderly relatives etc - 'more lethal methods' for the most part equal = messy and horrible for someone to find. And its not a stretch to imagine that women would shy away from these methods even at rock bottom due to societal conditioning, being concerned about who would find then as they are likely to be missed quicker.
The other really interesting thing in that was that biggest correlating factors - bereavement and divorce were highest in men, whereas self harm, mood disorders and domestic violence were for womem, despite women also suffering bereavement and divorce.
Again, the lack of self reporting will factor in, Another way we let down men and boys by not encouraging them to be able to talk about their emotions. I find it interesting that the media try and create this 'there's a war on men causing a suicide crisis' but dont report that women attempt more, and that domestic violence is a factor?

I am surprised how many people do "but women" here. We all know what happens when post is about women and someone says "but men"...
Media can talk about suicide rates in men without doing "but women". Actually they should..same way like they should talk about women's issues without "but men"

@InCheesusWeTrust , you can't really ask why the rate of male suicide is so high, without discussing women. Likewise more boys manage to kill themselves than girls. There's a sex bias, so both sexes have to be compared. Lack of involvement in family life/feeling isolated is a recurring factor. That's quite easy to fix.

I completely take your point here, after being irritated time and time again by seeing domestic violence against women discussions getting derailed by 'but men get hit too'
However, it is relevant - we are asking why men succeed more - the answer is patriarchal conditioning, and it becomes necessary to mention women in that.

Very good post and exactly how i feel actually.

This age coincides with when they have hormonal changes that can lead to depression.

I take that points.

They tend to have a really tough time. Divorce often means they lose everything and in most cases the woman keeps home, furnishings and they have to start again from scratch (not always obviously). They have often worked full time since leaving education and not taken any breaks and then poof off it walks.

Wow. More men die by suicide in this age group but more women ATTEMPT it so that’s the real tragedy?! People actually dying is less to people trying… riiiiight.

Maybe the read all the hatred for middle aged men on MN?

It's a key transition for them as it is for women, career opportunities reduce, children gone/going, long relationships drifting/ending, parents ill or dying, but men aren't allowed to feel these things the way women do.

• Loneliness.
• Financial pressures.
• The societal pressure of male stereotype to be the breadwinner/rock.
• Poor emotional education.
• Undiagnosed health issues.
• Work:life balance.
• The "Is this it?" of late middle-life when you realise that most of your managers are younger than you, and you're not going to progress much further in your career if you stay where you are and doing what you do - but see Pressure of Being the Breadwinner that stops you doing something different.

And some of these combine in ways that are greater than the sum of the parts. If you identify primarily as all the stereotypes of maleness, you can end up with your emotional foundations resting entirely on your relationship. Anything that threatens that threatens to kicks the blocks from the bottom of an emotional Jenga pile.

A neighbour took his life two years ago. I didn't know him, they'd only moved in a couple of months earlier just as we all went into lockdown. I heard his wife's scream when they found him. He had a lot of friends, but apparently no one to talk to on difficult matters other than his wife. And it's thought he believed he was letting her and the family down when the business dropped off due to lockdown.

The balance to these negative stereotypes can be seen in typical "male" activities. It's been said by the founder of the Men's Shed movement that women talk face-to-face and men talk shoulder-to-shoulder. And I think you can see this in activities such as fishing, golf, or going to the football match. Whenever a thread comes up where there's a complaint that DH works 8-6 Mon-Fri and then clears off every Saturday afternoon for "his hobby", I wonder to what extent it's being underestimated how important that hobby might be for DH's emotional wellbeing.

I won’t win any friends for saying this, but there’s been a prevailing narrative for the past few years that white straight men of a certain age are to blame for all the ills in society. Got a good, well paid job? You didn’t get it by working hard or being good at what you do - it was pure privilege.

Try telling someone made redundant at 50 trying to find a new job that they’ve got it easy. Will your experience be valued? Or will you come up against the desire for ‘fresh ideas’ - and crucially, fresh faces? It must be pretty soul-destroying to be told the hard work you thought was valuable is actually a problem that prevents people from different backgrounds getting opportunities; that the challenge is getting people like you out of the way. I know I’d feel pretty useless.

I have a few men in my life I suspect may be suicidal and they are 50+. Of course I offer my support but ultimately I can't watch over them 24/7. I am worried about them.
One has been through a very acrimonious divorce. He has full custody of the children as the mother is unfortunately abusive with drug misuse problems. He has his own mental health issues. He has now additional work problems. Children are acting up, understandably. It's all too much.

Another man lives in a house share, has a gambling problem. Never had children, no partner, siblings and parents all dead, health is playing up, zero hour contract agency jobs, permanently skint.

I think suicide is a social problem. The whole construction of what makes self worth or a life worth living is very materialistic and toxic.

It makes me feel incredibly sad that someone has reached the absolute depths of despair to think that they're better off dead, whatever age or sex they are.
A lot of middle aged men are old school stuff upper lip and most of the time that leads to suicide or suicidal thoughts.
It's the age bracket where to show emotion is to show weakness and to show weakness is to show failure.
In other words, keep the emotions squashed down, until of course, they can't be squashed any further and the worse case scenario happens.
A typical example is with my own, now adult son. When he was around five, he fell over and hurt himself, obviously he started crying. My mother who was with us at the time told him to stop crying because ' boys don't cry'.
Well, my son's will cry all they want mother!
It's that attitude that causes problems further down the line.
Shove your stuff upper lip where the sun doesn't shine!
If you're the mothers of sons, encourage them to be open emotionally. I'm not saying turn them into wet lettuces, but teach them that it's ok to say they feel sad, frightened, upset, lonely and hurt.

And to ask for help when they're struggling.
Stop the shame.

IME isolation and loneliness, especially following divorce or bereavement, is a key factor for this group. Lack of social networks, lack of emotional outlets, difficulty articulating feelings, embarrassment/humiliation at feeling lost or unable to cope. Often the SO will have been the sole confidante and provider of emotional support, which is less often the case for women. A separation or divorce can feel like a burden lifted for a woman, whereas for many men it’s a loss of the scaffolding that holds them up.

Women do significantly better at managing alone after the loss of a partner, perhaps because we are generally more socially networked and well supported, and because talking about emotions is not regarded as a ‘weakness’.

I really hope this dynamic will shift for future generations of men. DS’s age group (20s) are definitely much more open and well informed about mental health, constantly check in on one another, hug freely and without embarrassment, support each other really constructively in times of crisis. As a result I hope the statistics for men in both high risk age groups will improve significantly over time.

Just to add.....
How many of us women use our friends or female relatives as sounding boards when things aren't going right for us.
How many of us have got through boxes of tissues and cups of tea while crying on their shoulders.
Short answer, literally all of us.
Not something you see many men doing with their friends, mainly for reasons I outlined in my last post.
I'll work my way through a box of tissues while watching a sad film. My DH will go into the kitchen and make a cuppa. I can see the tears in his eyes and I can hear him sniffling in the kitchen, but you won't find him sharing that box of tissues because ' men don't cry'.