To ask what people have against Labour?

[TheSmallestOneWasMadeline]

I have come across lots of people who, even while admitting that the Conservatives are far from ideal, seem to scrunch their nose up and say 'but, ew, Labour' when talking about politics.

I have to admit I dont understand what it is that people think is so terrible about them and nobody ever cares to elaborate! I always vote for them as I think their principles align pretty closely with my own even if I don't agree with absolutely e everything they stand for.

Could someone please explain what people think is so terrible about them that they would do a worse job at running the country than the Conservatives have done?

Yes, I know the definition of bourgoisie. I am saying that if the party were a person, that is the kind of person it would be.

Ex Labour voter. I just couldn’t never vote for a party that denies biological reality - I mean come on it’s just basic safeguarding.

To have grown grown adults telling me that men are women if they say they are - just no.

But fascinating to see the poll results …

Though obviously spelling it is more of a challenge for me....

The thread is about what people have against Labour. Which includes why people support the Tories.

You’re also never going to get the perfect party. Having a publicly owned energy company actually is better for poorer people. Having stronger public services is better for poorer people. Having a better funded NHS is better for working people.

There are people in the public sector who vote Tory. And who are entirely in line with your views. Labour voters don't tend to notice them as they remain silent when labour are going on about the 'hateful' Tory government. 20 years ago or so people felt more comfortable about their politics in these settings. But it's not possible anymore with the many right think labour shouters.

Typo NOT entirely in line with your views.

The public sector should exist to serve the tax-paying public.

The other question is 'who is left in the public sector' ? All the strikes I am seeing at the moment are in the private sector.* *

I was quite clearly responding to that poster's assertion that the crisis just happened to the government, rather than being entirely of their own making.

Of course the polls can change, but a shower of incompetents lurching from one disaster to another are not likely to suddenly turn things around before the next election.

@hattie43 you do know that Miriam Margoyles IS Jewish?

I'm not making that error, but in a society like ours where we don't offer an authoritarian option on voting slips, a strong right-wing leader is about as close as you get. That's not to say that authoritarianism is the monopoly of the right. I'm sure a lot of the woke bros of Momentum had the authoritarian disposition. Not me, I'm a boring old just-left-of centrist who is hated by everyone. But it's useful to know that many Tories are born, not made.

This is a fascinating half hour programme in which social psychologist Karen Stenner explains the authoritarian disposition.
www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000y7sq

For all I know Truss understands this. I only raise it to draw attention to the fact that some people will vote for a 'strong man' candidate even when it's clear that it's going to be a disaster. It was part of the appeal of Brexit.

Not particularly. That was labours job. Labour failed and continues to do so. Because it's been subjected to a takeover.

I have 2 DC at private school, Labour will put VAT on the fees, which means I’ll have to take them out, probably whilst DS is mid GCSE’s. They won’t get my vote whilst DC are still at school.

But school fees are going to rise regardless, or have yours remained static over the years ?

www.thenationalnews.com/world/uk-news/2022/06/13/uk-private-schools-fees-to-rocket-in-face-of-storm-of-pressures/

@DuckBilledFattypus yes of course there are public sector workers who vote conservative. But mostly I imagine not from the school of thought that supports tax cuts for the rich and cuts to benefits. There is a more moderate tory position, but it hasn't been well represented on this thread. If you work on the frontline you are likely to know from your own lived experience that some of the views on here (of the 'people living it up on benefits' line) are complete bollocks.

But Labour is committed to renationalising some privatised industries. That's not something a bourgeois party would do. The bourgeoisie make and keep money for themselves. They are the fat-cat bankers, the city brokers, the captains of industry, the people who own land and whatever's on it. They are what the Labour Party despises.

This is an example of the type of blinkered self interest that causes such rage and mockery from the left.

Because they hate the middle class. I truly believe that even more people will be poorer. Or all equally poor. We already paid high enough taxes and they’re thinking of taxing more. We can’t hardly cope with the expenses even as high earners and they want to take more and tax homeowners too. KS may well be given the boot and the radicals will take over. They not there are not many changes to begin with someone like Corbyn so they will make the most in case they get elected. I cringe at Sadiq Khan, Emma Dent C, David Lammy and Angela Raymer with all their hate and resentment. They would be as corrupted as the current government and be excused by the thugs of momentum. I distrust Human right lawyers as politicians. Nationalising companies like the energy company worries me. There is not trust in politicians but people want to give them more power by nationalising companies. It can go very wrong. I see how the democrats get away with things that are unbelievable hypocritical and I can see that happening here socially and economically.

How I’ve always seen this.

One Labour policy you’re not in line with - ‘They don’t represent me!’

Labour is a broad church. Working class, middle class lefties, centre left, left left.

Tory are more rich and wealthy, aspirational Tories (Not rich but values lie with the Tory party), what else?

Most parents would worry about moving dc during GSCE, wouldn’t you?

Besides it’s a terrible policy that drags people down rather than builds things up. Blair was good at avoiding that. Starmer isn’t unfortunately.

Also.

Tory voters when Labour’s done wrong.
“How dare they, terrible Labour!”

Tory voters when the Tory’s have done wrong
”All these parties are as bad as each other”

@pompei8309 @walkingonsunshinekat "Answer the Q first, should the children be made homeless because the parents cannot afford the rent?"

Yes... If the period notice is served they should find cheaper accommodation they can afford. Life isn't free.

Should I be able to take food from Tesco's for free if my kids are hungry and I can't afford food?

Should I be able to take food from Tesco's for free if my kids are hungry and I can't afford food?

You could go to one of the thousands of food banks ?

If you work on the frontline you are likely to know from your own lived experience that some of the views on here (of the 'people living it up on benefits' line) are complete bollocks

It's a mixed bag. Many people need a hand up so they can become more independent and move on with their lives. And some do just take, demand more, and refuse to help themselves. Because they don't think they need to. It's representative of the population isnt it.

No Marsha I actually think people should take a broader view. The current government is serving the majority of people badly. It's likely that a labour government would help the majority of people a bit more. Possibly the OP might not be one of them, but she might be glad to see others lifted out of poverty. This is the whole crux of why people on the left sneer at those on the right - when they can't seem to care for anyone outside their own front door.

Yes, keep that up edwinbear and you'll turn me back into a Labour voter!

Yes point taken. But you are talking about a minority of people on benefits. This shouldn't be the narrative.